Calling all wise mums of teens (18 yrs old and over)..... advice needed!

[chenin]

I could do with a bit of advice....

I have 2 DDs 18 and 15 yrs old. With regards to my 18yo, she takes her last A level today and hopefully will get the grades to get into Uni in the autumn.

She is a good kid on the whole... works hard at school and works hard at a part time job outside of school, so earns her own money.

However, she is BONE IDLE!!! For the last few months I have let it go a bit because she has this evergreen excuse 'Mum, I am revising... studying... working hard for my exams blah blah' However, she has now finished her exams and I've told her that as soon as her exams finish, things have gotta change!

She does zilch in the house... her room is not a total mess as such, because it has been newly decorated and refurbished about 6 months ago so is easy to keep tidy.

However, she does nothing else. If she gets a letter in the post, she leaves the envelope lying around, as well as apple cores, crisp bags etc. I cannot think of one thing she does despite constant nagging from me. If I ask her to unpack the dishwasher, she will get round to it half a day later.... too late!!

My problem is.... I have no 'levers'. I don't give her any money.. she pays her way for everything (mobile, drinks, social life etc). So money is not a lever. When I get fed up with it I tell her that I will stop doing things for her if she does nothing for me... but all I do for her is cook meals, her washing and ironing. OK, I can stop doing her ironing but that is not gonna cause her a great problem, tbh. She drives and has her own car, so I can't withdraw lifts.

She doesn't go to Uni until end sept and I think it is gonna drive me mad! From now on, it will be constant partying and I think she is gonna be like an annoying flatmate who does nothing.

I have no idea where to start to get her to do things... I am working up to the 'big chat' round the kitchen table but need to be able to threaten her with something... I just don't know what! Any ideas, anyone?

[Lilymaid]

Absolutely no idea - I'm in much the same position as you (DS1 back from university for vacation, but working and DS2 just finished GCSEs so at home all day). They know I will do it all in the end, so there is no incentive for them to clear up themselves. They then complain that the house is a mess. I think those who get their DCs to help start them young and are very strict about making them help.

[chenin]

I wish she did complain the house was in a mess!! I sometimes go away for a few days leaving DH and DDs. They seem to love living like pigs in s**t! I am not that houseproud but it is becoming like me against the rest of the house. Trouble is DD2 is now copying DD1 and I have tried sooooo hard to get them to help. I am at a loss tbh!

[3littlefrogs]

Do not do anything for her - no washing, no ironing, no cooking, no lifts - nothing. Anything she leaves lying about gather up, place in a bin bag and put on her bed. Do not discuss, nag or plead. Smile sweetly and carry on regardless.

I have dss 15 and 18. They have been doing their own laundry for a couple of years now. the elder one has a PT job, but still relies on a small monthly allowance for lunches and travel to college.

The younger one relies on an allowance to cover the cost of hobbies etc.

Any misdemeanor results in a reduction from the allowance - this usually works. However, I see that you do not have this option.

From your dd's POV she clearly feels that she doesn't owe you anything, so she needs to appreciate how much you do for her.

However, I wouldn't turn it into a war, because you will miss her when she goes, and she will soon appreciate you once she is living away from home.

[chenin]

Thanks 3littlefrogs (love the name btw!)

I have pondered with the idea of the black bag actually and I think it is the way to go... to collect up everything (including crisp pkts and apple cores) and shove it all in a bag....

I am thinking that she might improve once she leaves for Uni and her favourite top is creased or dirty and she really wants to wear it... then she might consider herself lucky at home!

[minorityrules]

Go for guilt! I did!

Mine have done their own washing and ironing from about 12/13. They take it in turns to cook. I refuse to take any notice of bedrooms, just shut the door. They want to live in crap, they live in crap

I recently had a talk (more of a shout) told them that I am not a housekeeper. They are old enough to live alone and if they choose the easy route and live with me, they can take responsibility and share my workload or at least not make it harder.

Always works for a bit!

[chenin]

trouble is minorityrules... my shouting, nagging, calm talking... none of it seems to work. It's like water off a ducks back - they just seem oblivious to it all.
So I have to take drastic measures of some sort as my rational talking or shouting just doesn't have any effect.
Thanks for your input!

[WendyWeber]

I've just been brooding over your situation, helliebean (as I was cleaning the bathroom that DS1 aged 18 was supposed to have cleaned yesterday ) and I was wondering who pays for her car - insurance and fuel and so on - she surely can't be paying for that herself out of her part-time earnings, and all her other expenses too? Insurance for 18-year-olds is sky-high, isn't it? And did she buy the car herself? Is there no leverage for you there?

Anyway I agree totally with frogs - no domestic service from you at all and the binliner swoop whenever is necessary. How she keeps her own room doesn't need to concern you, but mess in the rest of the house does, and you could start charging her a share of domestic bills out of her wages over the summer, as she isn't actually a student at the moment.

Will return to my domestic chores and continue to brood...

[chenin]

Thanks WendyWeber.... she has had a part time job since she was 14 and now earns up to £100 a week, so I suppose I could start charging for domestic bills.
I would feel a bit mean tbh because she is putting some of it away for Uni spending money.
I did pay for her first lot of insurance, but she does pay for car tax and all petrol. The insurance premium isn't due for a while and it is about £500 per year... I have threatened not to pay for it next time but I'm just not sure that is the right lever IYSWIM. She also paid for half the car when we bought it... She is a good little earner, to be fair!!

