I have no idea what is normal or right

[chocoraisin]

I'll try to be brief. I'm 28 weeks pg, H left when I was 14 weeks pg because I discovered his affair and threw him out. There was no confession from him - he was leading me a merry dance to go to Relate etc right up until I realised there was someone else involved. I have no idea if he would have left eventually if I hadn't made him go there and then, IYSWIM. We have one 20mo DS. I've tried to be very calm regarding DS, and he spends one day and one afternoon a week with him. No overnights because he has nowhere to take him (I moved in with family, he is sleeping on his dads floor apparently).

So it's been about 13 weeks since he left, and I've got 3 months left before baby is due. He has asked me to meet his 'new partner' (the OW involved) within 8 weeks of the new baby arriving so that we can discuss her involvement in raising baby/spending time with my newborn/DS. Apparently he thinks I should accept her as stepmum to my unborn DC right now - and be fine with the two of them taking the baby out with DS at that early stage.

Honestly I'm so shocked at this request, at this stage, that I literally don't know how to respond. So far I've just deferred and said it's not relevant right now so not to bring it up before baby is born... step parents can I just ask for a (gentle) opinion please? Is this normal? WWYD or rather, expect from the XW? As far as I know, he has been seeing her since sept last year. I fell pg in late oct, so it wasn't like we weren't in a relationship or it was clearly a loveless marriage destined to fail. DC2 was discussed/planned.

I just don't know how to even think about this woman, let alone talk to her. I'm not sure if it matters in the grand scheme of things, but she spent Christmas with H in my home, knowing full well that I was pregnant and that we were (allegedly) working through our marital problems. She had met my DS and knew without a doubt that H was both married, a father and a father to be for the second time. Can she seriously expect me to welcome her as a step mum?? Just... I'm honestly, speechless.

I've had no contact with her myself. No nasty texts/emails/rants. Have so far maintained a dignified silence and hoped that I wouldn't have to deal with her at all - after all, no-one has even filed for divorce yet... god what a mess. :(

[PepeLePew]

Good for you, you sound very restrained and very dignified, and he sounds like a pig.

I completely understand where you are coming from. I'm not a step mother but have been in a similar position to you (dcs were older) but couldn't not post. I will be interested in what step mothers think as I am struggling with a similar-ish position myself at the moment.

I would say that it's probably a good thing in the long run (though I know it won't feel like it) that she wants to be actively involved in their lives. Obviously she's done a horrible thing to you, and you certainly don't have to like her or welcome her (I have singularly failed to do either with the OW in my marriage), but the truth is that she will be part of your dcs' lives for as long as she stays with your ex. And from experience, the more you are prepared to facilitate contact, in a calm and stress free way, the better for your children and for you for that matter. However badly the pair of them have behaved, he still has every right to see his children and she is now part of his life and you can't dictate who sees the children when they are with him. I found that incredibly hard to come to terms with, but wish I had spent less time dwelling on it as it didn't do anyone any good!

I would be very unhappy about being apart from a tiny baby for long periods of time (what if you're breastfeeding?) but it is understandable that your ex will want to spend time with both his children. That doesn't have to be long periods for the baby, but will need to be regular and frequent.

The request was very insensitive and badly worded, but you probably will need to figure out access to them both fairly quickly. You don?t have to meet her, or ?figure out her involvement?. All you have to do is work out how things will work with him.

Good luck.

[DizzySometimes]

One word - 'wow'.

I think it's extremely unreasonable of him to be laying down demands at this stage, honestly. Whilst it is often said on here that step-parents don't get a say in raising their step-children etc (and there is a lot of frustration around that), I don't know how I'd feel in your shoes when you're still coming to terms with his affair. I think I would want to sit down with him alone to discuss contact and other arrangements. Whilst she will have some part to play in both your children's lives, I don't think it's fair to expect you to sit down civilly with her until you and your husband have sorted out what you both want to do. And I think you're perfectly within your rights to state that you have no wish to meet her at this point, particularly given how it's probably still very raw for you, and that it's up to you if you ever do meet her. How insensitive of him to want to do that so soon!

I'm sure other step-mums will be along shortly to offer more advice.

