DS needs the potty at 4.30am...

[LetThereBeCupcakes]

DS is 2.5 and has been out of nappies for a couple of weeks now. He has always been an early riser but now he's waking up every morning, bang on 4.30, asking for the potty. He always has a massive wee, and then a poo.

He's still in nappies at night but they've been dry for nearly a week, so I'm picking up a spare duvet set and mattress cover and plan to take off the night time nappy, too. But I can't see that will help with the 4.30am wake up call! He never goes back to sleep afterwards and we're now both exhausted.

Any advice? Can I reprogramme him somehow?

[Piratejones]

As far as i can see you have 3 options:

1)You can try and train his bladder by letting him snuggle up with you when he wakes you and waiting half an hour, then extending the time slowly. Obviously you should expect accidents this way.

2) you can set your alarm to go off at 3am and then lift him to the toilet before he's fully awake so he goes back off.

3) You can tell him to go back to bed and try and hold it until morning, but if he doesn't it doesn't matter because of the nappy.

[dodgypinz]

To be honest I think it would be a real pity to spoil this actually amazing and willing progress on your child's part because of the early rising. Separate the two things. Go on just as you are following your child's lead towards him being dry day AND night. Then think about how to deal with early rising. Eg how can you train him to occupy himself in his bed in the morning. Eg audio book or soft music combined with a drink to help him settle. His favourite safe toys in his bed. Star chart with prompt reward. If you can stay quietly in bed until alarm goes off...watch favourite DVD for instance. Start by setting the alarm for just a little longer than you think he can manage eg 15 mins and build it up in15 min increments. Alternatively deal with it from adult perspective. Go to bed much earlier so you don't mind getting up. Take turns so you share the pain. Look at early rising as a way to get a jump on the day.
I hope it works out well. Do tell how it goes.

[Artandco]

Return him to bed after he's been to toilet explaining its the middle of the night still

[imip]

I always think when they are becoming dry at night, it does always lead to bad sleep. At least it has for my 4dcs.

I get dd4 up when I go to bed and take her for a wee. She basically remains asleep throughout the process (it's a little funny also!), but she doesn't wet the bed. I'll stop when she can no longer do a wee at 11pm. This has worked for all my dcs,

Do and I do it as we are going to bed.

[imip]

Sorry, we have a potty next to the bed for this purpose.

[LetThereBeCupcakes]

Sorry I've not replied sooner - MIL had a heart attack so we've been a bit preoccupied!

Pirate number 1 is what we're trying at the moment. He wakes up at 4.30, calls for me so I go in, tell him the sun's not up yet (Gro Clock) and we have to go back to sleep. Snuggle up with him and within 10 minutes he asks for the potty. Should I tell him no, do you think? He's already gone so long without a wee by then! How does number 2 work? Is it more likely he'll go back to sleep if I take him to the potty at 3am?

dodgy my thoughts exactly! He's taken to potty training so, so well. So do you think it's actually NOT connected to needing the potty, but he's waking up and then realising he needs to go? He has a Gro Clock which has got him sleeping much better through the night but we seem to have stalled a bit now!

Art Thank you, yes that's exactly what I'm doing. He's WIDE awake and wails if I leave him. I'm not one for CC / CIO so don't want to just leave him screaming, plus we're in a terraced house so I doubt the neighbours would be best pleased!

imip DS has never been a great sleeper and I'd be terrified he'd wake up fully at 11pm and I'd be up half the night with him!

Day 3 of no night nappy and no accidents at all, so on the potty training side of things he's done really well. It's just the early rising!

[Artandco]

I don't think you should leave him to cry. I'm just saying at 5am when he wakes, let him go to the toilet then he needs to be returned to bed as before 7am. It might take you laying next to him, but that's preferable to starting the day at 5am surely. And hopefully after a few days of you repeating its bedtime still after toilet and laying next to him he will gradually fall back to sleep quicker

[LetThereBeCupcakes]

Oh! OK, I see. I usually do end up lying next to him TBH, but it's a constant climbing / asking for BF / asking for stories etc! I'd like to get back to my own bed really but perhaps I'm asking too much too soon!

[Artandco]

Will he fall back to sleep in your bed with you? Not perfect if you would prefer in bed but would get him back to sleep quicker and you to sleep. You can get back in his bed once you have cracked the toilet routine later.

Ours have always co slept really ( have own bed but in our room, and often just sleep in our bed). Both were dry overnight around 2 years but I think we always went with them to the toilet if they needed to go in the night until about 3. From around 3 they began to get up alone, toilet and back to sleep alone. So maybe he's just not quite old enough to go alone and resettle himself

[LetThereBeCupcakes]

No, sadly not! If I take him into our bed he climbs, jumps, sings, opens the wardobes and empties them etc... And DH works full time in a very physical job so I don't want him woken up that early in the week. It would be really dangerous for him to do his job tired so I'd like to avoid that if possible.

[Piratejones]

number 1 is what we're trying at the moment. He wakes up at 4.30, calls for me so I go in, tell him the sun's not up yet (Gro Clock) and we have to go back to sleep. Snuggle up with him and within 10 minutes he asks for the potty. Should I tell him no, do you think? He's already gone so long without a wee by then!

