Many women have a very low opinion of men

(62 Posts)
greenwinter Thu 01-May-14 10:10:22

As a feminist, I sometimes get told that I have a very low opinion of men, I don't. I think men are (mostly) intelligent human beings who are perfectly capable of behaving well and doing housework and childcare well.

But some women make constant excuses for men, and in doing so, I think don't realise that they actually have a very low opinion of men. For example, saying that men:

- Just don't see mess the same way as women do (as if they haven't got eyes or a brain like us)
- Have difficulty understanding verbal communication (funny how that is only ever the case with their partners communication)
- Just can't multi task like women can

In short, these excuses for men paint men as half blind, incapable and stupid individuals. I think men are much more capable than this, and I think that women should stop making excuses for men.

BuzzardBird Thu 01-May-14 10:11:37

I agree, they treat men like helpless babies.

lollerskates Thu 01-May-14 10:14:15

Completely agree.

BumpNGrind Thu 01-May-14 10:16:00

I'm a feminist and have such a high regard for men that I see myself as equal to them imagine that.

I have a lovey husband who is very capable and was brought up with my amazing father, maybe I was just extremely fortunate that I've never needed to make excuses for the men in my life.

I have an exceptionally low opinion of my husband since I caught him in my bed with another woman but otherwise I agree. I think low opinions should be reserved for people who deserve it (ie my husband) and not a general group of people.

OwlCapone Thu 01-May-14 10:17:06

It's the flip side of the way some men treat women as helpless damsels.

morethanpotatoprints Thu 01-May-14 10:18:06

I think the problem is generalisation, a bit like all women drivers are hesitant and useless.
This used to drive my dad mad, as many women are brilliant drivers.
Some men are like you suggest though and unfortunately women do make excuses for them because they love them.
FWIW, my dh asks me if I can't see the mess or if I'm feeling particularly lazy sometimes. He is far more house proud than me and generally does a better job than me as he has higher standards.

CogitoErgoSometimes Thu 01-May-14 10:18:15

It's patronising and sexist to ascribe generalised, unfavourable attributes to people because they are a particular gender. Then again I'd also like the phrase 'boys will be boys' struck from the lexicon it causes so much damage.

Callani Thu 01-May-14 10:18:24

I agree OP.

It's a pet peeve of mine when adverts show men being helpless (Boots, I'm thinking of you) or if women talk about their husband as if they were an extra child that can't take care of themselves.

How on earth do they think they manage at work???

HotSauceCommittee Thu 01-May-14 10:18:33

Yeah, my DH and man mates are lovely. I don't bother with dicks of either gender.

I am gently challenging my lovely friend when she says, "men! They can't do...". They really can, unless it's give birth or BF.

greenwinter Thu 01-May-14 10:24:25

Callani - I always remember a thread on here where a woman was complaining that her DH was incapable of doing lots of things such as phone calls, organising anything, and that she had to do it all.

It emerged during the thread that her DH actually managed a team of staff. And she was shocked when someone asked whether she thought her DH got his staff to make a phone call for example, every time it needed to be done. The answer of course was no, he would have lost his job long ago if he couldn't do all the things he was telling his wife he couldn't do at home.

Mrsjayy Thu 01-May-14 10:25:22

on the other hand some women say these things about men because they are in shit relationships and can't/wont admit it or some women like to be in control so they say these things, like oh he cant take care of the baby like I do, (hear this a lot with the work i do)
, although I do agree with you for the life of me i cant understand why men are seen as useless lumps

Ploppy16 Thu 01-May-14 10:27:15

YANBU, I wouldn't have married or had children with DH if he had been as useless as some women make men out to be.
He isn't brilliant at multi tasking admittedly but he doesn't sit there helplessly and is getting better at it grin

Mrsjayy Thu 01-May-14 10:28:11

I cant multitask <shrug> i get into a tizz my brain just doesn't work that way

TereseaGreen Thu 01-May-14 10:29:32

I think you are spot on. It is such a shame that we reduce the sexes to homogeneous masses with the same types of social and emotional cognition.
Are women better at seeing dirt because we have special eyes that are drawn to dust bunnies? No. Our eyes work in the same way. If I was to have my corneas transplanted I would not suddenly lose the ability to spot the carpet needs to be vacuumed.

The difference if often a result of social conditioning and gender roles played out over time and probably more importantly, whether a person wants want to see/do/communicate. It is easier to blame the behaviour of another person on something they "cannot control" i.e Gender rather than face the reality that the person does not want to clean/communicate/do more than one thing at a time.

We all have the ability to embrace new skills and new ways of thinking. When perpetuating myths based on traditions must remain mindful of the validity of those traditions in the first place and the circumstances in which the behaviours were learnt.

rinabean Thu 01-May-14 10:31:27

They don't have a low opinion of men though, it's a low opinion of themselves. Far better to believe your poor man is just incapable, oh and he's probably so grateful to you for helping him out than face the truth: he hates you, sees you as lesser, his servant.

They have a high opinion of men and a low opinion of women or they wouldn't put up with it.

I don't know how someone could understand the ways in which men take advantage of women (deliberately being bad at housework, ruining family and friend relationships or even endangering their own children to force women back into their place) and have a high opinion of men. I don't think that makes you much of a feminist. If men simply truly couldn't, that would be a lot better than the reality, wouldn't it? I have a really really low opinion of men: because of their actions, and because like you I know they could do better.

fascicle Thu 01-May-14 10:32:21

Cogito
It's patronising and sexist to ascribe generalised, unfavourable attributes to people because they are a particular gender.

I agree.

Mrsjayy Thu 01-May-14 10:32:27

rina i think you are right it is all about the woman and her opinion of herself imo

FreudiansSlipper Thu 01-May-14 10:32:31

I agree men being treated like likkle hmm children drives me mad

can I add men are just naturally selfish

no they are not! people choose to be selfish

and as for the adverts showing men to be useless angry well I guess it keeps many believing that they are

Amrapaali Thu 01-May-14 10:33:24

There are many so-called "scientific" studies to show men can't multi-task, they can't see mess like a woman can. SO much empirical evidence...Yes, men and women are wired a bit differently- the reasons may be physical or psychological.

But using that to excuse shitty behaviour is not on. I have great faith in humanity. I'm sure we didn't get to where we are by sitting back and moaning, "Oh I can't do that!" Men can be "trained" to see and address mess. Just as women can learn to be great drivers. grin

greenwinter Thu 01-May-14 10:38:03

rinabean - Good point. I have a high opinion of men's capacity to do these things. I have a very low opinion of the many men who treat their female partners like servants and do very luttle.

The harsh reality is that men behave the way they do, because they choose to behave that way.

TereseaGreen Thu 01-May-14 10:38:04

Do you not think those differences are a social construct Amrapaali?
Perhaps as time goes on and attitudes hopefully start to change then we will begin to see evidence which suggests a shift in how people see things? Its really difficult to ignore how centuries of conditioning have influenced a persons perception of what they can and can't do.

The narratives about men and women are woven through our cultures and then confirmed by those behaviours which result.

Isn't it more interesting how, despite that, moves have been made to rattle the foundations of those belief and we seem to be carving out a more generous view of both genders.

On the other hand it fucks me off that dh is seen as a special snowflake because he is a decent male.

BuzzardBird Thu 01-May-14 10:39:10

It annoys me Freudian that these ads are being marketed at women because they think that is what women want to hear. confused

Mrsjayy Thu 01-May-14 10:40:50

the flu treatment or is it a chemist one drives me potty woman with cold being a martyr her husband and kiddies at home resting I turn it over

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