[PepeLePew]

Sorry, I should also have added that just because she has behaved badly doesn?t necessarily mean she won?t be a good step mother. In truth, although I despise the woman who my ex cheated on me with, she is clearly fond of my children and makes sure they are well cared for when they are with her, and I?ve not yet found a reason to complain about her behaviour in relation to them. I know that relationships are complicated, and good people do bad things. One bad decision doesn?t make you bad to the core.

[Gigondas]

I am a step mum (not involved in break up) and step kid, I think what pepe says makes a lot of sense.

Also it's very early days in relationship (plus dc2 is a baby) so I think asking to wait a while for ow to meet dc2 makes sense (clearly that horse has bolted with your ds1). I would try and agree a longer timetable for seeing ds2 rather than her rushing in from day one. It's hard enough when aren't in that situation letting anyone take your newborn so I don't think it is the right thing to have her involved until baby that bit older .

And hard as it is , I would try and keep your feelings about this woman and your dh separate from childcare/visits from your ex. Hard though it is, the people that get most hurt are kids If dragged into it and that includes young dc who might not understand details but know an atmosphere when they sense it.

[DizzySometimes]

Sorry - I realised that I didn't answer the 'what would I expect' part. My expectations would be that, whatever you think of the OW, that you don't express those opinions to your children (as seems to happen regularly, but DO speak to good friends when you need to instead as we all need to vent) and allow her to have a relationship with your children without them feeling torn between loyalty to you, and wanting to get on with Dad's girlfriend. I realise that must be incredibly difficult, and that she has been involved in your marriage breaking down, but any resentment that you (rightfully) feel can lead to a lot of bad feeling etc. later on. Keep communication with husband open (if you can) so that you can arrange contact and discuss anything else you need to.

[ladygagoo]

Didn't want to leave your post unanswered - so so sorry to hear about your situation and well done for being so dignified about it.

I have no idea about the ins and outs of a newborn meeting a SM, someone will be along shortly to give you some of their experience I don't doubt.
I would say though, your H is an arse to even consider discussing your unborn child meeting his GF. He is no position to make any sort of demands.

[chocoraisin]

I agree completely about keeping the feelings about him being a crap husband separate from him being a dad - they aren't one and the same thing. As much as I would like to never see him again, that's not good for my kids so I will have to suck it up. I've gone out of my way to drive DS to meet him, make sure that they can spend time together etc and arranged a temporary contact plan within 2 weeks of finding out so that DS had some consistency to their relationship. I email updates about him to H and have skyped midweek (that's stopped now because H failed to keep the date).

In the long run I hope that if she sticks around that she will prove to be a great step mum. I guess I just didn't think they would expect that to be an immediate set up. :( Its hard to imagine what the future will be like - she's only 25 and lives with her parents. Even if they do move in together, it will be where H currently lives, which is nowhere near me. AFAIK she doesn't spend time with DS yet because of that, as we are a 3 hour trip away now I've moved in with my family. H travels down on a motorbike alone to visit. I don't know why she would force the issue by coming down, when the short term plan is for contact with the newborn to happen in my home (while sleeping and bf routines are established). In principle I couldn't care less if she tags along while DS goes swimming with his dad. But coming to my home, to take the newborn baby out of my arms so they can play at happy families... well it seems heartless to the extreme. And given what I already know about her (willing to shag H in my home, next to DS cot etc) she's not filling me with hope that she'll be a caring and thoughtful person towards my DC. She has no DC of her own.

It's pretty difficult to be calm and rational about someone when this is what you have to go on :(

[chocoraisin]

I should add I am a firm believer in 'if you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all' so would never ever bad mouth either H or any subsequent GF to the kids. I trust that raising them to know right from wrong will be good enough. If he continues to be an arse they will work it out themselves soon enough. Children are small after all, but not stupid.

[Gigondas]

Choco you sound amazingly strong and sensible.

I agree that judgement may not be strong point with her. I would focus on importance of ex building relationship with baby and also with ds1 (who may be unsettled if new person and baby thrown into mix) in early days. Its perfectly reasonable and sensible not to want to be overrun with any type of visitor with a newborn let alone the ow.

