To think that most children are not feral and abusive?

[pointythings]

I was just at the Barnardo's survey that seemed to suggest that 49% of us think that all children are feral, violent and abusive. Who on earth did they ask?

The absolutely vast majority of the kids I see around me are absolutely fine, no different from the kind of children I grew up with, and we have some really deprived families in my area.

Who are these people who hate children so much?

[squeakytoy]

I wonder if they were standing outside a McDonalds at half term, or the school gates at kicking out time... if so, I can understand where they got their statistics from.

Any figures can be manipulated to suit the researchers agenda.

[EightiesChickOrTreat]

YANBU. I was aghast to hear this on the radio this morning. The worst bit was I think that 25% of the respondents think that there is 'no hope' for badly behaved children over the age of 10. What do they recommend should be done with all these wastes of space? Euthanasia? Life imprisonment on a desert island.

No doubt about it, what with youth unemployment and all it's a shit time to be young.

[manicbmc]

Did they do their survey via the Daily M**l?

I work in school, and while there are a few ferals in there, most of them are lovely.

[pointythings]

EightiesChick my older DD is 10. She is lovely, just starting to turn into a teenager with hormones, and she changes so much so quickly - how can anyone think that a 10YO can't change with the right help and support?

And yes, there are a few ferals, I won't deny that. One of them is in DD1's class and he ruins things for everyone - but at the same time he has rubbish parents and is getting sod-all help. I wouldn't be giving up on the likes of him.

[albertcamus]

The school where I teach is in a relatively 'poor' area for the county (Home Counties). It's traditionally been the 'dumping ground' of its town (pop 80 000) and has higher than local & national average SEN etc etc.

I've been there for 8 years and have taught, on average, 300 students per year.

I can only remember:

1 violent psychopath (expelled, then went on to commit manslaughter at 18)
1 obvious psychopath (he was expelled after violent assaults on a student & a staff member)
10 students over the years whom I would have gladly expelled if I had the power

ALL the rest are manageable, and varying degrees of intelligent, sociable, keen/desperate to please, helpful, public-spirited, supportive to each other, devoted to their families, respectful, grateful and appreciative of any time, resources, effort & commitment we give them.

I have taken groups to seven countries over the years, hosted visits from overseas to our town, frequently take them to London & generally encourage them to value themselves and prove to the people who regard all young people as trouble-makers that they are, 99% of the time wrong ...

Don't get me started on the treatment they receive in this country, though, especially from the older generation :(

[manicbmc]

This is true. It is great when you see an out of control 8 year old blossom into a sensible year 6, with the right support.

[EightiesChickOrTreat]

It's writing off a whole generation. Very worrying. I mostly come into contact with younger kids, and I generally find that even the badly-behaved ones calm down and become pretty personable if you talk to them like human beings. But the survey seems to have spoken to a lot of people who have no wish to go within 50 yards of any children at all.

[Onemorning]

YANBU.

It saddens me that kids today face this level of hostility.

[JustRedbin]

Could it be because a lot of parents see their children as a source of income rather than a responsibility that needs to be nurtured?

[usualsuspect]

could it be attitudes like yours Justredbin?

[perplexedpirate]

I was going to reply to justredbin, but actually I can't be arsed. I'm just going to writhe around in the hoards of cash I got when DH and I rethought our entire careers to have DS.
Mwa ha ha hpffft, sorry, a fifty went in my mouth.
Big massive

[JustRedbin]

Please explain usualsuspect?

[manicbmc]

Because we all get soooo much in benefits which makes it all worthwhile pushing out an few extra kids.

Some of the 'feral' kids I know are not the ones who live on the crap estate down the road but the pfbs who have everything and are never pulled up on their behaviour.

[Stupify64]

I work in a benefit office & see what JustRed means on a daily basis, but I also think that in part the media have a role in this. Strictest Parents, Suppernanny etc give a skewed idea of what children are like.

That said I uprooted the family from London to Surrey because I didn't want mine being mugged for their £10 Woolworths phone on the way home.

[Morloth]

YANBU, most of the kids I know, both here and in the UK seem fine to me.

Just kids.

Lots of older people seem to have it in for teenagers in particular. The ones I know are lovely, often PITAs to their parents but on the whole suite normal human beings.