I am going to do the black bag thing tho...

You obviously know what I mean if you have a DS aged 18!!.... there is no easy answer tbh!

[chenin]

Gawd... when I see what I have typed about her, I realise how lucky I am with her sometimes... it's not the big things - she is brill on those - its just living with her is a nightmare!

[minorityrules]

In that case, tell her you are no longer doing her washing and ironing and mean it. And anything she leaves in the main part of the house, bin bag it

Teens/young adults can be so blinkered and selfish, makes me want to scream now more than when they were little

[chenin]

minority... you are so right! I do think age 17/18 they are at the pinnacle of selfishness. Won't do anything for anyone else unless there is something in it for them, always think they are hard done by, cannot empathise with other people etc....

[RIELOVESBACARDI]

if she has a part time job tell her you wand bord off her if shes not gonna help out

[chenin]

I am toying with this Bacardi... I have to get my thoughts in order and have a proper discussions with her - if she will shut up long enough for me to speak without sounding off and arguing....!

[hippopotamouse]

Do you remember what you were like at 18?

I don't have a dc at 18 but I remember what it was like for me, people tend to be house proud if they have been brought up that way. My parents lived in an absolute mess while I was living with them, I saw no reason to tidy up after myself if no-one else did (there were six of us).

I was self sufficient like your dd from the age of 15, including clothes, toiletries, bus fares, even school lunches sometimes .This was supposed to be a lesson as my parents didn't have it as good as we did apparently!

My house is spotless now and mum realizes now why I give her notice that I'm coming round with dp and kids, it gives her time to tidy up!

I think as you only have a few months left with her and you'll really miss her when she's gone I probably wouldn't fuss. I wouldn't bother about her room and only complain about elsewhere.

What do her friends think of her room BTW?

[Saggarmakersbottomknocker]

oh helliebean you so have my sympathy. ds1 is much like your dd - hard worker out of the home - but in it he's a shocker

Add in the mix that he shares his pit of a bedroom with ds2 who has a touch of OCD. Well I'll leave it to the imagination.....

I've done the black bag thing, I've done no washing and ironing, I've done no cooking. I occasionally dump all offending items in his bed under the duvet. Or outside in the drive. They all have the desired effect - for a short time - then it's back to the same old, same old. My main lever at the moment is lifts as he hasn't passed his test (I'd refuse to pay for any more lessons but I seriously need to do less taxi-driving).

Bless 'em

[chenin]

hippopotomouse... you are right in a lot of that. But, have to say I am not that houseproud tbh. DH is a total slob, DD2 is no better and I spend my life battling against it! I will miss her terribly when she goes... she is such a force in this house.
Her friends thinks she has a really tidy room but I must stress it has had a complete overhaul and there is lots of space to keep it tidy!! Its not her room that is a problem (although she doesnt dust or hoover)

[chenin]

saggarsmakerbottomknocker (love the name!)... I ROFL at putting the black bag under the quilt or on the drive!!! Great!! I know my DD would be the same... she would get better for a while but then revert back pretty quick.. A good friend of hers, same age, is really tidy - is there a gene she is missing or summat?!

[gooseegg]

My dd was a changed woman after spending the Summer as an au-pair and learning to do housework in a supportive adult environment rather than at home with her mum constantly nagging her.
Now I couldn't do without her - and am even having to get my own au-pair to replace her when she leaves for uni soon.
Could you your dd off on another family for the Summer?
If she were to put a good ad (write it yourself - you'll know exactly what a family would need - and market her well) I guarantee she could pick and choose between tens of families within hours.

[gooseegg]

'palm' your dd off I meant to write.

[chenin]

thanks for your input goosegg! I just know she would flatly refuse to do that.... at 18 they have a mind of their own and if she earns £100 a week, it is her right to choose, so there is nothing I could do. Nevertheless it sounds like a brilliant idea!

[suedonim]

Another one here who's done the black bag routine. As Sagger has implied, it's not a permanent cure but it makes you feel a lot better to get rid of the stuff from sight.

If she leaves things like make up or a hair drier lying about it's quite fun to put it away somewhere unusual so when she needs it again she has to search the place while you look suitably vague 'Yes, yes...I think I did see it somewhere...now let me think...'

I also agree that you need to withdraw your services, so she has to look after herself totally. Sometimes it's actually easier to do things yourself but resist the urge.

I'd also say to her that as she's been studying and doing exams then she can now have one week lolling around and relaxing but the New Regime will begin on Monday week, or whatever. Just to show you're not a complete slave driver.

[chenin]

Yes suedonim... I am gonna give her a few days leeway (wanna start tonight actually!) and then it is down to her....

Its hilarious actually my DD2 aged 15 and very astute gave her 10 mins on the PC before she demanded that dD1 got off the
PC as 'she has work to do' cos this is what her elder sis has been doing to her for a very very long time - and she now can't do that any more, as A levels are over! It usually means DD1 is on msn, bebo, or facebook... not school work. So the boot is on the other foot now!

[ThePrisoner]

You don't put the actual black bag under the duvet, just the contents of it. Crisp packets, apple cores, yummy!

[wychbold]

Helliebean, you say that you have no 'levers' ATM: I always try the approach of 'you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours' Is she expecting you to help when she goes to Uni (financial, emotional, administration, help with 'moving house' etc etc) Is it time to gently remind her that she needs to build up some goodwill?