Naughty Chair???? Has anyone tried it?

[AMYandJESS]

Hello

My dd is 2yrs 9mnths and is hyper active. She, just like every other toodler, doesn't listen to anything I say unless it involves sweets, going to the park etc. If I ask her to do something like put her toys away or stop climbing on top of my washing machine she just doesn't listen and I ask about 7 or 8 times before either screaming at her or getting to the stage where I end up smaking her leg. I have tried putting her in her room but her toys are there so that just defeats the object of the punishment. I have had it suggested to me and I have seen it on Supernanny about the naughty chair and I was just wondering if any1 has tried it and how effective it actually is. It seems to work on the show but lets face it its TV and not best to take that as a prime example.

[AvaLou]

I would firstly say that smacking is counter productive and may cause more problems than it solves.
Actually I can't post any more as I don't want to detract from your original question with a massive rant.

[AMYandJESS]

Thank you for responding to my post, although I would like to point out I didnt ask for advice on smaking my dd and I am not a parent that does it a lot and also I really dont enjoy it at all. I would have appreciated you helping if you could with the question I asked and not giving your opinion on something that really doesn't involve anyone else.

[Chandra]

As long as you give up and end up screaming to her or smacking her you are fighting a lost battle.

Speak to her as you would like to be spoken to, I have notice that if my DS (3) notices a hint in my voice that tells him I'm getting annoyed hisplaying up goes wild!. So, I would designate a boring area in the house for her to go when she has misbehaved, but choose your battles, children at this age can't/will not be perfectly behaved but eventually -I hope- things will get better.

Get the Super Nanny book, the technique of the naughty step is a bit "precise", if you don't do it as book suggests or keep changing the way you use it, it won't work. If you are consistent, it will.

[AMYandJESS]

Thank you for that I hope none of you have actually got the impression I am abbusing my dd because Im not these are things I have done in the past and certainly not on a regular basis

[poppiesinaline]

I have done the naughty step. Fortunately (so far) I have had kids that stay there when they are put there. A friend of mine, her lo kept getting off the step and she kept putting her back, and back and her DD ended up having a tantrum about the step and the original 'sin' got forgotten about. Not sure what I would do in that situation. Anyway, for me, yes the step worked. (didnt do a chair - bit worried they might fall off it)

I also used a book called 1 2 3 Magic by Thomas Phelan. That helped me lots too.

[Lizzie4]

Briefly introduced the use of a naughty room (the dining room)which provided useful "time out" for me and my Daughter when things got testing. Usually found that after about a minute, the challenging behaviour would stop and she would call me, asking to come out. We would have a quiet chat about the behaviour in question followed by a cuddle - the matter was then quickly forgotten about.
Very effective, though difficult to begin with. Can't remember the last time I had to use it.

[Mercy]

AmyandJess, like most things it depends on the individual child.

I tried the naughty step briefly with my dd, it didn't really work, and my ds, who is a bit younger than your dd, wouldn't have a clue what I was talking about.

Basically I've found it doesn't really work with toddlers because they are too young to understand. By the time they are old enough to understand, a different approach is often needed anyway.

[fattiemumma]

no one said you were abusing your daughter. Avalou just pointed out that by useing a smak as form of punishment it is in itself a counter productive move. if you chose to smack thats your business and i am certainly not getting involved with a pro/anti smacking argument.

with regards to the Naughty chair.
yes when implemented correctly this method can be very usefull however i would advise not to use what you see on the supernanny programme as a guideline.

when your DD is misbehaving tell her that you want her to stop.
if she continues warn her that if sahe continues you will put her on the time out step/naughty chair etc
if she persists, without speaking go to her, take her hand and put her onto the step. Drop to her level and say she is to stay there for 2 minutes because XXXXX

you chose the place where the child is to sit for a period of 1 minute for every yearof life - for your daughter that would be 2 minutes- if the behavour was very severe you can increase it by 1 minute of extra thinking time but no more.

when the child gets off the chair, don't demand she apologises. this is counterproductive as what is the plan for if she refuses? put her back on the chair?
when she gets off the chair the original behaviour is forgottena nd you try your very best to praise her at the earliest moment.
this teaches attention for good not bad.
so "good sitting" "your playing really nicely well done" etc etc

it will not owrk wonders overnight an yo will have to choose which behaviour constitutes time on the chair.
you must persevere and anyone who disciplines her will need to uyse the same method for it to work.

