To not get the big fuss over homes for ex serviceman?

[LibidinousSwine]

Admittedly I don't know anyone who would be in need of one so perhaps my view is one-sided. I'm happy to be educated if that's the case.

So why the hype? Our fire and police service personnel risk their lives for us on a daily basis yet there's no clamour for them to be showered with respect and free housing.

Forces veterans who are badly injured I believe can be badly let down on return to the UK which is scandalous. What I'm on about is the perfectly able bodied veterans who have finished a paid career in the forces and now come to retirement age, yet seem to have not managed to plan for this (despite knowing, often for years in advance, when their term would end) Perhaps my view is overly simplistic but as I said, I just don't get it.

[HeySoulSister]

If you don't know anyone facing this where/how, have you forme your opinions?

[BedTimeNow]

Have you watched home for veterans on bbc? (I think that's what it's called).

[LibidinousSwine]

It's been big news lately hey particularly after that programme that bed mentioned (I saw a clip, not the whole thing)

It's more the feeling amongst people I know that you should automatically be entitled to free housing if you have served your queen and country that baffles me.

[EskiDecaff]

I suppose you could be 'able bodied' yet still suffer from mental health issues?
There's hundreds of reasons.
From a police point of view- perhaps i risk my life, certainly not in the same way I would if I was fighting in Afghanistan etc
I also go home most nights and see my family
My family won't be forced to move around due to my job
There's far more stability for the police
Chances of PTSD much much lower
It's my opinion that military families should be at the top of every housing list should they need it
They give far far in excess of what they owe

[Pantone363]

I tend to agree when talking about ex forces who aren't injured, traumatised or suffering PTSD.

My DF is ex forces. Pissed away his payment and constantly bemoans his lack of housing/money/the fact my DM gets half of his pension.

It always seems to be in relation to 'others' being given housing too.

I'm an ex forces child. I could piss and moan about the crap education we got, the shit housing we lived in, the MOD police turning a blind eye to domestic violence constantly and all the other crap that goes with being a forces child.

[EskiDecaff]

A quick Google will tell you the veterans on diy sos either rent or purchased their homes through shared ownership
And that show provides a very anecdotal point of view
Not every military family have those options

[SparklyTinselTits]

YABU. Many ex-servicemen, and currently serving servicemen (my DH included) struggle with PTSD. It is impossible to understand what it is like to try and live a normal life with such a horrible illness unless you have experienced it first hand. Luckily my DH is fine now, and can continue with his job....but when he was ill? He couldn't have a shower by himself because the sound if he accidentally dropped a shampoo bottle terrified him. So imagine, leaving the forces, struggling to do basic daily tasks and trying to sort out a life for yourself, I.e. Renting/buying a home, getting a job and keeping it, doing your own grocery shopping etc. When you can barely function as a human.
PTSD is a hell of a lot more common than people care to admit. And IMO, the least these men and women deserve, is help getting a decent home where they feel safe.

[dontaskdonttell]

I think it's partly because of ex service men and women having several issues because of serving.

1. They often move around constantly during their service, sometimes yearly. This makes it difficult for them to settle somewhere, they lose connections with places. Where they grew up often loses its significance when they move so often and don't get to home much.
2. Mental health reasons. A lot of those who have served over the last 20 years or more, have seen and experienced some horrific things, Northern Ireland, gulf war 1 and 2... This leads to ptsd which can then lead to alcoholism and drug addiction. We all know where these things can lead people and once they are out of the forces there isn't much support for them and they fall through the cracks.
3. Being in the armed forces takes over every aspect of your life and becomes your world in a way the police force etc don't. This means the veterans can struggle when they leave the forces because they are can't handle the change.

My DH is in the army and I see a lot of men struggle with their experiences.

I don't believe in hero worshiping every solider but I do think some need more help on leaving the forces.

They make so many sacrifices daily, from missing the birth of their children to losing limbs in Afghanistan.

[MotherOfFlagons]

I think there's quite a lot of fetishism around the armed forces in this country. If ex-servicemen are disabled physically or mentally then fine, otherwise, I don't believe they have a 'right' to housing over anyone else.

But by way of a disclaimer, I freely admit this is my immediate reaction based on what I've read rather than personal experience.