[mishymashy]

Wow, what an arse of a bloke!

I think you are handling everything perfectly. Far more restrained than i would be

You dont need to discuss a situation that is not happening yet so i would stick to my guns and not get drawn into that conversation until baby arrives.

As for expectations from a stepmums point of view i would say this is your exH expectations and not OWs.

It might be worth meeting her, just to establish who's idea this is. If he is as self absorbed as he sounds i would be suprised if she is aware of his request, but maybe i am being far to charitable to a woman who has done what she has.

I do agree with Pepe, one big mistake doesnt necessarily make her totally bad, just very stupid

You sound so composed considering what you have been through.

Got to say it though, your Ex is an absolute wanker!

[chocoraisin]

lol... yes, he is.

In hindsight, I had spectacularly bad judgement when I married him. Still... one bad decision doesn't make me a through and through idiot either hey

Trust me, the resignation/restraint is the tail end of about two full days of sobbing/feeling sick to my stomach and ragingly angry. Ultimately though I can't control him or his wanker-ish behaviour. In some ways, I think she's welcome to him!! I just don't want my babies handed off like some kind of prize to be paraded around like a sodding toy before being handed back to me. To put it in perspective, H never looked after DS alone before he was 5mo+ in the first place, so I have little confidence in his ability to manage 2 under 3 at the same time. Especially given that geography makes it impossible to see them more frequently than the once/twice a week arrangement we have now.

Good advice to focus on him establishing a bond first (and some essential skills as well) before looking after them both. I wonder how easily he'll accept that though, given his eagerness to legitimise their relationship right now.

[chocoraisin]

ps hadn't considered that OW may not actually want to be involved, and it could all be coming from H. I suppose that would be a relevant question to ask if I did have to meet her anytime soon. Yuk... how crappy. Having to ask my H's OW if she plans to be a step mum... :( No idea how you word that one. Um, did you plan to muscle in on just my husband and not my kids, or both? sigh not sure what that would achieve actually.

Still feel shocked to the core that this is happening to my family :(

[MagsAloof]

Bollocks to that.

This should be done on your terms, in your time. You sound like a thoughtful ad reasonable woman, so he needs to trust you to come around to all of this in your own time, when it feels right for you and your baby.

Good God, he sounds like a tosser. You are well rid.

[Gigondas]

She is 25 and living with her parents. Am
Guessing ex is maybe older and seemed somehow differenT/older man. I strongly suspect that the reality of being a step m ESP to do such young kids (if she has ever thought of it at all) hasn't bitten.

I can think of few things worse - the relentless grind of looking after very small
Kids (who are quite likely unsettled as out of routine) coupled with the role of step mum which is not that of a parent but has
Responsibility of looking after kids.

Reality might bite her quite hard on the bum..

But agree that I can see no reason (ESP what you said about your ex ability to care for babies and distance he lives) to agree to any access.

[Tobermory]

Chocoraisin, I've read some of your other threads and been just so shocked by your H behaviour and expectations what an absolute arse!. I'm sorry you're going through this.

Your H is being so outrageously unreasonable in his demands. How dare he say when he expects you to meet ow and to dictate her role in raising/ looking after your dc. In my opinion it is you who should be saying when/where and certainly not now with the pressures you are under.

I say this as a step parent. My DH has a son from his first marriage, he was 4 when we met. I took a very back seat and would have done even moreso had he been a newborn. In fact I think in this case I wouldn't really expect to see much of the baby...... Who I would assume would be with his mother for large parts of the day.

Your H is being wholly unreasonable and needs to get a bit of empathy from somewhere. If he isn't being reasonable.....maybe you shouldn't be either?

[chocoraisin]

I did entertain the thought that I should let them have both kids for 24 hours v early on and see what the dose of reality would do to them! But honestly, as much as it would give me satisfaction to see her run for the hills and him to flail about with no clue and two yelling children, I couldn't do that to the DCs. DS still wakes in the night and needs to be settled. I'm not going to put DS or DC2 in any kind of stressful situation where their needs can't be met.

