morloth, sometimes the boys want to wear the pink ones

ER, no just the one change here. I tend to assume he'll only do one really messy thing Also, if he's sick or whatever then I'd usually be picking him up soon after so he'd only need one change then as well

yabu I think the nursery have a right to assume that whatever you dress him in is chosen as suitable for the environment in which they work - ie that you don't mind what happens to it, within reason. It isn't necessarily a case of using scruffy clothes just being sensible. For some parents a designer top is fine, for others it is a multi pack from a supermarket or hand me downs. Often the cheaper stuff will go on a hotter wash. You took the risk but there is no reason why the "ruined" t shirt and the others can't now be a spare or used only for nursery days. As to the shoes, dd jumped in a pond in her new startrites at aged 5 , it happens but they dried out.

I'm afraid this doesn't go away as they get older either - ds new £20 school jumper soon had acrylic paint on the sleeve and dd's dresses(£30 new) have suncream on the collar - so I don't bother with many brand new items !

What is undignified about a boy in knickers?

Daft question do you send your DC to nursery with several changes of clothes?
DD never comes home from nursery looking mucky as nursery will change her each time she gets mucky or wet.
Also I buy DD's clothes nearly exclusively from charity to shops so if something does get badly stained, I'm not bothered as its probably cost a couple of quid. Shes about the best dressed child in the nursery, a posh frock for everyday!
Aside from the above Im surprised the nursery let the children play with permanent markers and that the children are getting so mucky, DD's nursery use tabards for painting and strip the children down for wet play.

the first part of my reply was the official line, following proceedure

the part about the knickers was more tongue in cheek, and just pointing out that everything does not go smoothly and as we would wish. Obviously, if pants were available, I would put them on, but sometimes, there just arn't any available any I use whatever is there. I don't just 'ignore' proceedure. I never said that.

Of course I have my own ideas and opinions, but they can be followed within procedures and guidelines. You say the nappy thing is because of children's necessary dignity, then say you choose to ignore this wrt boys in knickers..

It just makes no sense you can't use rules as a reason for something then ignore them when it suits.

pp - I'd expect my DS's nursery to mainly follow the procedures in place. If the procedures don't make sense then they should be changed n general by people who know they are in line with law / guidance / ofsted. Obviously common sense is a must but I'd be nervous about the 'pointless red tape' attitude!

Opps, must remember to proofread

Due to the above using the words "present in the room" I feel it could now be argued that Minimum Ratios apply PER ROOM and not as a nursery as a whole.

oh ffs VS
lighten up
or do you not have your own ideas and opinions in your perfect little world, just proceedures to follow?

that was to VS, but thanks for the detail as well nn

Thanks for clarifying about the ofsted thing - I was fairly shocked, can't remember the details (though they were 1 or under - think it might have been 6 of them in a circle with one staff member or 10ish with 2) but thought I had been overreacting.

Staff ratios have been made more clear with the introduction of EYFS (link to EYFS Statutory Framework, May 2008). EYFS has changed the wording, so that it is much clearer that staff must be physically with the child in their ratio.
"The ratios relate to staff time available to work directly with children. Sufficient suitable staff must be available to cover staff breaks, holidays, sickness and time spent with parents, in order to ensure that the ratio and qualification requirements are always met in relation to the staff working directly with the children. Additional staff may be required to undertake management tasks, prepare meals, maintain premises and equipment and so on."

The ratios in EYFS are the MINIMUM, they are not the recommended. Nurseries are expected in my view to have more staff than are required by the minimum ratio.

The ONLY exception now for the Minimum Ratio is when the children are resting.
(Source: EYFS Framework, May 2008)
"Exceptions to the requirement that staff included in the ratios must be working directly with the children may only be made in limited circumstances, such as when the children are sleeping or resting. In these circumstances all the adults need not be present in the room with the children, but should be available nearby on the premises should they be needed."

Due to the above using the words "present in the room" I feel it could not be argued that Minimum Ratios now apply PER ROOM and not as a nursery as a whole. I would like the next edition of EYFS to clarify that, as although "working directly with children" is better than in the past, it still isn't saying that ratio applies PER ROOM (except for in the exemption).

SPB - "We can't always get to the bags when they need changing...sometimes we can't leave the room".
I would see that as being a management problem - bags are not located in an easily accessible place. Why can't the bags be stored in the room? If the bags can not be stored in the room... then someone who is not part of the Minimum Ratio should be getting the bag in my view.

curlygal - I feel letting your child get into a paddling pool while wearing their shoes shows a lack of supervision. Sure children will try to get into water wearing all their clothes... but I feel staff should intervene before the child gets to the water.

