A meek ponderance from a lurker

[washnomore]

I watched the porn documentary linked on the other thread. I found it very disturbing.

However there's obviously a big market for porn and I know both men and women are into it. I wonder if there might be a place for some sort of ethical porn, where people are not coerced or abused and there's a guarantee of proper treatment of those involved?

I know that doesn't address all the other arguments against porn but perhaps it would go some way towards ensuring the safety of those involved?

Sorry if this seems like a stupid point to make. I don't know much about this stuff but was rocked by that film.

[BitOfFunnyBunny]

There is porn along those lines- SpringChickenGoldBrass knows what the links are, as I've seen her talk about it before.

[msrisotto]

Hi washnomore,

Ethical porn is an ideal. I think homemade porn can come close to it, however the problem is the context. I just don't think in he society we live in, where women are abused and objectified so routinely, that it is possible in this context.

[washnomore]

Morning folks.

I take the point about objectifying. I think it's a difficult one because surely that's very subjective and contextual?

In terms of policing, perhaps independent observers or some sort of accreditation ... I dunno, it would have to have good uptake within the industry to work, so it would have to be cheap and simple. Is there any sort of union for porn workers which could organise or administer a scheme like that?

[washnomore]

I don't know about that. My profession is self-regulated and it works well. But then the majority want to uphold our good reputation ...

Like I say I don't know much about this stuff

[washnomore]

So is there no union then?

[JaneS]

washnomore, thanks for posting this, it's really interesting. It's really sad to hear what SGM says, too.

[washnomore]

I'm not talking about safe meat though I'm wondering whether there's some sort of union for porn industry workers. To my mind that would be the best way to administer an accreditation scheme.

[JaneS]

I think just putting a union in place is going to be a bit like trying to build a sandcastle with the tiding coming in, isn't it? Until the basic forces at work in the porn industry change, I don't see how a union wouldn't become either so weak as to be pointless, or corrupted?

I guess I'm thinking about the way that people jumped on things like burlesque and said they were wonderful and liberating and totally different from mainstream porn, and all that seems to have happened is to slightly diversify porn?

Sorry SGM if I am very ignorant, I'm interested but new to this one.

[washnomore]

I don't quite understand. Surely if some of the bigger stars were involved it would be powerful by virtue of their affiliation? Admittedly it would take some level of motivation and organisation on the part of those involved but if a few of the main and popular stars got together they could surely exert significant pressure on the companies behind these films? And that would provide a framework for more vulnerable or newer workers to join and get support.

Sorry, it's all a bit idealistic and hopelessly naive I'm sure.

[washnomore]

I guess so. Just a thought.

[washnomore]

[TeiTetua]

It's amusing to see how Dittany just agreed with Washnomore--it's hopeless to wish these things out of the world, so the obvious next-best plan must be, make them do as little damage as possible. Perhaps by government regulation, perhaps by an association of performers/workers. There are possibilities, at least. And if the issue is pornography, one might (philosophically) consider how it could be done in a way that wouldn't encourage objectification. But then, it's in the viewer's mind that it takes its final form.

[ForkfulOfEasterEgg]

OP - don't disappear!

You might like to watch this lecture by Gail Dines. She has an amusing, wry delivery style and uses lots of pictures and images to build up her argument.

When you talk about "stars" exerting pressure on those making the films - well I think the industry is so powerful it would find others to exploit in stead.

Porn is at the end of a spectrum, a spectrum which includes big business. £££ made on the internet out of porn - even if there is "free porn" - £££ being made by ISPs and those selling broadband and data on mobile phones. Hollywood and the music industry is part of that spectrum as these all contribute to objectifying women. The lecture will explain this better than me!

[toddlerwrangler]

OP - I too feel that there is a place and a market for 'ethical porn' . Unfortunately, I suspect this is the minority of stuff produced. I personally would like to work towards changing this, but have no clue how to.