reabsorbtion of puppies ?

[scrumpywithrosie]

Does any one have any experience in this ?

Our labrador bitch was scanned after mating (about 35 days after) and was definatly pregnant.

At 50ish days a follow up scan could not detect clear puppies and it is likely they have been reabsorbed. He thought he could see a heartbet but was not sure so she may have 1 or 2 that were high up and could not be clearly seen with the scan.

We are very upset as we were so looking forward to it.

The vet was not hopeful for any puppies being born.

Now I dont know if we should be prepared if she has 1 or 2 (due in about a week) or not. He felt her abdomen and could not feel anything.

I have read up on reabsorbtion and I dont think she has an infection and the vet did not mention this but we have had building work going on so wonder if this traumatised her and caused it.

Does anyone have any experience of this ?

[Vallhala]

Shouldn't you have made yourself aware of any possible complications before mating the poor bitch? I suggest that you re-refer to your vet for competent professional medical advice.

[Baffledandbewildered]

Yes this can happen if there were heart beats high up it is possible that you will get pups. It is difficult to scan if the pups are way back on the horns and difficult to feel.
Keep an eye on her and be ready just in case. Good luck

[scrumpywithrosie]

thanks for the advice baffled - I am still hoping for a pup or 2 and there was something there and the vet thought it was a heartbeat (he explained that the foetus moves away from the scanner so can be hard to examine) but there was fluid in the bits of uterus he could see clearly indicating reabsorbtion of some of the pups.
We were shocked and upset at the scan so did not have a list of questions we needed to ask at the time. We were fully expecting a healthy pregnancy
I guess I am asking if some pups can be reabsorbed can some healthy ones still be born ? Due date is only a week away now so we will get whelping box / heatpad set up just in case.

Val - please dont judge us as you essentially know nothing about our situation. I do not feel the need to explain myself here but climb down as we are responsible, educated dog owners and our dog could never be described as ' a poor bitch '. I have read these threads and you give some wonderful advice but as I have already said I am not going to explain myself here.

I was just hoping for some advice or personal experiences thank you

[pinkytheshrinky]

Can I say as an outsider of Doghouse this is why I never ask a question. It is a valid question and making people feel like shit is not nice and not in anyway helpful. Val, do you really think that the OP doesn't know there are too many dogs needing homes? I do appreciate your position but guilt tripping people who are asking a simple question is counter-productive, you put people off asking for advice.

Op I have no idea about anything like this but I do hope your bitch is going to be ok.

[scrumpywithrosie]

thanks for the replies - yes I feel Val has lost the plot a bit and was thinking about reporting the post and now I know I am not alone in feeling like this I probably will.

Our dog is fine thanks. She is well and healthy but we are just not sure if she is going to give birth to any puppies or not - hence the question.

I am sure lots of people are put off by unhelpful responses which is a shame.

[chickchickchicken]

well i too thought it was irresponsible to breed without being fully aware of all the health implications

i dont think its fair to say someone has lost the plot just because they have expressed an opinion which you dont want to hear

imo if someone is saying publicly how many dogs they are looking for homes for and even if only person comes forward to rescue a dog then it is worthwhile them posting it. i know val gets lots of pms and has helped find homes for dogs and helped posters on here when they have needed to rehome their dogs.

[MollyTheMole]

Oh honestly reporting the post? Really?? Good grief are people on MN really this weak willied they now want to report posts that are a bit blunt and not what they want to hear?

I wonder sometimes how some MNers get on with bluntness IRL I really do

[scrumpywithrosie]

did I ask the question 'shall I breed my dog?'

Am I missing something ?

As I have stated my dog is well and healthy and fully health checked (by the fully qualified vet) prior to mating.

I am not going to explain myself I am just a bit at how I can be judged as irresponsible with no actual basis for that judgement.

I am asking about the viability of unborn puppies not my own dogs health as she is ( I will repeat) well and healthy.

I think I will leave this topic now.

thank you for helpful replies.

[Midori1999]

I think Minimu was saying she'd lost the plot, not Val. Please don't go Minimu, you're advice is great and really helps loads of people.

I can understand why Val feels the way she does and gets angry about people breeding and I suspect that includes me. I also understand why it was easy to read the OP and feel the 'breeder' has not done enough research as it is pretty well known that scans can easily ,miss puppies, especially later on. Also, that it is very difficult to 'feel' for puppies after around 28 days, although with a week to go, you should see some movement. especially if the bitch's belly was shaved for a scan.

Reabsorbtion is thought to be pretty rare.

[Midori1999]

"As I have stated my dog is well and healthy and fully health checked (by the fully qualified vet) prior to mating"

Of course, on a forum you won't always only get answers to the questions you ask and people will give their opinions.