Mind you, just the fact that he will be tootling off to see the DCs week in week out all this way and expecting her (at her age) to either give up her weekends to come with, or spend all of them second fiddle to his family. Well... that might be enough reality all by itself. I guess I just need to sit tight don't I? Who knows if they will even make it that far, to be an issue when baby arrives. She might get cold feet long before he wants her to get in on childcare. I imagine when he goes dashing off to the hospital to meet his newborn she'll be feeling a bit strange about it all... maybe not. I'll just have to play the long game and maintain civil (arms length) relations in the meantime.

thanks so much for taking the time to reply. I'm glad that I'm not the only one who thinks at this early stage contact should be about H's relationship with his DC, not about 'blending' anyone into our family. The dust has barely settled and one baby isn't even born, so he can bloody well wait!! I feel a bit more confident about that now - many thanks all

[chocoraisin]

PS I have to say, my best friend is a step-mum to her DP's 4 boys (2 each from 2 different previous marriages) and I know for a fact it's a hard and thankless job. To all the wonderful, thoughtful and positive step parents out there - you're an impressive lot! I am well aware that a step parent can be a blessing in some families, and wouldn't be surprised if H's future partner has to carry the slack on his parenting... I rather hope if that's the case though, she turns out to be a lot like you guys, and not so much of the OW I currently know her to be.

[zippyrainbowbrite]

I am a SM (never the OW though). DSS was 1 1/2 when DH and I got together, and as DH was keen to stay as involved as he could in his sons life I've supported him as much as I can.

His mum was quite unsure of me at first being so involved in her DS's life, but over time we've managed to build up a good relationship - we're not friends, but often contact about DSS goes through us rather than her and DH as they tend to push each others buttons! DSs is 8 now, and (seems to be) very happy with all arrangements, going very happily between houses.

As others have said, your H sounds like a tosser (and the OW doesn't sound great either!), but your attitude towards it all seems great - the more civil you can manage to keep it all, the easier it will be for the kids.

It sounds like a very tough situation, but that you're doing great!

[doctordwt]

I think I would be politely replying that unfortunately, his 'new partner' is, as far as you are concerned, currently an irrelevance to the situation. Your concerns are as follows: coping with the birth and the newborn stage given the particularly difficult circumstances he has created for you, and secondly, making sure that he, the other person with parental responsibility, CAN actually show themselves to be responsible enough to build a relationship with the new baby from afar as well as care for both the baby and your DS away from you. If their relationship continues, then at some point you assume that he will orchestrate her meeting with your children and you expect that he will involve you in this. However, for him to bring the question of this up now simply underlines how superficial and thoughtless a relationship he seems intent on creating with his ex-family as a separated father. Have a 'meeting' with her within 8 weeks of giving birth alone, because of wat they have done to your family in order to discuss her involvment as a stepmother? How would you like your fuck off, fast or slow?

You could follow this up with pointing out to him just how lucky he is that your feeling is that she is irrelevant to the current situation with your children. It could be a lot worse, couldn't it? Let's be honest, most women wouldn't exactly choose the kind of skank who sleeps with a man with a toddler and a pregnant wife to be a stepmother to their children, would they? Perhaps he would like to drop the idea of a discussion on her role as a stepmother given that, at the moment, your view of her 'role' in your childrens' lives is that of the scumbag who helped break up their family. Perhaps the least that she could do is keep her skanky little head below the parapet while what is left of your family welcomes your second child into the world.

Finally you could say that you are disappointed, though not altogether surprised that as soon as discussions arise about how his caring for the two children and having contact will work, her name is mentioned. Make it clear that one thing you will make absolutely sure of is that he will continue for the foreseeable future to not only be the main carer for your children, but the ONLY carer. He has rocked your DS's world; he has created a world for your second baby where they are never going to know what it is like to live with their father. If he has one duty, it is to make sure the time he spends with his children is THEIR time with him, NOT time with them fitting into his 'new relationship'. Right now, she has absolutely NO place in any discussion of what happens with care for the children, because you aren't even sure that he will even step up to the plate himself.