[AMYandJESS]

Fattiemumma thank you very much for that it has really helped greatly appreciated

[BadMuther]

Remember that you only ever see Supernanny dealing with really bad cases where the parents have totally lost control, or who never had a clue in the first place. What Supernanny does is serious remedial work on children who simply do not know how to behave because they have never been taught!

My daughter had all her 'basic training' instilled in her from babyhood. When she became a toddler, she acted out like all the other toddlers and threw tantrums etc. I used to time her out by making her leave the scene (she could go anywhere else, I never made her sit on a step of a chair) and telling her she couldn't come back until she could 'behave properly' ~ that way she still had some degree of control over herself and could decide when to return. Often she would be away for quite a while before she was ready to behave herself, and sometimes she would pack it in immediately.

Don't worry, I used to smack my daughter on the leg when she was your daughter's age because it was the best way to put an immediate halt to her doing something dangerous. I would smack if she ignored my "NO!", and my "if you do that again you will get a smack" ~ often those warnings were enough, but sometimes they push you hard and press your buttons. I only used the flat of my hand and never any implemement ~ but those who tell you that you can 'reason' with a toddler are usually those red~faced individuals in supermarkets saying "don't do that darling, please, that's not a very nice thing to do..." as their children trash the joint, and wonder why other people are so intolerent towards young children!

There is a massive difference between an occasional smack on the leg and wholesale child abuse, there needs to be some common sense applied here. People who say they will never smack are far more likely to be pushed over the edge by a child that knows it can do what it likes, and far more likely to lash out in anger in a far more dangerous way.

You cannot reason with a toddler, they don't yet have the capacity to understand, and distraction techniques tend to avoid the issue and are only really useful in the short term when you're stuck out in public with a red~faced bawling kid! Eventually, kids need to know what behaviour is "unasseptable" ~ in the words of Jo the Supernanny!

Reasoning is for older children and then smacking becomes unnessary and self~defeating. Then you need other sanctions!

For what it's worth AMY&JESS, your daughter sounds like a normal toddler, and I wouldn't allow anyone to make you feel bad about your parenting techniques when you're asking for advice about how to do better.

[Greensleeves]

"People who say they will never smack are far more likely to be pushed over the edge by a child that knows it can do what it likes, and far more likely to lash out in anger in a far more dangerous way."

Er....that's bullshit.

[Socci]

Message withdrawn

[hunkermunker]

BadMuther...

[fattiemumma]

agree that encouragment is a far more usefull tool at this age than punishment.

also do not believe that non smackers are the ones who end up losing their tempers.
Yes of course their are people who will be having a bad day and smack out of temper. they normally feel guilty about something that the child has already forgotten but its not abuse or dangerous in most cases.

the times when a child is truely hurt is when a parent smacks the child as a regular punishment but they seem to loose the control, the child becomes so used to the punishment it holds no threat,..the smacks get harder and harder and in some occasions things like slippers/belts are introduced.

I have been to visit families where they honestly believe that the violence they show their teenagers is acceptable as a punishment. they dont see what they are doing is wrong because it is just an extaension of smacking.

my own personal rule is this - would you get away with doing that to an adult? if not then it probably isn't the best solution to your problem.

[fattiemumma]

just to clarify i am not accusing either posters here of abuse or anything else..just repsonding to the paragraph which has already been pointed out

[BadMuther]

Actually my name is pretty tongue~in~cheek in that I am continuously complemented for the way in which I have raised my happy, smart daughter ~ that's why I'm here, to give out some helpful advice that I have found that actually WORKS!

People can ignore it if they like ~ but I don't think that judging others who are asking for help is, well....helpful.