Going to a child who is about to start painting and saying 'ooh, are you going to do some painting, let's get an apron on then' isn't the same as interrupting. Interrupting would be going over to him when he is painting and telling him he has to do something else.

WRT ratio, yes sometimes someone may have to leave the room but that should be limited. If OFSTED were to come into the nursery and find 3 members of staff out of the room, therefore being completely out of ration then yes, they would be unimpressed. (ATM at my nursery, because one member of staff is constantly out of the room messing up ratios, management are considering disciplinary action because ratio is so important)

Purepurple, you said 'yes, I am contradictory, it's what makes me me.' but we aren't talking about what makes you you are we? This is about a nursery's procedures, not your personal ideas.

VS, horses for courses
yes, I am contradictory, it's what makes me me.
I can't comment on any other nursery but in ours we have continious provision, which means we have lots of messy activities out all at the same time. Our ratio does not allow us to sit and watch every activity all of the time. we have to flit about and supervise it all. Also, the children are encouraged to be independent and do things for themselves, so they do get messy. Even with aprons on.

Yes that's exactly it - so if you stopped my DS smearing paint on his T-shirt, would you not be interrupting? Obviously I wouldn't want them to get the paints out, stick the kids in the room and go off for a cup of tea

Would they? It was on MN I heard that after I asked a question after seeing something in DS's old nursery.
I would hope the ratios should be room by room (as yours obviously is) but if one member of staff needs to pop out to get a bag or go to the toilet, they don't have to get someone to replace them for 30s iyswim? I think that's how DS's nursery works it.

The children should be supervised with everything they do SPB, according to the EYFS, we are meant to observe all their play, not interrupt, but watch.

I agree it's probably quicker to put an apron on that change them all afterwards, but OTOH my DS would probably take it straight back off again! Not sure about supervision - unless they're doing something dangerous shouldn't they be allowed to get on with it? I send my DS to nursery because he's allowed to smear paint and mud everywhere and all I have to do at the end of the day is strip his clothes off and dump him in the bath

I can't comment on whether staff ratios are meant to be throughout the nursery because as far as I am aware they should be per room, at least at our nursery it's how we work, under twos ratio is 1:3 not sure about over twos but in effect your nursery is saying that there could be 13 members of staff in, ten of them in one room with say 20 children and 2 with 9 babies? IME, OFSTED would flip a lid if they saw that.

purepurple you say children are entitled to dignity therefore they can't walk around in their nappy yet you put knickers on boys?
Sounds a bit contradictory.

And those who say that cleanliness is being put before developmental play, bollocks. It takes seconds to put an apron on a child who is about to paint, and a painting activity should be properly supervised, so really a child coming home covered in paint is not being supervised properly or the staff just do not care. Same goes with a child walking in a paddling pool with his shoes on, did they not notice? if so I'd be incredibly worried that a child was around a substantial amount of water not being properly supervised, or again, the staff did see but didn't care.

Thanks VS. Not sure about own clothes only - if the clothes I send him to nursery in aree scruffy you can imagine what the 'spares' look like I don't have a problem with him wearing any old clothes as long as they fit. OTOH finding the label to check the size would probably take longer than just going to his bag.
Ratios are fine I think - was to learn that ratios don't have to be in each room but in the nursery as a whole - so I think this happens when another child is at the toilet or whatever. I also don't care if the postman sees DS in a nappy (there wouldn't be passers by) but I can see why they would start educating the children about their right to be covered up if they want to, and respect when getting changed etc so I don't really mind that either.

I ahve to say DS comes home an absolute scruff (when they don't change him to look like Daffyd from Little Britain) and most of it washes out fine. Suppose it depends on the paint they use though. I agree - the odd stain is fine as long as it's clean and not ripped.

Actually SPB at our nursery we wouldn't put on any random child's clothes. The bags are right next to the door and if I can't grab it then someone else can, it takes about 30 seconds and if I COULDN'T for whatever reason (which tbh, if I wasn't able to then I would be questioning child:staff ratio) then the child would be able to stay in their nappy, we've had half the nursery in their nappies this week due to the weather, and ALL children throughout the nursery are stripped down into vests and nappies for sleep time, but then if someone was looking in our windows they'd be moved on...it certainly wouldn't be used as a reason for anything.
Personally I'd tell your child's keyworker that although once or twice coming home in some nursery clothes is understandable you'd appreciate it doesn't happen again, you provide clothes for him and unless they are all dirty then you want him to wear his own. Nursery clothes should be used as spares, not because it's 'easier' for the staff member. Just seems lazy to me.

sorry the future.

