Mumsnet Talk

I quite agree BoF. The people who were truly inspirational to me just don't post anymore. And when we are talking of behaviour in the FWR topic - surely it was the MRA trolls that made it unpleasant rather than women discussing feminism?

It upsets me, as it feels like a few fuckwits have won.

I think I'm ok, but thanks lemon.

I doubt MNHQ thought that the best way to deal with bullies was to set up a section for them, as SM seems to imagine. I don't think MNHQ ever suggested they agreed that there was bullying going on, TBH. It's not their style.

on the contrary mnhq acknowledged fwr had been problematic
mnhq clarified fwr is a topic about feminism,not feminist topic
it still remains a lively topic,and I enjoy participating on it

Not sure why the haiku-esque posts? Are we all being pretentiously avant-garde all of a sudden?

Sorry to reply in plain English, but that's not really true, is it, SM. HQ have said for yonks it's not a feminist topic, it's got nothing to do with the new section. And they acknowledge problems every time they comment on a bunfight. So you're not really saying anything relevant, I think.

Still, glad to know at least once person is enjoying you participating.

I can only speak for myself here

I don't post much any more in any of the Feminist topics, because I didn't agree in the first place that there should be any segregation at all

I got pissed off with the goading and the derailing

I got nasty pm's and followed around the board, so that any posts I made anywhere already had an "agenda" in some people's heads

I got exasperated with passive aggressive handmaidens shouting the loudest and going on a campaign of reporting to shut down discussion

I felt angry that some of the more vocal feminists (if not the more "popular" ones) got hounded off for their clear consistency and strength of mind

but most of all I got sick of defending my opposition of the sex industry in a space that was supposed to be supportive of women's rights

no, scottishmummy, I didn't think it was a feminist space before you start, but the vitriol shown to anyone who wasn't a Christian Grey-loving, BDSM is simply women getting their jollies, escorting is girl power ^ believer^ just got too much

so I now feel FWR has been taken over by posturers and posers who post thread after thread without giving an opinion of their own, just to stand back and watch the bunfight

I can get that on AIBU, so FWR has lost it's special attraction for me that it used have, and that is actually a crying shame

Put down?

Eh?

It's a joke, mixed in with a little bit of serious critique.

I totally agree with you porto - I really enjoyed the MN section as it used to be, I learned a hell of a lot. Yes there was a bit of hectoring and stringent debate - good. Reading the posts and posting on them and discussing things I hadn't even thought about really changed my view on a lot of subjects.

I miss a lot of the posters who used to be prolific and the Naomi Wolf webchat a few weeks ago was like a glimpse into how it used to be, with a lot of the posters who used to be on FWR a lot. I miss them.

I don't think there was any bullying - seems like a lazy accusation to make against those posters who were more challenging. They were more bullied against by the fuckers who spammed the FWR board, like those from pun ter snet and f4j, and lone rangers like that edd who was aroiund last year.

Now FWR seems to have a new lot of prolific divs posters who set the tone and it is a shame.

I am not going to say why they left, but everyone personally involved in the events in the run up to their leaving knows exactly what happened, and most of it did not happen on MN.

I'm not going to say what happened because I don't see any point in going through it all again; I'm sure MNHQ would not want that anyway.

ScottishMummy, it had nothing to do with any board reorganisation or any arguments they had over feminism with people expressing strong opinions that conflicted with radical feminism.

Or actually what anyf posted in a far more coherent manner.

No, Milly, some people know exactly what happened; others are still bewildered and hurt by what was done to them. Not quite the same, I think.

If MNHQ accused anyone who posts in FWR of bullying in a public statement, I will eat my mooncup.

The RadFem section is utterly stupid. The whole reason why FWR was a brilliant section was because it had representatives of ALL forms of feminism. It suffered from far too many MRA trolls that MNHQ were slow to deal with effectively. They admitted that and changed their trolling policy to deal with it. They ALSO created a new rule about personal attacks involving groups as opposed to just individuals because of the unnamed attacks on specific people.

There are topics i don't bother posting on anymore because I beyond bored of the outright derailing and desperate attempts to silence anyone who might want to discuss issues of pornography and prostitution. Every thread in this section has poster claiming that feminists are big, fat meanies. It's like primary school.

but the result was a reorganization of topic Molly, creation of radfem topic
so you know what your summation, well that's your pov
not one I necessarily share

FWR was also ruined by a small number of male posters who still persist in "whatabouthemenzing" all over the fucking shop

the really sad thing is, the women are joining in too

you can't post anywhere without a "gender reversal" being shoved down your throat

I am fucking sick of it

I go on a thread about male DV to a woman

first few posts...so far, so good

then some fuckwit comes on with stats about female violence upon men

but we weren't fucking talking about that were we

it's not even confined to FWR any more, which I feel is a consequence of HQ not coming down hard enough on the massive derailing that went on for months before they finally did something about it

the name calling and hectoring was female to female
what about da menz,mar,antifeminist oft used putdown of choice
sad thing was it was a lot of women berating other women about not being feminist enough

MillyR, give it a rest. the sniping is a bit dull tbh. LRD has nothing to apologise for.

Nope, not talking about myself Milly. You would know who I was talking about if what you said were correct, wouldn't you?

I don't know what you mean by 'one of you', and I think you have seriously missed the point of this thread. You might understand it better if you'd posted here recently, and I am fairly sure it is very obvious to those of us who have.

It really just got to the stage of being completely pointless in posting in the FWR section. What with the goading, F4J types invading you could never have a straight forward debate with out being derailed by a bunch of arse holes.

The fwr section has nose dived since the intelligent, forward thinking people were hectored off it. I never understood the bullshit 'feminists are mean' comments, there were loads of lurkers including me who really learned from them and now they're mostly gone, so thanks everyone who contributed to that. You suck.

You cannot control a thread once started, and if posters want to add related issues they can. It's part of the nature of open, unmoderated Internet sites.

The debate earlier this year was very helpful in that it cleared up (hopefully permanently) that FWR is not a "safe space", but simply another forum on MN.

I have found the change in tone in the FWR forum to be an improvement.

Nah it wasn't the 'safe space' thing, that was old news. It was the tolerance of MRAs.

Oh I didn't mind being berated about not being feminist enough.

I learnt a lot, like I said.

I remember I used to feel rather sanguine about porn, thinking 'well it's a woman's choice to use it or perform in it' blah blah blah.

Reading the many threads on here, reading all the links, and talking to women who knew a shitload more than me about the subject really made me change my tune, and thank christ for it as well. I will always be grateful for that - especially as the mother of a teenage girl.

I do remember being a bit blasted sometimes when I had a different opinion, but I survived. I didn't have to retreat into a dimly lit room to sniff some smelling salts. The vast majority of threads were an education.

I was never convinced by the cries of MRA!, largely because I was accused of being one myself. (What, all by myself?)

Yes, there were people from F4J who came to make their arguments. And there were people who came from PN to make theirs.

It's an odd discussion forum that excludes the very people being talked about.