Setting in secondary schools

[NEScribe]

Hi,

just wondering if anyone happens to know whether setting in core subjects is still routine at start of state secondary school (Y7) or whether some schools stay with mixed ability for Y7 or indeed have a different type of banding?

thanks!

[practicallyimperfect]

We have mixed ability in year 7, some setting in yr 9 in maths. Science set at GCSE, English do mixed ability throughout.

[Lucycat]

DD's in yr 7 and is setted for Maths, English, Science French, Humanities - n fact everything except subjects like dance, PE, Music & Drama.

At my school we only set in Maths - at all ages - everything else is mixed ability up to GCSE - actually I think English do roughly set in terms of Higher/Foundation paper.

It really does depend on the school - if you phone them they will tell you - hopefully

[roisin]

At the boys' school they are in mixed ability groups for everything for the whole of yr7; from yr8 set for most subjects.

At my school they are in sets from day 1 (based on KS2 data) for Maths, English and Science, and maybe some others, I'm not sure.

[Iwantacampervan]

My DD in year 7 was set from the start for maths, science, french, history and geography. Everything else, including english, is taught in form groups.

Another secondary around our area doesn't set at all in year 7.

[grendel]

At my DD's school they are set in year 7 for maths, science, ict, and english. In year 8 they also set them for french and german. They do move them up and down sets during the year as well if it turns out that they are struggling or cruising in a particular set.

[maypole1]

They set in my sons school for every subject expect drama they even set for pe so the children who are not very sporty can go at a slower pace

[kritur]

Set for maths, english, science. Banded for other things (one high ability band and 2 lower ability bands) but mixed ability within the band.

[TalkinPeace2]

depends on the school
secondary moderns (the remnants in grammar areas) are different than comps

[Takver]

I'm interested in this one - annoyingly we all went round the open day of the school dd is probably going to move onto and forgot to ask that question. D'you reckon it would be rude to send an email to ask?

[TalkinPeace2]

dd is in year 9
ds is in year 7
for complicated reasons the two years have UTTERLY different setting systems
far more important is the ethos / atmosphere of the school (for those of us who are not writing cheques!)

[onceagain]

Takver - a good school will list that sort of information in their prospectus or on their website. If its not there then send an email - the type of response (including answer as well as tone and speed of reply) you get will give you another indication of whether you like the school or not.

[alemci]

My DC's school has setting which IMO is a good thing. My ds is in year 9 and a bit lazy. I have stressed to him how important it is to get in the higher sets if he can.

I worked in a school where they were only set for maths. The understanding was the bright ones would bring the not so bright ones along. I felt it was unfair on the more academic kids as they were held back. It was uncool to work hard.

[BehindLockNumberNine]

DS is in Y8. In Y7 all classes were set based on KS2 SAT results. So he was in the same class for all lessons.
Now in Y8 they are set for all subjects. Some subjects are tied together, so if in top set for maths you are also top set for science and ict. And your english set determines your humanities sets.

Hth.

[Takver]

Thanks onceagain, looking on their website is a good idea.

[mummytime]

DCs school only really sets for Maths in year 7, (and loosely for Languages at the end). Then set for Science and MAths in year 8, loosely for English and MFL. Most is still mixed ability in year 9. Then Core subjects set (independently) in year 10 & 11, with movement between some sets still possible.
This is a school which gets very good results. But it does also clamp down hard on behaviour.

[cory]

You have to ask the individual school. Ours sets in Yr 7, but one other school we saw at open evening said they didn't.

[NEScribe]

Thank you everyone. I did check if the children would be set before choosing the school - the prospectus said they would be set in Year 7 according to their ability. I figured this meant they would be in different classes according to ability in each of the core subjects but have now found that they have been put in 'overall ability' sets according to midYIS and SATs results.
So, in a nutshell, DD is in the lowest set for all core subjects although she is a little above average in English and average in most other subjects. (She has poor maths and did badly in the MidYIS non verbal so this pulled down her overall score.)
I really worry that being in the bottom set for all subjects, rather than just maths, will affect her progress. She needs to be challenged in English whereas in maths she obviously does need a slower pace and more help.
It has also badly affected her self confidence. She doesn't have a lot of confidence in her ability and it has really shaken her being put in "the bottom" English class.
I know that getting GAT pupils to join any school is important so I can understand top groups for GAT children but think that, like one school mentioned by another poster, the rest could be in mixed ability groups for Year 7 and then properly set according to subjects.
Thanks again

[mummytime]

Most schools don't have enough G and T to have one set for them (at 10% you'd need a year of 300 to get one class of 30). Also G and T kids vary wildly, so may be G and T at one subject and not another, or some learn better in different way. Also some are more likely to be spotted than others, eg. those who sit and write long essays rather than those who are a bit more off the wall.

[TheFallenMadonna]

So they are streaming on the basis of ability tests rather than setting?

[oneofsuesylvesterscheerios]

G&T will no longer be 10% anyway. All G&T lists are being stripped right down to include only those students who are 'exceptional' in ability/aptitude. Previous to that, because of the 10% guidance, students could be nominated to be G&T in a subject if they were very good at it, which doesn't necessary tally with being gifted or talented.

The 'new' G&T lists will therefore be much smaller but perhaps more meaningful, if the schools provide the right support.

[TalkinPeace2]

My kids school has year groups of 300 BUT they split the year into 2 bands and then each band into 5 sets - so there are 2 set 1 etc
until year 10 when they merge the bands
it seems to work

[BehindLockNumberNine]

Talking, that is exactly how ds's school do it. 300 kids per year, split into two bands. They stream each band into 6 sets. Then in Y10 all gets mixed up again depending on options chosen.

[bigTillyMint]

At DD's school, they stream by general ability into 4 or 5 streams and then set them for each subject according to ability within the stream. It seems to then stay fairly much set until they choose their options for Y9 when they are set according to ability from the pupils choosing each option.

If you are at all worried, make an appointment to go in and talk to the HoY asap. They should be able to answer all your concerns and take it to someone higher if necessary.