No-the stained Tshirt from OP which would be fine for nursery and it wouldn't matter in future what happened to it!

My DS's? Just because he can't cram his head through the head hole without giving himself a headache

I would also like to know why the Tshirt is unwearable?!

Right, thanks, I wondered if it was a dignity thing - although he regularly wanders round in a nappy at home I can see why that might not seem appropriate at nursery
Still think it's not on to cram him into clothes that are far too small though (it hurts!!) - just leave the mucky ones on for the extra 10 mins then! As far as limiting time goes once they can leave the room, it will take 2 mins to pop out and get it out of his bag, where I make sure it is every morning - as they ask us to!

SPB
it is not considered good practice to leave a child naked and exposed, we never know who might be looking through the windows or who might be visiting, the gas man, the post man, the lady that drops off the fruit. Also children are to be treated with dignity and given privacy.
And sometimes it is difficult to leave the room. Nappies need to be changed or resources fetched or a million and one other reasons.
In that situation, I put on any nursery clothes I can find. Sometimes they are not the right size as we have a limited amount avavilable and often they don't get returned.
And to limit the time we are out of the room changing children I use what is to hand instead of wandering around the nursery for half an hour finding the right size.
Sometimes, I even put knickers on boys or vice versa

Can I ask if IABU on a related point?

DS regularly (more often than not) comes home from nursery in someone else's clothes. I think if they get a bit mucky or wet they just put the nearest thing to hand on him, even though we are asked to take spare clothes in and put them in the bag with his name on . Now I don't mind that so much - his clothes usually vanish at this point but they're never the ones I'm bothered about. However they don't bother to check they're even vaguely the right size before they put them on - the other day he was wearing a 9mo T shirt - he's 2 and a bit! To make it worse, he'd fallen and cut his nose a few days earlier and it was still really sore, he screamed when we carefully took it off so I'd imagine he did they same when they squeezed it on him

I mentioned the next day (not complaining, just said this isn't his T-shirt, it's too small for him, and there should always be a change in his bag) and she said "We can't always get to the bags when they need changing...sometimes we can't leave the room". presumably if they're the only one in the room. So is there some rule they can't leave him topless for 10 minutes??

morloth, you are wise beyond your years

hippopotamouse "I find having low standards helps in situations like this!"

I find having low standards for everything helps a great deal with all situations!

I sometimes don't need to have a chat with nursery staff at the end of the day, I know DD has had strawberries for snack, spag bol for lunch, and has been painting and doing sticky pictures just by looking at her! I find having low standards helps in situations like this!

here here purepurple

I would still like to find out how the t shirt could be unwearable

I work in a nursery and I am amazed at how parents seem to value their children's clothes more than their children.

Nursery is a messy place.
We have painting, felt pens, dry wipe pens, sand, water,playdough, glue EVERY day. all day.

Children get their dinner down them all the time, they are learning to be independent.

Outside it gets wet and muddy and we go out EVERY day.
Suncream is a bugger to apply to 20 plus children but we slap it on to stop the parents complaing about their children burning

I have brand new work tunics that are covered in paint stains but i still have to wear them.

OP, just be happy that your son is having such a good time.

My mantra is ' a mucky child is a happy child'
YABU, especially to tell a child to be careful with his shoes
attitudes like that rub off on children and it stops them from taking part in some activities and can seriously affect their development.

YABVU

get over it
how can the t shirt be unwearable ??

<rolls eyes>

Clothes will get stained. At our nursery there are aprons for painting - kids forget to put them on, it happens.

The kids have indoor shoes for nursery, usually black gym shoes which cost about £2-£5. They get messy but who cares.

Kids will be kids

Unless you hover over the DC you can't keep them clean! Even in school I spend time saying things like 'roll your sleeves up-your mum isn't going to like it if you are covered in black paint!' -it isn't a priority with DCs.

agree with children getting paint underneath the tabard- both mine were expert at that and I know they put them in tabards at the nursery

ds is 9 but he can still get himself covered in ink simply by writing a letter with a biro

I have learnt by now not to blame the school

I never understand why people fuss about clothes at an age when they are cheap, or you can get them second hand-save the money until they are older and care about image!

