Dad won't come to wedding if my mother comes, won't take responsibility for anything...

[bohemianbint]

I think we may have hit a point where we can't go any further.Have tried talking, have tried writing a letter; I put a lot of time and thought into the letter detailing why I feel they disrespect me and they don't care when I am upset by their actions and I stand by every word. . They finally acknowledged my letter after a week and a half and responded by sayign they are devastated to receive such a thing, they will take it to their graves, they've failed as parents, I've done irreparable damage...They are not upset that they have upset me, nor have they acknowledged anything in it that I have raised
, they are trying to make me feel guilty for having the audacity to write it. I get nothing from my dad, he seems to hate me and just sits there beign really cold and angry. He ignores my DS2 completely.

As regards the wedding they say they don't want to be in a room with my mother who they claim "abandoned and abused" me. Like it's ok that he beat shit out of me when I was 16, because he "made sacrifices and brought me up" and she didn't. They don't seem to have any idea that so much of what they did to me constitutes abuse and neglect, and I haven't even started raising that with them. THey seem to want to re-write history, and for me not to mention to people (when they query why my stepmother and sister are short and I'm not) that I have s different mother. They want to pretend that because they brought us up and "made sacrifices" that means that they are perfect and beyond rebuke.

I'm thinking a session for all of us with a counsellor would be a good idea, but i'm also started to realise that my dad will not accept responsibilty for anything and maybe I have to accept that he doesn't like me and that might be as good as it gets.

This wouldnt be such an issue if the wedding wasn't forcing things to a head.

[weblette]

BB I must confess I don't know the history to this but from what you've said above, would it be so terrible if he didn't come?

[GossipMonger]

Elope!


It is the only way.

Bloody families ..........am so sorry you have so much stress.

[bohemianbint]

I think that's the way it's going Weblette - I would be very sad that my father thought so little of me that he couldn't put his feelings to one side over a divorce that happened, let's face it, nearly 30 years ago, but I think I might have to deal with it. It's just that he's trying to make me feel like I'm being disloyal, an ungrateful child, and fickle for inviting my mother. (The relationship with her hasn't always been great and we were estranged for 7 years, but we've worked to build it up and she's been around for us since DS2 was born, whislt we haven't seen my dad and SM for dust.) Is it really out of order to want my mother there, even if she didn't bring us up?

[Dropdeadfred]

This is your wedding party is it? Am i right in thinking you've had the legal ceremony?

he sounds like he would spoil it regardless so just uninvite him. I don't know why you want anything to do with him anyway after what you've posted about him

[TheArmadillo]

are you attending councelling alone atm? cos even if they don't attend it would eb good for you to have some.

Seriously consider how they will behave at your wedding adn how they will make you feel if they do attend (and your mother doesn't). I don't
know if it's the same for you but I tend to romanticise what events with my parents will be like, cos I imagine as long as I get everything right then they will be happy and we will all have a lovely time, when that is never the outcome. And consider what the consequences for you will be if you back down over this.

Then consider as to whether it will be less stressful for you not to have them there. I know it will be upsetting if you don't have them there, but how upsetting will it be if you do.

Have you always backed down on issues like this before? If so and they have never been faced with you standing strong there is a chance they may back down at the last minute.

The choice you have is to either
a) stand by the choice you have made and either they will not attend or they will attend at the last minute, but you will have made a stand.

b) back down adn disinvite your mother in which case your parents may still not attend or they might and in either case you will have probably caused problems in your relationship with your mother.

Think what you were thinking when you sent that letter, did you know they would refuse to attend or did you think they would attend anyway and all would be good?

[BlueSapphire77]

Tch. They should be thinking of you on your special day.

Fk em. Ban everyone who you will spend the day worrying about and not enjoying one of the most special days EVER apart from the birth of your kids.

Then relax and enjoy your day.

How selfish can some people be ffs.
BTW when my DSC's grow up, their mum will be more than welcome at weddings or anything IMO as she is made welcome by me to school assemblies ect but not by my DP. IMO they are both parents in name only to their kids, he doesn't give a shit and she walked out and left them, although (tin hat on) i can understand why sometimes.

Parents in name only also seems to cover your parents, not trying to slag them off, just my opinion, but they do not DESERVE to attend your wedding IMVHO and they do not deserve a daughter who obv. loves and worries about them and puts their happiness before her own. Put yourself first flower xx

[TheArmadillo]

sorry that post probably is more waffle than help.

It hurts when parents do this, even though you know they are being unfair and bad it still feels like a smack in the face, is heartbreaking and makes you question yourself as to whether you do deserve it.

[HecateQueenOfGhosts]

I think you should invite all the people who matter to you, and say to them that you want them all there, you are not going to choose and if they won't come then fair enough, their choice.