[Sirzy]

I wonder how much contact those who responded to this survey have with children (or children other than there own?) im guessing not much?

I also wonder what responsibility as adults they are taking for changing things for the young people in society? Perhaps if more of the adults who are so quick to judge young people actually got out there and did something to help not only would there perceptions change but also it can help change lives for the young people who do struggle for whatever reason.

[inmysparetime]

I have been studying this perception as part of my degree course, some of it stems from a lack of community cohesion (people see generic youths, not their neighbour's children)
Also, places to play are increasingly designed for young children, or built on, and youth clubs have had their funding cut.
Young people often gather in streets simply because they have nowhere else to go.
I can see how those who perceive young people as "feral" would find groups of them on the street menacing, but it doesn't take much to explode those myths, only a little understanding on both sides, and a willingness to change perceptions.

[gorionine]

YANBU

I think the problem nowadays is that people have stopped seing children as little persons who still have to learn about a lot of things and do not necessarely get everything right the first time. I have also noticed that adults tend to give intentions to a child that only an adult would have and no excuse/allowance for inexperience is given to them.

As an example, Ds2 in his early days in nursery said to his teacher "woman can you do my laces please?" and she came to see me at the end of the session to let me know she had to tell him off and ask me if I though it was fine for a little boy to talk like that to his teacher as it was inapropriate and sexist! When I asked DS why he said it that way he answered " I could not remember her name and she IS a woman" He had absolutely no idea why she was so cross with him.

When it comes from a person actually working with very young children and who should have a better understanding of their abilities, it give little hope that people who have far less contact with children to have a more positive attitude to them.

I think it is ver sad.

[soandsosmummy]

YANBU I was really saddened by this I live in one of our big cities with some very wealthy parts and some that fall into the smallest 10% of the population and I've never felt threatened or surrounded by "feral and abusive" children anywhere. Certainly there are a small minority who may be described as such in all the areas but the vast majority are respectful, helpful and just want to make the best of their lives.

For example last year I got lost on an estate with an especially bad reputation. I admit to feeling mildly intimidated as a group of teenage boys came towards me but it turned out they'd noticed I appeared lost and wanted to help me find my way (interestingly they asked me if I was a social worker and as soon as I said I wasn't they attitude became very friendly!)

time for certain members of the population to look byond the hoodies and baseball caps and see the children beneath them.

[manicbmc]

Pmsl Is your ds Stewie Griffin

I've seen 'those' families in benefit offices. But then most people don't drag their whole family down there when they need to go, so you're probably not seeing a full and fair cross section of people on benefits.

My dd was aghast at what went on in the job centre but I had no choice but to take her as we were on our way somewhere else. And it was the adults she was shocked at, not the kids.

[soandsosmummy]

sorry smallest should say poorest (am supervising our new kitten at same time and not paying the attention I should!)

[manicbmc]

I'm also in a large city in an area with one of the highest unemployment rates in the country.

[albertcamus]

manic agree with your earlier comment re. PITA PFB MC kids vs 'WC' - I know which I prefer to have in my classes !

[SmellslikeDEMONcatspee]

99.9999% of kids are lovely IMO
It is the ones who are nasty little brats, usually due to ineffective parenting that stick in your head though.

I live near-ish a so called rough estate, we sometimes go to the 'local' shop there which is normally surrounded by teens in hoddies etc, they have no where else to go and most houses now are too small to cope with more than 2-3 lanky teens.

9 times out of 10 they ignore me and I'm so away with the fariys I don't notice them. When I do I say Hello, and they always seem shocked that an adult would say Hello.

[cory]

I believe that survey was partly a knee-jerk reaction to the riots. People have very short memories and have already forgotten that there were also riots in the 90s, 80s,70s etc etc.

But there does seem to be a high level of acceptance of hostile attitudes towards the young in this country: a shopkeeper in e.g. Sweden who put up a sign saying that only x no of children at a time/no unaccompanied children are allowed in his shop would shortly find himself without adult customers. It would be like putting up a sign that no unaccompanied blacks or only x no of blacks are allowed and trying to justify it by pointing out that black people are statistically more likely to be involved in crime. People would just think it was sick. But it is very common here.