I love my DS coming home in clothes all stained and dirty! It shows he's had a great time.. LOL...

He wore his brand-new £25 Clarks sandals (tried cheaper brands but he just would not have them on!) to nursery the other day and came back with the biggest glob on paint on it (as well as various scruff marks...). Sigh! He does have various holes and stains on many items of his clothing that I have no idea how he gets but I do buy a lot of his clothes off MN and I have no qualms about putting my next DS (still cooking at the moment) in these clothes again! But then again, you are talking to someone who just ain't that great about doing housework and not that bothered about it...

Curlygal - Sorry to hear you are having a hard time but there's no need to throw away clothes just cos they are stained. No one really cares if your DS is in stained clothes. And you should take advantage when they are at the age where they don't really give a toss what they are wearing! I am not looking forward to the day they start to understand about branded clothes/shoes etc!

Heck my 2.9 year old can come home from nursery looking like she fell out of a skip! She wears a tabard for painting but manages to get paint underneath where the tabard covered. I believe this is a common talent for children.

And she can outrun any nursery nurse, so if she was hellbent on getting in the paddling pool with her shoes on before they could intercept her then she would.

I buy her nursery clothes from Asda (a quid for a T-shirt) and have to accept that her shoes will be battered within 20 minutes of getting them. That's life with a pre-schooler

If a DC comes out of nursery clean it can't be a very good nursery! Get cheap second hand clothes-a DS that age doesn't care what he looks like-it is far more important that he can get dirty!

As a nursery nurse/manager don't think your being unreasonable but....I have seen many a child lift their apron and wipe their paint covered hands on their top, have no idea why! Also re:his shoes, perhaps he was just over keen, doubt very much they allowed him to do it, rather that he just couldn't resist and jumped in before someone could stop him . Does sound like he had a fab day though.

Agree that even washable paints stain, we do indeed put washing up liquid in ours. If i'm honest I would have had a go at washing the top before you arrived if it was so bad but then again when i have done this a parent yelled at me for messing up her washing rota (think she had a bad day at work!)

I do think you have to get used to this for your own sanity. On getting dressed my ds can look like the most clean, fresh-skinned, glowing, mini-boden-clad child model....within one minute, and I do not exaggerate, he can look like I have never bothered wiping his face and clothe him entirely in jumble sale bargains. It is just something that happens. The thing is not to mind.

IABU tonight re my spelling. Luckily the part of education I work in does not involve any teaching of spelling whatsoever

YABitU, I do send DD to nursery in "nursery clothes", which are usually very cheap clothes and it doesn't really matter if they get dirty/stained, BUT I still can't bring myself to send her back to nursery in anything with the minutest stain on. I know I am incredibly precious about it, but I just can't. You already know you were unreasonable to expect him to to be careful with his shoes (you need crocs I suspect, I wish I could get them, but DD refuses to wear them ).

I don't think that being disappointed that your child's clothes were ruined equates to you with not wanting to have him involved in fun activities. I know that IABU but I couldn't send DD in with a stain on her clothes.

bet if she checks the paint they were using in Nursery, it would say 'Washable'
Readymix is tricky like that.

You are allowed to be annoyed. But you will need to get used to it. Its going to keep happening for years

Its very annoying if they are not using washable paint. Its pretty weird TBH. If they are ordering it from educational suppliers it would be (they are not nipping down to the local pound shop to get it are they? )

I like my kids to look nice but you have to comprimise. Get a load of cheap stuff (as suggested from asda etc) that you like but is fairly disposable. Steer clear of white, yellow and orange (why is orange the colour that attracts the most filth?). Dress DS in clothes that show stains less and buy lots of washable trainers.

It is a good sign for kids to come home a bit paint spattered and sandy but I am not sure about absolutly filthy/soaked/in rags. I would be a little bit worried that they were not being watched properly.

But one of my boys could be under 24hr survailence and still manage to look like he had been living under a bush for a fornight

I'm not going to offer any suggestions here, other than to say my son is 14.
So a list of all the stains, rips, tears, indelible gloop and gunk that he's managed to acquire over the years would be endless.
Suffice to say that the OP will either have to come to terms with it or live a life of unmitigated horror and despair over the next couple of decades.
I am awaiting his return from camp on Sunday.
Last time he incinerated a pair of walking boots when attempting to put out a campfire.
The time before, his shirt was torn in two whilst tree climbing.Not to mention the potholing grime.
He has had an enormous amount of fun, but acrylic, gloss and emulsion paint are truly unwashable in my experience, which is why he has special clothes for that sort of activity.
If the only thing you have to disturb your sleep is rather scruffy clothing on a happy child, you are onto a winning formula.