[SparklyTinselTits]

Well said dontaskdonttell

[HeySoulSister]

Well with endless moves from quarter to quarter a service family won't have 'roots' or have managed to get themselves on the property ladder!!!!

[HeySoulSister]

Oh, and marriage breakdown

[meditrina]

The additional arrangements are not conferring advantage, they are attempting to mitigate disadvantage.

The other emergency service personnel you mention are not mobile in the same way, so if leaving that employment and seeking housing, they can demonstrate links to the area and be accepted onto waiting lists.

Mobile armed forces personnel, without intervention, don't even qualify for the lists.

OK some regional variation, and variation between organisations, but no tie to an area puts you way below just about everyone else. The interventions are intended to get them up to the level of opportunity that firefighters, police etc take for granted.

[LibidinousSwine]

Perhaps my view is slightly clouded by DSS who was in the forces (tours in NI and Afghanistan) and now works as a civilian. He and his wife have managed to buy a house and raise a family with relative ease, probably due to careful planning and a lot of family support while he was away. I suppose not everyone is that focused or fortunate?

[LibidinousSwine]

But meditrina, my point is that why would they need to be on housing lists if they have come from a long term paid job?
If they have been unable to save enough for a deposit or to begin to rent during the time they were employed, in any other job they would be considered feckless.

[SparklyTinselTits]

Libdinious maybe your DSS is fortunate enough to not be injured or suffer PTSD? Unfortunately, thousands of people aren't that lucky.
We are dreading the day that DH's 22 years service are up because we have lived in 7 houses in 8 years, with 5 deployments to Afghanistan within those years. Buying a house has been the last thing on our minds! So when the time comes, we are probably going to struggle to get into the property ladder.

[cardibach]

HeySoulSister moving around doesn't stop you getting in the property ladder - it's more than possible to buy a house for investment purposes but not live in it.

[dontaskdonttell]

Op that's great for your stepson but to say that a soldier who isn't as successful as that, isn't "focused" is unfair.

I agree that it's hard sometimes to accept a soldier getting a house, over say, a family of 4, but the reality is, they aren't. That's why this programme was on (I didn't watch it myself). ex service men and women aren't being take care of, they are leaving the armed forces and have nothing.

Some do, of course. Some save and have positive experiences and come away with a trade and walk into civilian life and prosper. Not all have that experience and the men and women who are vulnerable as a direct result of being in the army, should be looked after and he helped with housing.

[HeySoulSister]

Rent where?

[HeySoulSister]

cardi yes. And pay rent on a house for a family... Where there's likely to be only the one breadwinner??

[meditrina]

Are you really saying, LibidinousSwine that people who have been employed should be unable to apply for social housing?

And that need can only arise from fecklessness?

And you really apply that to everyone?

[PHANTOMnamechanger]

large numbers of ex forces people end up living on the streets - if they leave the forces due to PTSD, injury or whatever, then they have not only lost their job, but their homes, their mates, their whole way of life in some cases.
For some they have never had to find a home, pay bills, learn to budget, feed themselves. As a pp said - these people often have no roots, no family to help out, and may have failed relationships behind them due to the stress of the job. Problems with drink and drugs are not uncommon.

I applaud the idea of providing more homes specifically for ex service personnel.

[dontaskdonttell]

I think people need to remember, that it is a small proportion of people leaving the armed forces that are ending up homeless.

The pay in the army isn't great and some men and women don't get promoted above lance corporal. Personally, DH and I aren't on the property ladder because like sparkly, we have been focused on much more serious things in our lives, like deployments, injuries, being apart so much of the time. We have 2 children, I don't work, it's very hard for military wives to work, for so many reasons which I can explain if you so wish.

So to say that we're feckless because we're not on the property ladder is offensive. Walk a day in our lives and see the reality then come back to us!!

[LibidinousSwine]

Goodness no meditrina

More that it shouldn't be seen as a right to get housed simply because you are a veteran. I hadn't realised the difficulty in getting on housing lists if you needed to and that really should be addressed. It's more that I worry that being housed will be seen as a right rather than a privilege if we apply the same criteria to all veterans.

[SparklyTinselTits]

dontask don't even get me started on military wives trying to get into work.....I got offered my dream job with perfect part time hours, got a start date....then DH got told he was off to the sand pit again bye bye dream job.
It sounds dramatic, but until you've walked a day in the life, you really have no idea. Military life is far from the black and white it seems to be.