Do dairy products *really* make babies mucousy? Any evidence?

[Tinker]

Keep reading that they do but being a sceptic, I want proof! Have a snotty rattly baby who has been since getting a cold, oh, weeks and weeks ago.

[roisin]

I don't know about *evidence. Purely anecdotally:

My ds2 is 6 and we find cutting out dairy when he has a cough/cold has always had a big impact. (But he was dairy intolerant when he was a little baby, so it may be something residual from that.)

[Tinker]

What are the signs of dairy intolerance?

[roisin]

Well in his case having been exclusively bf he started throwing up violently after virtually every meal from about 7 months ... for about 8 weeks!

Until the GP asked me at what point I'd introduced dairy to his diet

We cut the dairy out completely and the vomiting stopped instantly.
We started phasing it back in very gradually about 6 months later and he was fine.

[PutAPeachyInYourSimnelCake]

Well, I get normal dairy intol symptoms inclusing diarrhoea, eczma etc and also i get mucousy (TMI). When I stop dairy they all go. Enough evidence for me! I can replicate it as required, and indeed I haven't yet managed to falsify my research .

Snap with the ds1 1 and 2 too.

[Ledodgy]

Tinker how old is your baby? My 19 week old ds is exactly the same but he's sick alot as well and was diagnosed with mild reflux on monday. Apparently reflux can make them more mucuosy (is that a word?) sounding in the chest area.
While i've got you here I noticed on the conception names thread that you said your first child would have been called Mossley Hill, was that Mossley Hill, Liverpool?

[Tinker]

Hello. No sickness, no diar etc (spelling?) and no rashes. Me and her dad are both allergic to dust types so... Would be such a pain to get rid of dairy. She's 10.5 months.

And yes, was MH in Liverpool. Didn't live there though.

[Ledodgy]

She's probably has a dust allergy Tinker.
I used to live in Mossly Hill, my dd would have been Mossly Hill too

[Judd]

Tinker, I found that DS's bedtime milk made him more phlegmy. I would give him a bath with olbas oil in and think I'd got his chest nice and clear and then....bang...bottle of milk and the phlegm was back.
So I started giving him his bedtime milk with his tea at 5.30pm and would just offer a bit of water before bed. I definitely noticed a difference.
Still gave the usual milk during the day, just made this alteration at bedtime to try and ensure a good night's sleep.

[zebraz]

I first heard this theory that consuming cow's milk products promoted mucus at least 19 years ago (when I was working in an organic food store). Not just in babies, in everybody.

I can think of two pieces of evidence to support that theory:

1. there is evidence to suggest that cow's milk stimulates the wrong things in the immune system, this is why some think that consuming cow's milk products too early in life is a risk factor in developing Type 1 diabetes. This is a very controversial theory, though.
   
   
2. There is very strong anecdotal evidence that some people's asthma (and other chronic conditions) is alleviated terrifically when they stop consuming cow's milk products. Presumably because they are having a mild allergic response to cow's milk.
   
   But personally, I suspect that the theory that cow's milk is somehow related to mucus production has only gotten so much promotion on a very simple folksy understanding of biology/nutrition, which is... that cow's milk products are white/yellowy substances. Mucus is usually a white/yellowy substance. Folk medicine comes to the conclusion that eating a white/yellow substance causes your body to excrete something white/yellowy.

[Tinker]

zebra - that's my hunch as well.

Judd - she's still breastfed but does love yogurt and cheesey sauces. Really loves them

Ledodgy - yes, hope (wrong word) that it is dust. Or she just can't shake off the cold.

[suedonim]

I think Aloha had views about the milk/mucous theory, that it doesn't stand up to scrutinisation. Iirc, people believe milk causes mucous because when you drink it, it leaves a film in your mouth. If the archives are working again maybe a search would reveal what she actually wrote.

[Nightynight]

try this site for a list of symptoms: \link{http://www.dspace.dial.pipex.com/town/park/gfm11/milk4.shtml#Symptoms\No Cows Milk for Me Thankyou}

I have been through this myself and spent years with a permanently runny nose, aches and pains, headaches.

Sorry, but whoever said that the runny nose is just the feeling of milk in your mouth, is talking a load of old cobblers.

[KoolKat]

I have read on kellymom.com and other sources that cow's milk is allergenic. Some health orgs. advise against giving cow's milk under the age of 1. I avoided giving DS any cow's milk under the age of 1 (he was and still is bf) because of family allergies.

Some babies are hypersensitive and even react to a bf mother who eats dairy.

[KoolKat]

Zebraz - I agree - I have a friend who suffered from severe asthma all her life. She has stopped eating all dairy products, wheat and gluten and her asthma has practically vanished.

[PinkTulips]

i have a slight milk intolerance and thats how they affect me, so bunged up and phlegmy they tried to put me on asthma inhalers as a kid. my dd has an intolerance too which causes severe, bleeding blistered nappy rash and aggrevates her exzema so she wasn't on any dairy long enough to find out whether she gets mucousy or not!

[crunchie]

Personally I don't subscribe to allergies etc, however I do find milk coats the tongue, and if I have any sort of cold any dairy tastes and feels foul. Therefore if my kids have snotty colds etc I try to avoid milk and dairy for a few days. Don't know if it works, but I know it does for me.

[edam]

Suedonim's right (at least, Aloha was right). It's a myth that milk creates mucus.

Koolkat, cow's milk isn't a huge cause of allergies. But it is not advised for babies under one for other reasons - IIRC partly to do with cows milk not containing any iron, unlike breastmilk or formula.

[Nightynight]

edam, what proof do you have for saying that?

Does exposure to pollens cause mucus/runny nose for some people, or is that a myth too?

Nobody is claiming that cows milk causes mucus for everybody. Just for some people who are allergic or intolerant to it.

Why is it so hard for people who can tolerate cows milk, to understand that it causes problems to some?

[PinkTulips]

well put nightynight

i know how it affects me but 90% of people i say it to scoff at me and tell me i'm being ridiculous, just coz it doesn't affect them in the same way

[CountessDracula]

Organic milk is the answer it doesn't have the same mucus levels as normal

[bundle]

i too think it's a myth. but organic milk does have higher levels of omega 3's than non-organic

[Tinker]

at spelling mucus incorrectly in the title.

She's only had organic yogurts plus cheese in sauces - non-organic. Don't even make her porridge with milk. And just bf until 6 months.

[swedishmum]

My ds's hearing has improved a lot since we cut down his dairy intake, and my asthma is much better when I don't have cow's milk. Anecdotal I know, but was recommended by our GP.

[Nightynight]

why do you think it is a myth bundle?
Do you have some personal or professional experience of cows milk allergy and intolerance?

I personally dont think there would be a big difference between organic/non organic milk, because the allergy is, I think, usually to proteins, which would be the same. Also, my parents were smallholders, so I had mostly organic cows milk all my childhood, still made me ill.

Cows milk allergy wouldnt be the first thing I would consider if my children had a persistent runny nose, even though there is a history in my family. Id probably just assume that they were getting one cold after another, as they have done in the past.

[PutAPeachyInYourSimnelCake]

You have to remember with these things also that there is lactose intol and casein intol, and what works for won't for the other necessarily.
I've been told about boiling the milk but that didn't work, nor did organic or indeed lactofree (which is infact almost lactofree).

However, Asda had a new lactose free milk in a few weeks ago that I could tolerate better- ie not every day but sometimes.