I can see where you are coming from OP- I DO have "nursery clothes", but I would feel skanky dressing my dc in clothes that were really badly stained (as opposed to a little bit!) I have been mildly cross (although, of course, said nothing, just grumbled to DH ) at paint on clothes when dd1 was at nursery. I brought in a tabard thingy, and casually mentioned to the nursery nurse that it was in her bag if they needed it. "Oh no- we've got loads! it's just that sometimes the kids don't really feel like wearing them!" And, yes, why wouldn't you use washable paints/ pens? It just seems like common sense to me!

I think other posters who are accusing the OP of putting her child's appearance before his enjoyment are being a bit unfair. I was always happy to see mine come home a bit dirty, especially if they'd been out in the garden. And food stains are a fact of life. But surely when painting/ going in paddling pools etc all it takes is a few simple precautions and the child can have fun without getting clothes so completely wrecked they have to be thrown in the bin. Nursery care is expensive enough!!

I work at a nursery and am pretty surprised he was allowed to get his clothes in such a state tbh. We may get suncream on clothes at times (I'm assuming you'd prefer this than sunburn though) but paint? why wasn't he in an apron?
Shoes.. well.. IME my OWN children fuck up shoes in a matter of seconds so I'd suggest that wasn't nursery's doing but just a child wearing shoes

OP i think some of the replies are a bit harsh, and i understand why you felt annoyed by the ruining of ur kids clothes. I would probably feel the same, but extra nursery clothes will be a good idea to avoid it in future.
Mine are not at nursery yet, but i would not really expect them to come back filthy. Can they not just put some kind of apron on for painting to at least minimise the damage or use washable paint? It is quite wasteful if perfectly good clothes are being ruined on a daily basis. I would prefer them to have fun but not totally ruin the clothes @ the same time? whether that is unrealistic I dont know

Morloth
Cory I don't expect everyone to take the same view as I do! I don't stand in judgement over anyone whose child has a stain on their tshirt!

If my ds became a decorator or mechanic I presume he would have overalls...but anyway it would be up to him as an adult what he wore and that would be fine.

TBH if you pay 25p for a tshirt from a car boot sale that is probably as cheap as the cost of washing and ironing one.

!

aww guys, c'mon

OP has revealed she is a bit fragile atm so cut a bit of slack now eh

YABU, you need clothes for nursery and clothes for home. If you feel so strongly about him leaving the house in good clothes then ask the nursery to keep clothes there that he can have fun in.

My dd is in nursery 2.5 days a week and comes back a crusty, stained, happy mess. She loves nursery and I wouldn't change it for the world.

You can buy a 3 pack of T's for £2.50 in different colours from Sainsburys. Match these with some cheap joggers and there you go. Easy Peasy.

Also I'm just wondering if you allow your ds to do messy stuff at home? You should get dirty too, it's amazing fun.

FWIW I don't think YABU. We have "nursery clothes" and "non nursery clothes". When DD goes up into the next size or the weather changes it always grieves me to see a brand new T shirt (however cheap) covered in stains that never come out. With us it tends to be food rather than paint but it is frustrating

Podrick on Fri 03-Jul-09 17:40:57
"FWIW I wouldn't dress my child in stained clothes - so if a paint mark didn't come out I would chuck the item away. Cheap second hand car boot sale clothes I am fine with , but stained / damaged clothes no."

So what if he grows up doing a dirty job, like a car mechanic or a decorator? Would you expect him to throw his clothes away at the end of every working day?

Lots of people go to work in stained clothes because of the nature of the work.

To my mind, painting and glueing is work, and needs to be done with the best tools, even if that does mean paints that don't wash out easily.

Podrick If I did that I would have to buy DS new clothes every day.

I think other posters are right in saying you need to change the way you view things, for your own sanity if nothing else

So the t-shirt has paint stains, so what? That solves the problem of needing an extra nursery t-shirt - the stained one can be kept for that purpose. Throwing them away is just daft and creates expensense and stress for you where it needn't.

Paint that is supposed to be washable isn't always so. We have 'washable' paint and pens at home and I can never get the damned stuff out of shirts!

And I don't see why the shoes were ruined by going in the paddling pool? No different to a puddle or sudden downpour, leave them to dry and they'll be fine again.