Ideally you want him to learn to hold all night.

How does number 2 work? Is it more likely he'll go back to sleep if I take him to the potty at 3am?

Yes, if you don't fully wake him, it's called lifting. this way he won't be woken up by his full bladder an hour later. and should go back to sleep because he didn't fully wake up.

[Worriedaboutwee]

I have never heard of making or asking a child to hold their wee in for the sake of sleep . If you wake up in the night do you force yourself to lie there until it hurts or just go to the toilet?
A lot of adults don't go all night without going to the toilet, my 6 year old occasionally gets up for a wee in the night so why on earth people are suggesting making a two year old wait til morning for a wee is totally beyond me

[Piratejones]

A lot of adults don't go all night without going to the toilet, my 6 year old occasionally gets up for a wee in the night so why on earth people are suggesting making a two year old wait til morning for a wee is totally beyond me

People meaning one person, me.

Because once he's out of bed he doesn't get back in bed?

I suggested slowly lengthening the time he holds it, Hopefully it will mean he slowly wakes up later. It isn't mad or off the wall, it's bladder training.

The problem here isn't him getting up for a wee it's that he doesn't go back to sleep, you will notice a number of suggestions to help the Op given by most posters here, apart from "some people" (Meaning you of course).

[Worriedaboutwee]

Well then I do hope the OP find some of the suggestions helpful and doesn't listen to some people's (meaning you of course ) advice regarding bladder training.

Bladder training can only successfully take place is there is enough vasopressin hormone. This hormone inhibits urine production at night and until it kicks in "bladder training" just isn't possible.

Having had 2 bad sleepers and an early riser I do understand your predicament OP and I hope you find a solution that works for you soon.

[poocatcherchampion]

I think this is 2 separate issues.

When yoy are asleep you don't need the loo.
You wake up a bit and something kicks in and you do.
However if my dds wake up for the loo thry wake up yelling "wee wee need a wee wee"
It sounds to me like he is waking up normally and then after a short while needing his morning wee, which further brings him into the land of day.
So your problem is standard early waking.

Have yoy successfully dealt with that before?

If doesn't happen much here so no good advice but we have an alarm clock that goes off and they are to stay in their room quietly until it does. So in your situation we would take him too the loo all quietly then back in bed - with a "night night, its still nighttime."

[Jasonandyawegunorts]

Bladder training can only successfully take place is there is enough vasopressin hormone. This hormone inhibits urine production at night and until it kicks in "bladder training" just isn't possible.

That's why bedwetting happens... But the OP's child isn't bedwetting, The op's child is making the hormon, he's waking up to use the toilet and not going back to sleep.

You seem to have missunderstood the thread and the advice pirate has given.

[Jasonandyawegunorts]

bladder training Isn't possible

What rubbish, of course it's possible. I say this as a 27 year old with Bladder issue who has had bladder training advice from an enuresis clinic.

[Piratejones]

Bladder training can only successfully take place is there is enough vasopressin hormone. This hormone inhibits urine production at night and until it kicks in "bladder training" just isn't possible.

FFS the OP's child doesn't bed wet, so this has nothing the fuck what so ever to do with vasopressin or bed wetting.

The OP is asking for advice because her child is waking up at 4:30, weeing and not going back to sleep.

The advice that has been given is

1. Wake up an hour earlier, lift the child while they are half asleep so a full bladder doesn't wake them.
   
   or
   
   
2. slowly increase the length of time between the child asking for a wee and taking them to the toilet to train the bladder.
   
   No one is telling her to make the child wait until the fucking morning. What you have done is taken one comment that says "ideally holding until morning is what you want" and twisted it out of the context of the rest of the thread and got everything wrong.
   While at the same time adding no advice to the thread at all.

[Worriedaboutwee]

I haven't misunderstood the thread in the slightest thanks I was merely replying to the poster who thinks making children wait til morning for a wee is a good idea. And I am medically correct thanks Jason, although I should have added the words 'in children'.

Having been through it at length myself I am acutely aware that bladder training in adults is entirely different to potty training toddlers.

[Jasonandyawegunorts]

I was merely replying to the poster who thinks making children wait til morning for a wee is a good idea.

No poster has said this!

[RoganJosh]

I don't think I'd be happy telling a small child that they aren't allowed to go to the loo. I'd be lifting when I went to bed and buying a stick on blackout blind.

[Artandco]

I wouldn't ever stop a child going to the toilet either. I don't think it's Needed. All mine have been dry in day by 18 months, dry at night around 2. That's with going to the toilet when they like. As I said, between roughly 2 and 3 years they still wanted us to go with them to the toilet during the night. Not an issue tbh.

[Marioswife]

As the problem is him going back to sleep i think setting your alarm and lifting him is the best thing to do.

artandco
Did you have a problem getting them back to sleep?

[Artandco]

Mario - no, but ours co slept at that age so were used to waking, toilet, and happy to get back in bed with us and sleep