And anyone can only say "bullshit" in response to my comment probably could use a good dictionary, and actually try using some nous to actually say WHY she thinks it is "bullshit", rather than just posting a one~word reply that helps nobody.

So this is how someone who would advocate some other method of dealing with kids actually reasons? Wonderful! I wonder how your children learn anything!

I don't think some of you people actually want to help any other mums out there, I just think you want to judge. At least the lady who started this thread was being honest ~ and in being so is far less likely to seriously hurt her child.

I just wonder what taking a peek at some of your parenting might reveal?

Go figure.

[BadMuther]

Thanks fattiemuumma for adding your very well~reasoned comments to this thread!

I agree 100% with what you say, and certainly there is point at which smacking is just redundant ~ usually at the point at which the child says "doesn't hurt mummy" and at that point it is time to stop even comtemplating doing it anymore, because that is the point at which some parents will go looking for something that DOES hurt, like the belt or the slipper, and then it just spirals out of control.

My mother was one of these: she used a stick, a horsewhip and she pulled my hair ~ this went on into my late teens ~ until I got big enough to hit her back.

As I said, common sense is the key. I've had violence done to me, and I KNOW the difference between a smack and beating!

I was determined never to be like her, and the smacking went by the wayside years ago when I could reason with my daughter as she got older and could understand WHY somethings are dangerous. It's worth mentioning that I'm not like my mother in other ways too, I also give a lot of cuddles and hugs...still.

[Socci]

Message withdrawn

[hunkermunker]

I can't understand bullying small people, but that's just me.

And I would put "naughty chair/step" or whatever in the bullying category, tbh.

[Greensleeves]

I didn't think your groundless, clumsy, un-evidenced claim merited more than a one-word response, BadMuther.

But since you request a more detailed explanation of my position, I'll give it to you. In my experience, physical child abuse generally occurs in families in which physical punishment at some level is the norm. I grew up in such a family myself and am not without experience of other such families. I know many many families in which physical punishment is not the norm, indeed is not used at all. These are not parents who are unusually permissive or fail to discipline their children - they simply have the imagination, intelligence and self-control to find other ways of doing so than by hitting them.

It was your breathtakingly ignorant and offensive generalisation - this one - "People who say they will never smack are far more likely to be pushed over the edge by a child that knows it can do what it likes, and far more likely to lash out in anger in a far more dangerous way." which made me feel compelled to post.

Yep - still bullshit .

I'd rather be guilty of using a mild swearword on an adult website than hitting somebody three feet smaller than me, because I thought it was the best way to control her infant behaviour.

Each to their own, eh

[BadMuther]

Don't worry, I'm a veteran on message boards and have known quite a few people who behave as Greensleeves does!

I think she needs to find a new way of expressing herself, but that's just my opinion! I don't think posting stuff like that is at all helpfull to the person who came in looking for advice, or to anyone else reading this thread with the same problem.

I would say though: careful never to say "never" ~ at least until you are through the difficult period with children where they will press your buttons. I guarantee that even the most grounded, centered person will lose their rag at some point, and yes, they MAY lash out.

The smackers I have known ~ and that's most of the people I know personally ~ would far rather have that sanction used with a cool head (and thusly without guilt) and know that it is effective BEFORE the child causes you to lose your temper, and that's the point, I never smacked my child because I was angry.

People who are anti~smacking are NOT immune from losing their tempers.

[mcnoodle]

BadMuther - I can only say that your totally unsubstantiated theorising about parents who don't smack is as unconsidered as Greensleeves eloquent comment.

Please expand on your theory that parents who don't smack are more likely to end up 'losing it' and inflicting disproportionate violence.

I'm rarely moved to post, but your view needs challenging IMO.

[hunkermunker]

BM, are you saying that people who say they'll "never smack" might do one day because they're tormented to that position?

Is there anything you find totally abhorrent you'd be tormented into?

[mcnoodle]

Oh nd whilst I'm in the mood, the OP specifically stated that she did not want to discuss the smcking issue - so Badmuther, were you being unhelpful when you posted your 'advice'?

I think so.