Please, if you are going to send your son to nursery you need to learn to not sweat the small stuff or you'll never get through it

(Oh, and they're also right about it being worse when they go to school, especially when they stay on to afterschool club...)

"Nasty and destructive" "insulting"-I think not,I simply disagreed with you and still do.

Sorry if that offends,you asked for an opinion,I gave it. It's unfortunate it wasn't the answer you were hoping for but I hope it's given food for thought.

I'm sorry you're having a bad time I really am,if I can help in any other way I'd be glad to.

FWIW I wouldn't dress my child in stained clothes - so if a paint mark didn't come out I would chuck the item away. Cheap second hand car boot sale clothes I am fine with , but stained / damaged clothes no.

Paint used at school or nursery should be washable and a painting overall should be worn. This is a very reasonable expectation imo.

Children should not be allowed to wear shoes in a paddling pool.

OP is reasonable in expecting this from the nursery and right to be annoyed if clothes are ruined as a result.

This is not the same as not allowing your child to have any fun for fear of ruining their outfit.

curly- you held your own. I still quake sometimes under the weight of everyone telling me I am unreasonable- which they invariably do!

If you flounce I shall have to mock you and I don't want to have do that .

Forget the washing - shove the shoes outside to dry and make a cup tea (taking care not to spill it down your front).

i dressed my 4 yrs old in cheap clothes/older clothes that i can find in the house as i know she be covered in paint etc when i pick her up later. One of her pants is covered in old paint that cannot wash out but she used that at the nursery. i wouldnt dare send her in in her new good/expensive clothes/shoes or otherwise i would choke myself. She does wear her black leather school shoes that can be easily wiped off with water.

am feeling very flouncy now shiney I know I am being sensitive and that AIBU threads are not for wallflowers like me.

Just don;t get the delibrate nastiness of some people

Oh well

Now now Curly Gal

'I am glad not to have come across you on mumsnet before' to Mila is a bit orf

Really this isn't an AIBU is it, because you wanted us all to say 'there there nasty nursery getting your child all messy' and have therefore been upset that not everyone patted your head and made soothing noises

I am sorry that you are having a shit time atm, this parenting lark can be very draining

curlygal- don't flounce will you?!?!

I don't think anyone has been particularly rude as such, maybe a little strident!

Have to say that my little guy has more clothes wrecked at nursery than anywhere else but I do view it as par for the course. Have to say though, I would be slightly pissed off if he got a pair of new shoes wet through at nursery. Not to the point where I would say anything, but inwardly, who WOULDN'T think ' Oh for fuck sake! ' before forgetting about it?

It's fine to disagree with me Mila.

I just find the way you choose to word your posts very odd and I am glad not to have come across you on mumsnet before.

I don;t think that my original post was a "rant" or that it indicates that I put clothes infront of my son's development - you seem to be intent on being nasty and destructive.

I am actually having a really crap time and the moment and I can see that I am blowing the states of DS yesterday out of proportion and that I need to just forget about the T shirt and get a life.

Perhaps it was my mistake posting on AIBU, but many other posters disagreed with me and said "yes you are" without being so nasty and insulting, and to actually add some postive comments that might actually help.

I use mumsnet as a way to communicate with other mums and get an insight into other people's views and tips on parenting.

This thread today has upset me a lot, admittedly partly due to my feeling crap before I even made the mistake of posting, and it's really put me off using mumsnet which is sad as I am sure that most users don't mean to upset other posters, it's just unfortunate that you chose to post on my thread today the way that you did.

Just make the mucky t-shirt a nursery t-shirt now. I really don't see the problem.

My DD has had this happen a couple of times at nursery, it's par for the course. Sometimes she even gets a stain on them at home with me that won't come out .

Getting his shoes wet isn't really ruining them is it. It's just getting them wet.

t's going to be the same with the grass stains from playing football and the oily grease stains from mucking around with his bike- you're just going to have to learn that stained does not equal dirty and that he can and should go on wearing stained clothes when doing dirty jobs

imo nurser clothes are like an overall worn by car mechanic; they don't throw them away every time they get an oil stain on them

Errrr I simply disagreed with you you is that not allowed then .

You've just written a 14 line post ranting about the state of your sons clothes due to the lovely activities he's enjoying at nursery eg painting,water play etc. Not once did you mention that he's lucky to be enjoying said activities.

It's quite clear you would rather his enjoyment be restricted whilst the staff concentrate on keeping his clothes clean so he came home cleaner. I find that very sad and indicative of the fact you rate clean clothes more than your child's development.