The above quote worries me because a health check bya vet is not enough. Labradors need eye testing by a specialist vet and to have had hip and elbow scores done, which mean x rays being taken by a vet and submitted to the BVA for assessment/scoring. I wouldn't want anyone to read this and think a simple health check by a vet is sufficient.

[scrumpywithrosie]

I also stated that I do not want to explain myself.

Hip and eye tesing also done for both parents but it was assumed by some this was not the case.

[MackerelOfFact]

Wow. Harsh words there from Valhalla. The planet is also overpopulated with people but replying to every parenting-related thread on MN with:

"I'm suggesting that someone who was looking forward to adding to the huge number of people we already have in this country (and beyond), many of whom die purely because of insufficient homes, sanitation and food, really ought to be "responsible" and "educated" enough to have fully aquainted themselves with all the health implications of pregnancy before embarking upon it."

Would be unhelpful at best, no?

[scrumpywithrosie]

and if I wanted to use my 'poor bitch' as a puppy machine do you think I would be seeking advice ?

[PortBlackSandWitchIsThere]

I really hope there is not going to be a rash of folk reporting Valhalla's posts because she has forthright opinions....

[scrumpywithrosie]

Forthright opinions are not the problem.

[pinkytheshrinky]

Well said Mackerel - that is a very good point actually

And honestly, I recently got a puppy (as in not a rescue older dog which I know some people disagree with) and I wouldn't dare ask for advice on here - it is harsh. If the possible re-absorption of puppies is rare why would the OP have acquainted herself with that information. It really sounds as if it is unlikely and no one can prepare for every eventuality and are allowed to come for advice.

I would not report Vals post but really it is very off putting for anyone trying to seek advice.

[chickchickchicken]

midori - i know that minimu was referring to herself losing the plot (minumi, i hope you dont go too).

i was quoting the OP who clearly stated she felt val had lost the plot

mollythemole - i agree with you. reporting posts that are blunt and not what you want to hear.

[DooinMeCleanin]

Breeding is a contentious issue on any forum about dogs. It is a fact that there are too many dogs and not enough homes. It is also fact that there are far too many irresponsible breeders (I'm not saying the Op is one of those breeders. How would I know? I don't know her).

No-one would flame you for asking advise about a puppy pinky, even if that puppy was -heaven forbid- a pedigree

If you posted about where to get a dog rescue would be mentioned as one of the better options because it is usually is the better option. If you posted stating that you had thought about rescue, but decided you wanted X pedigree puppy instead, people would advise on where to look for a breeder and what you should expect from a good breeder.

There are lots of supportive threads on the doghouse and lots of supportive comments and advise from Valhalla, too.

But something like breeding or selling your dog will always bring up opposing view points as it's not always in the best interest of the dog or puppies to be.

[pinkytheshrinky]

Dooin - God no I would never buy a pedigree... haha

I have a mixed breed mini dog who needed a home but I paid for her - so not from a breeder but essentially second hand. This comes from seeing a thread ages ago in which someone got lectured for wanting a puppy she got roasted a bit so I haven't really bothered as I don't feel I should have to justify myself, just as the OP should not have to.

I know Val gives good advice but if you want people to come freely and ask for helpful advice form those who know a lot then kicking them into touch in a first post is never a good idea is it? Like I said, not reportable but certainly really unfriendly.

[wordfactory]

Thing is there are 60,000 children in the care system, many mnay of hwom desperately need a foster home and will not get one. But you can't answer every query about getting or being pregnant, or raising a baby, by saying that we should all foster or adopt...well you can...but it would be a bit daft no?

People should be allowed to come into the Dgohouse and ask innocent questions without fear of exposure of a flaming.

We are not all experts.

[chickchickchicken]

but pinky, just like on the sn threads why should the onus be on any particular poster to be friendly/educate/welcoming? no one person should have that responsibility put on them and i really do think its unfair to keep singling out one person's posting style. the OP has had a variety of responses, surely that's all one can hope for when posting on a public forum?

anyway, as usual a great post from dooin and i have to copy val and say 'i agree with what dooin said'

[chickchickchicken]

wordfactory - as a former social worker, foster carer and advocate for looked after young people ... yes i would like people to consider all the above before reproducing. hth

[DooinMeCleanin]

The thing is the 'flamings' tend to only happen when some-one asks something, is given good advise and then decides to go and do something that could endanger their dog.

e.g

Op: I need to rehome my dog. Shall I sell him on Gumtree?
Val: No. Something really terrible could happen. I'll help you find a rescue.
Op: No, but I want my money back on him so I am going to sell him to completely unsuitable home number 1. Oh, but be nice to me about it because I really loved that dog and I am sad.