Oh, and one more thing. Right now, you're sorry to say that she won't be meeting the baby for a considerable length of time, because she isn't welcome in your home, and you've honestly no idea whether she ever will be. But like you first said, you're not worrying about that - because she really isn't at all
important to any of the issues you as parents are currently discussing.

:)

[doctordwt]

Gosh - your later post - I have to say I would NOT want him at the hospital either.

[chocoraisin]

he won't be at the birth doc, but I agreed to him visiting soon after... it's his baby too (however regrettable I may feel that is!). I did say a big fat fuck off though when he suggested he should bring DS to meet his new sibling as a big happy family moment!! Love your suggested reply :) I've had that conversation in my head a few times... so far I've whittled it down to 'this clearly isn't relevant right now. Not to be raised until further notice'.

Giving no ammunition, and not rising to the bait... for now, at least! Who knows when hormones will kick in and ruin my composure once and for all??

[Smum99]

How completely insensitive and at best reflects her immaturity and lack of life experience. Him...he's just an arse.

I think your holding response is excellent - absolutely no decisions until the baby is here and then see how you feel.

I'm a stepmum and bio mum and wasn't OW but I have always been careful to ensure that dss's mum feels I am not taking over in any way. I feel my role is that of supporting DH to raise his child.
I'm usually very supportive of dads being heavily involved with children but I've been fortunate that DH is a loving dad who is also highly responsible. However he wouldn't never have behaved like your ex so therefore I struggle to relate to parents behaving like this - male or female.

The reality of a baby might not be what these 2 are planning..we all know how much hard work looking after a new baby is. I also think your ex should learn to parent solo (but I guess you can't enforce that). I would have more respect if he attempted to do this. The OW doesn't have to be involved..He wants her to be 'stepmum' (probably because he knows it's hard work)

DH's ex had an affair and in her case the adage one a cheater always a cheater is correct as she has now cheated on the 2nd husband. Bear this in mind..OW may not be around forever so also have that in your mind when making decisions.

This is such a dilemma and not one that most of us could imagine..Wisdom of solemn is needed I think and I don't envy the position your ex has placed you in however don't feel any pressure to make decisions - wait until you feel able to make a decision.

[Tobermory]

Doctordwt, you said exactly what I was thinking but failed to express.

[purpleroses]

To answer your question - What your ex is suggesting is neither normal nor right. I've been with my DP for two years, and do help out with the kids of course. But I've never had any desire at all for a sit down meeting with their mum. Liaising with her is DP's job as their father. That is what is normal, I think. You and he are the parents - if he wants his new GF to help him out on a day to day basis when he's looking after your DCs then he's free to do so, but you needn't have any part in that set-up. Or have anything to do with her, unless you want to.

And it's not right because it's bloody obviously going to be stressful for you, and at a time when people ought to be supporting you, not causing you more stress. Your ex is either very dim (and doesn't realise this) or he is trying to harass you by suggesting it.

[dancingfreckles]

Choco I have read your other 2 threads is disbelief

Hopefully you can draw some help from my experience. I met my DP when his 2nd DC was very young. His relationship had broken down in the early stages of pregnancy mutually and he hadn't been living at home for 6 months.

Even so we both agreed strongly that we would not even consider raising the subject of the children meeting me for 6 months at least. This allowed not only our relationship to grow to a place where we felt it was for keeps but also allowed him to establish a new routine with his Exp and DC before any outside influences came about.

They are now 2 very well balanced children who have loving SP in both homes and a year on I do not regret a single way in which we handled a situations. Yes it got you down when your partner would leave for a weekend to see his children but you have to suck it up. If this women is serious about your Exp this is what she will have to do. Any women with any ounce of respect (although she has clearly proved she is lacking in this already) will back off and let relationships and plans evolve before wading in.

I also echo purpleroses unless my DP ex asked to sit down with me I would not feel it was mine or my DP right to purpose this that's just bizarre. Most contact goes through my DP and Ex although me and DP ex have built up a relationship here we can update each other on the children as I often pick them up as I'm home a lot earlier on a Friday night.

Bottom line is your Exp and OW need to respect your feeling and think long term gains rather than short term gains. Chin up your are an amazing inspiration and a credit to your 2 DC