Sorry if that offends.

In answer to your original post yes you are being very unreasonable.

Nah don't worry about the paint curlygal it isn't important - he is just going to get MORE paint on it at nursery. So you wash it, the paint stain is there, you put it on him anyway and don't spend another second thinking about it.

Now would you like to hear about the beetroot stain the boy got onto his one and only button up school shirt they other day?

Seriously it really doesn't matter if they clothes have paint on them, even after they have been washed, really it doesn't - no one is going to look at you DS and think "Yuck, that kid has paint on his shirt".

Pointless and destructive?

Okay, I am sorry you have been upset

curly - you do need IME to use a heavy duty biological powder and soaking to get rid of paint and other nasties but it does work in the end - may need a couple of washes

Morloth - if only! I;d love to be able to just wash his clothes but the paint used just won;t wash off so more like "toss it in the bin" and forget about it - so if only I had the cash to just dispose of clothes when ever it happens that would be fine.

curlygal on a lot of the paints used at nurseries it says they will come out with nio-bio powder and IME it usually does.

But you do need to be less precious about his clothes.

Just wait until he is 13 and he comes home with his PE kit covered in mud, that won't come out, after playing rugby. You won't rush out to replace that!

Oops posted that before I read Mila's post.

Just to clarify, I don't care more about clothes than DS's development.

I thought that my post made the point that I was just exasperated at clothes being ruined at nursery.

I really should learn not to post on AIBU as ther are always one or two spiteful responses which make me wonder what those posters get out of just making nasty digs are other people. Mango and Mila's posts were just destrutive and pointless - all they did was make me feel even more crap so well done, good work you two

a young child is not capable of understanding or even trying to keep clothes clean

IMO and DS has been at nursery for 2.5 years is the muckier the child, the better the day

Nursery staff cannot be expected to keep a child looking pristine - in fact that is a total waste of their energy

YABU

curlygal "just too much to deal with at the end of a long day at work."

So toss it in the washing basket and forget about it, works brilliantly!

Cause it doesn't matter CAPape, the clothes get paint on them. They get washed, they get MORE paint on them, who cares - especially if they are only for wearing to nursery.

Under EYFS the chld is allowed to chose whether or not to use a tabard

<stirs>

Thanks everyone.

He didn;t get paint on his shoes (that would be fine as would wash out) he stepped into the paddling pool wearing his shoes and socks.

The T shirt was literally covered barely a spot of white left on it. I was just when I saw him as if they had gone out of their way to make his T shirt and shoes dirty they couldn;t have done a more thorough job.

I will get him some more scruffy stuff but just couldn;t believe the state of him yesterday, just too much to deal with at the end of a long day at work.

I can't believe the op cares more about clothes than her child's development!!!!!!

I love my lot coming home from pre-school dirty it shows they had a good day. To be frank I'd be mighty concerned if they weren't.

The staff at your child's nursery are there to enhance his development not to spend time worrying about his and several other children's clothes.

Oh and red and purple washable paints aren't washable,neither are dry wipes pens.

Children use dry wipe a lot at school I'd resign yourself to your ds having every white polo shirt covered in it. Believe me your child's teacher will be concentrating more on teaching than your child's polo shirts.

I used to get a bit uptight about this. But now I just accept it, and tbh as long as dd is happy and enjoying herself, I couldn't give a fig.

I do consciously minimise the white items though. She ruins them when she's with me.

Our daughter was always coming home from nursery in utterly filthy clothes, and like one of the other posters, we had nursery clothes and non nursery clothes. But oil based paints with 3 & 4 year olds - why would you!!?

YABVU. Just send him to nursery in stained clothes. Then it won't matter.
My DDs always look like complete scruffbags. But they are happy scruffbags.

Glad I'm not the only one sending her child out in stained clothes

DS was/is always filthy - I suggest you get used to it.

Clothes are absolutely wearable for little kid's when they are stained. As long as it has been washed - on it goes. You throw stuff out when it gets stained!?!

Wait until Ds goes to school , infact you will have uniform etc going missing and getting mucky for the rest fo their school days!

Fact of life with kids , very annoying I know , but dont expect nursery staff to worry about one child pair of new shoes that mummy doesn't want to get dirty, when they have 30 or more other kids to look after.

Children get mucky at nursery /playgroup - thats what children do.