And then have a lovely day with whoever cares about YOU enough to be there.

[weblette]

He sounds toxic BB, and loving the fact that he can have so much control. Really feel for you.

[compo]

I agree, just invite them and if they don't go then it is their loss.
Your weddng is the perfect opportunity to lok towards the future and try to draw a line under the past. It is their loss and you want the day tobe full of happiness not awkward confrontations. You have written the letter, brought up all your issues , now it is up to them.

[Hassled]

You're stuck between a rock and a hard place but whatever you do, do not let them manage to make you feel guilty for inviting your mother. Whatever she did or didn't do in the past, she's still your mother and it sounds like you've worked hard to develop a relationship with her.

I agree with everyone else - invite them all and they can like it or lump it. Your father clearly has some issues, but they don't have to become your issues as well. Just have one hell of a good wedding, and how it pans out after that is really up to them, not you.

[BlueSapphire77]

Also. Feel i must say. DSC's mother may not be perfect, like yours, but she is their MUM, that will never change nor can anyone replace her.
The kids see her as perfect and thats good enough for me.

As long as she treats them properly and protects them then she is ok in my eyes no matter what the past. You have a right to invite your mother. She brought you into the world and thats the best qualification for her to be there. You would think the others would put aside their petty crap for your sake. Ok so they brought you up. Looks like they personally did a shit job but you have made the best of it and brought yourself out of their crap to turn out to be a lovely person (i have read some of your posts in the past if i have the right person) and even from your op i can see how caring and worried you are.
If they respected you they would attend without incident but may have asked to be kept seperate from your mum which i could understand, but to refuse point blank and be so shitty...
Don't invite them and TELL them why..because they will no doubt ruin your day and that is not fair.

[bohemianbint]

Thank you. It is the first time I have ever really stood up for myself and they are not happy about it at all.

What really peturbs me, and I hope am being paranoid here, is that I get the impression they are trying to put a wedge between me and DH or are trying to cause trouble, because we are a united front. Last night they brought up an argument DH and I had a month after we first met to do with his ex. It wasn't entirely relevant and they were trying to make out like there was loads of other trouble as a result. Last time we spoke my dad said in front of DH that I had said that I didn't even know why I was getting married - which is the biggest pile of bollocks, I never said anything of the sort, but even if I had - why say that in front of DH if not to cause trouble?

They rounded up by saying "we are your parents, we will always be here for you no matter what other relationships come and go" like as though we're inevitably going to break up.

I really hope I'm reading to much into that, or it's evil - we have two tiny boys ffs.

[hatwoman]

blimey bb. you sound incredibly open to reconciliation, given what you've been through, and sound like you've tried and tried to somehow reach (to use an American phrase taht I'm not that fond of, but which does the job) closure - to get you all to a stage that would allow everyone involved to move ahead. While I hugely admire you I think you have to ask yourself if anyone else is interested - because I'm not sure you can pull this off alone - and ask yourself how much effort you're prepared to expend. or whether you can, on your own, draw a line under it all, focus on dp and your family - and move forward without the others. I really feel for you, being put in this situation through no fault whatsoever of your own. counselling would be a good idea - if you can persuade the others.

re accepting the situation with your dad for what it is - on a much lower level that's what I did about 15 years ago. my parents split when I was 14 and although he was never abusive and didn;t totally forget me, dad handled it badly - forgot birthdays, didn;t ring that sort of thing - the kind of pointless neglect that kids do feel. after years of imploring him to make more of an effort - both verbally and in writing, I eventually gave up. it really hurt to accept that we'd never be close but it definitely helped me move away from various emotional trappings that were tying me in knots and affecting my own, adult life. I'm sorry if it's facile of me to make a comparison - my situation was really very mild - but I think it is possible to take control and make a decision to focus on yourself.

excuse my random ramblings - and excuse the lack of concrete advice. I hope you can think things through and decide what you want to do from here. For heaven's sake, whatever you do do, enjoy your wedding, and celebrate your love with dp. your dad and step mum can't take that away from you.

[compo]

honestly after your last post I wouldn't even invite them!

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

BohemianBint

Re your comment:-

"I'm thinking a session for all of us with a counsellor would be a good idea, but i'm also started to realise that my dad will not accept responsibilty for anything and maybe I have to accept that he doesn't like me and that might be as good as it gets"

Counselling for you yes, BUT these two toxic people i.e your Dad and SM would never agree to counselling as they feel they have done nothing wrong. You will never get them to go along to a session. They have given you ALL the standard responses usually uttered by such people following their perceived attack by you on them. They are SO not worth it honestly.

Think they are also trying to put a wedge between you and your husband to be. Do not let them!.