If this is the only thing you have concerns about your DS nursery that I think you need to chill out and get to charity shop to pick up some old t shirts that you dont care what happens to them.

Kids do tbhings very quickly and can easily get paint or themselves or others, just takes one child walking to wash their hands after painting and bumps into yours - hey
presto !

re the shoes - ever seen a child walk round a puddle ! Your child could have easily walked out yojur front door in his shinny new shoes and jumped straight into puddle !

Dont be so precious about it all .

I don't think washable paint and pens is unreasonable tbh. I can never get out the food stains from dd's clothes, they do put a bib on her but she still manages to get it all over her clothes.

YABU. He is a small child, and had a great time. I think that at that age if they are immaculate at the end of the day, they haven't done enough.

They can't help the sun cream, and although getting covered in paint is unfortunate, these things do happen.

Buy a bundle of shorts and t shirts from Ebay for nursery wear if you are worried about it. And the Thomas tshirt will be fine to wear to nursery.

no, i do agree they should limit the damage done.,

ds1 goes to nursery and we don't have any nursery clothes, he just wears his regular stuff and we've had nothing ruined so far. if he gets paint/food on stuff it generally washes out.

did you cold soak the top? that often helps. heat will set the stain.

anyway, it might be worth asking them what kind of paint etc they use as you've had yet another top ruined. and also ask if aprons are available for the children to use.
how old is your ds?

You are being unreasonable to ask a nursery age child to be careful with their shoes - why on earth should they? They don't care what state they are in!

Shoes aren't ruined if they get paint on - they are just a bit painty!

I don;t understand why the nursery don;t use washable paint. Or as you suggest nicks a tabard or smock for painting isn;t unreasonable surely?

His tops have been stained by permanent pen adn god knows what kind of paint it was they were using yesterday as vanish, bleach, washing up liquid and boil wash won;t take it off!

I will try and get him some more nursery clothes so that it doesn;t matter if they get ruined, just fed up of having to throw perfectly good clothes out as they are stained by pen/paint that I don;t think they should use in a nursery.

Plus if the child has not been suncreamed you would be on here moaning that he's got sunburn

i think if you know they aren't very good at keeping them clean then you need more nursery clothes.

that said, they ought to be making sure the kids wear aprons and stuff for painting IMO

shoes- tis a pity, but they'll look like that in a week or so anyway so i wouldn't worry too much lol

I sympathise, dd always comes in covered in something after a day at nursery. They say they will strip them down before they paint, but they don't always!
But I think rather than get cross get some more nursey clothes, DD goes head to toe in ASDA or Tesco to nursery, she wears doodles shoes so I can chuck them in the machine. The most important thing is she has fun. I wouldn't let her do half the messy play they do there because we don't have the space. Its all good really.

DH mused on why MIL who has our dd one day a week sends her back immaculate whereas nursery sends her home grubby. I pointed out it was the difference between 1:1 and 4:1 ratios.

Well erm sorry

You knew he was going to get mucky so why are you moaning?

Send him in doodles or crocs

Or perhaps you would prefer that he not express himself by sitting in a corner and not participating in anything??

[rolls eyes]

Its difficult,as a mum I can see your point but also can see hes having great fun at nursery on the the other hand as a nursery nurse I can see its very hard to keep a child clean - I do think that they should be wearing tabards for painting and to allow him in the paddling pool with shoes on isnt something id do.

A good thing to mention to nursery is that a dash of washing up liquid in paint can help stain removal.

DS is in nursery four days a week so often by day four we are running low on "nursery clothes" ie scruffier stuff that he wears to nursery.

Yesterday I dressed him in a white (yes I know) Thomas T shirt (nothing fancy just the white one out of a pack of three) and he happened to be wearing his new summer shoes.

When I dropped him off I mentioned that I knew white wasn;t the best colour for nursery and that he had new shoes on and said specifically to DS to please be careful with his new shoes (his last pair was ruined at nursery).

When I came to collect him I couldn;t believe the state of him. His white T shirt is totally ruined - covered in red paint and yellow sun cream. His shoes and socks were soaked and he had got into the paddling pool wearing shoes and socks.

I've soaked and washed the T shirt three times now and it is not wearable again. The shoes are ok after a wash, but you;d never guess they were new!

Several items of clothing have now been ruined at nursery - about three tops stained with non washable paint, plus the other shoes. Not to mention a lovely cardigan that just "disappeared".

I expect him to get a bit mucky and I know the white T shirt was silly but surely they should at least make an effort not to ruin the children's clothes?