If you wish for your Mother to be at the wedding then she should be there. Its not up to others to dictate their wishes; this shows you disrespect as well.

Living well is the best revenge here. I do not advocate cutting out people lightly but your Dad and stepmother will give you nothing but unhappiness if you keep letting them into your life. You have every right to let them go for good. They failed you miserably and they continue to do so. These people as well do not change.

[Dropdeadfred]

who was actually at the weddding ceremony? them or your mum?

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

BB

You may well recognise some of what your parents replied in the following:-

Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect you feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defenses that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety will undoubtedly us it during confrontation to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behavior. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offenses against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behavior. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get," or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ....

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realize that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

[bohemianbint]

Thank you everyone for being so lovely. It's been really helpful and it might sound corny but I don't know how I would have dealt with all this without having MN as a sounding board to try to keep me grounded! I do find it really hard not to let them mess with my head and they insinuate that I am a flawed, mentally questionable person. I have, after recent conversations started to harden up though - Dh was upset last night but the whole conversation made me really annoyed.

DDF - they were at the ceremony, not my mother. They won't acknowledge what we're doing this year so they might be happy with just that!

Armadillo - not waffle, that was actually really helpful! I think I thought that they might just put things to one side and come anyway - I knew they wouldn't like it and it wouldn't be easy but I at least thought they would make the effort. If not for me, for how it would make them look to the wider world if they decided not to come, and they're all about how things make them look to others...

attila - OMG, that last bit about the health - can you believe that my SM actually keeps saying "of course, there might be things you might not know about our health" and "I had X problem which you only know about because I got drunk and let it slip." It really angers me, these veiled threats ("Oh, we might be ill but we won't tell you unless you cross us and then we'll let you have it.")

Sapphire - you sound like a lovely SM! Their argument is that they don't want to be near her because she didn't treat us well; but it's a bit like pointing out the splinter in someone else's eye and missing the beam in your own.

[bohemianbint]

hatwoman - I think I'm being a bit deluded about the whole thing - I keep kidding myself that everything's not that bad and could be alright. It won't really, will it, unless I accept how they are and have a superficial relationship with them on those grounds.

It's that sort of heart over head thing but I really need to get myself in order I think.

[HolyGuacamole]

Atilla is right!!

If he was my father I would not have him at my wedding for fear of him spoiling it. No way. Absolutely no way!

It is YOURS and your FIANCES' day, no one elses and you don't get that chance again right?! Have it exactly as you want surrounded by the people who love and care for you no matter what. Honestly, I have been there and do not waste time on people who cannot drop their reservations to be happy for you for one of the most important and happy days of your life!

People who can't make the effort for you are not your concern. Keep your goodwill, appreciation and thanks for those who care more about helping you celebrate than making some sort of stand over their own little agendas. Don't let your wonderful day be tinged by the negativity of others.

[bohemianbint]

Thank you.

So - just to clarify - I have every right to invite my mother, even though she may have done Bad Things, and we were estranged, and my dad and SM brought me up?

I might sound a bit dense, but have had it drummed into me that it is not acceptable and the wider family will not be happy. Despite the fact that "the family" haven't seen DS who is now 6months, some more than once, others at all.

It's the blackmail element I don't appreciate and I'm not bowing to that, no way.

[Janos]

Hi bohemianbint I've seen a couple of your threads before about your family (and may even have contributed to a couple).

If YOU want YOUR MOTHER to come to YOUR WEDDING that is YOUR DECISION. Nothing else matters.

Good for you not bowing to the blackmail.

Do not fall for their guilt tricks.

And I'd also echo the poster who said 'would it be that bad if they didn't come?'

Only you can answer that one but given all you've been through with them I'd suggest that it wouldn't!

[lizziemun]

Yes you have every right to invite your mum.

My dad (or brother) choose not to come to my wedding they were both invited along with their wifes.

It didn't spoil our day although it would have been better if they had have come. But we still had the wedding we wanted with people we knew loved/liked us to be there with us if that makes sense.

My dad and I didn't get on that well mainly because we had (he died last month) the same personnality and clashed.

[PerArduaAdAmor]

BB - don't beat yourself up for not being able to deprogramme yourself from the years of brainwashing you've been subjected to - I know when you look at the situation clearly you can see it for what it is (I've followed/posted on other threads of yours) but it is hard to change all of your reactions, and it's only recently that you've been properly questioning their behaviour and motivations - give yourself time...

And remember that your DH is on your side, and knows what they're like now. Remind him of this if you have to when they make damaging remarks to him.

But above all - enjoy your wedding without them (and the however-many-guests they wanted you to invite for them). And if anyone asks, well say that that your father was at the civil bit, so it's only fair your mother should be at the celebration?

Good luck with it all. How much longer to go to the day?