help... who do Muslims believe they are descended from?

[citrus1]

Hi, could any RE teachers or Muslims (or in fact anyone)!, please advise me who Muslims believe they are descended from? My DD is doing a h/w and has found conflicting answers on the net! With many thanks.

[Besom]

I'm neither, so bumping for you.

But, can't she put the contradictions in, like 'some people believe X'? Leave it a bit vague.

Mohammed is the obvious answer, but I would probably put 'Mohammed is the founder of Islam and he is often believed to be descended from Abraham'. Would this do?

(Hoping someone who has the slightest clue what they're talking about comes along!)

[Thistledew]

Islam is a religion not a race. Muslims can be descended from anyone.

Some ethnic groups do claim direct descendence from the Prophet Mohammed (p.b.u.h) through his daughter Faduma, who had two sons Hassan and Hussein. The Ashraf people of Somalia are one such group who have this claim.

Generally speaking, the question is very misguided.

[scaryteacher]

Abraham, same as Judaism and Christianity.

[scaryteacher]

From Islamicity.com

'Do Islam and Christianity have different origins?

No. Together with Judaism, they go back to the prophet and patriarch Abraham, and their three prophets are directly descended from his sons, Muhammad from the elder son Ishmael, and Moses and Jesus from the younger son Isaac. Abraham established the settlement which today is the city of Makkah, and built the Ka'ba towards which all Muslims turn when they pray.'

[Thistledew]

I agree that the three Abrihamic religions have the same roots, but does the Qu'ran actually teach that the whole population of the world is descended from Abraham? I don't know the answer to that.

The question was 'who do Muslims believe they are descended from?'. Many Muslims accept the theory of evolution and would be hard pressed to reconcile being a direct descendant of Abraham with the evidence of the existance of contemporaneous civilisations in places such as Malaysia, for instance, where there is a large Muslim population.

I think the question is very badly put.

[mummytime]

The question is about the origin of the faith not the descent of people. Although most Arabs believe they are descended from Abraham (from Ishmael I think), I wouldn't have thought someone from Malaysia thinks they are descended from Abraham.

[scaryteacher]

Agree badly put question; agree with Mummytime about it being of the origin of the faith, hence the bit from Islamicity.

[citrus1]

Many thanks for all replies!! Sorry if you think it's a "badly put question", just quoting directly from given question on paper!!! Thanks anyway

[AMumInScotland]

My first though would be Ishmael (elder son of Abraham with a slave woman) wheras the Jewish people are seen to be descended from Isaac (younger son of Abraham with his wife, who he had thought was barren).

The Judeo-Christian version of the story is that Abraham didn't trust in God enough and wait for him to "bless" his wife with a child, so tried to "jump the gun" by getting another woman pregnant. And that Isaac's descendants were therefore the "proper" ones.

I don't know the Muslim version of the story, but I imagine it doesn't have that same bias!

[scaryteacher]

We meant that the teacher had framed the question badly, not you.

[citrus1]

Thanks, Scary!!! small case of paranoia setting in...... what do you teach? Your replies are always so informative - thanks to all replies once again.

[Thistledew]

Sorry Citrus1! I meant that the homework question was badly put, not your OP!

I agree that the answer given by Scary and others is probably what the question is getting at, but it is not actually what is asked.

I would probably be bothered to complain as I think it encourages children to see Muslims as one homogenous group of a certain race- but that is just my view, and I should probably slink off to the pedant's corner!

[ilovemydogandMrObama]

As a side note, there is a brilliant episode of West Wing about Ishmael and Isaac. It was their response to 9/11.

[Blu]

Their parents and grandparents?

[citrus1]

That's fine, Thistle!! Thank you for your reply, it was very helpful. I didn;t expect such an array of replies and explanations! Thank you.

[scaryteacher]

Citrus; you asked for RE teachers...

It may be that the teacher wants to explore the common root of the three monotheistic religions. It is important that your daughter knows that Jews, Christians and Muslims can be found amongst all ethnic groups and nationalities.

[mrsgordonfreeman]

It depends: according to Biblical tradition, they are descended from Abraham's first son, Ishmael, whom Abraham kicked out along with Hagar, his mother, when Sarah gave birth to Isaac.

I am an ex-RE teacher and that's the answer I think they're expecting, but I agree that it's a badly worded question.

Also, the question should start "whom" .

[scaryteacher]

'Together with Judaism, they go back to the prophet and patriarch Abraham, and their three prophets are directly descended from his sons, Muhammad from the elder son Ishmael, and Moses and Jesus from the younger son Isaac. Abraham established the settlement which today is the city of Makkah, and built the Ka'ba towards which all Muslims turn when they pray.'

Muhammed according to the above being descended from Ishmael, would link Islam directly to Ishamel.

[citrus1]

Scary, I was not asking for RE teachers specifically, I said any RE teachers, Muslims (or anyone infact!) - so it was not obvious, in my opinion, that you were an ex-RE teacher!!! My DD does realise the points you mentioned.... thanks. Won't post anyone as have more than enough information - thank you!!!

[ragged]

Maybe an aside, but don't a lot of Muslims trace themselves back to the prophet himself, and some of his contemporaries? Very often when I read a quote by an eminent Muslim scholar, it's mentioned in passing that this scholar got his authority partly because he could trace his ancestry back to the X other person.

[mrsgordonfreeman]

Well, yes, sort of... there's also the different sons of Noah: from Wikipedia:

According to Genesis 10, Noah had three sons:
Ham, forefather of the southern peoples (Hamitic), i.e. Africans
Shem, forefather of the middle peoples (Semitic) i.e. Jews, Arabs, etc.
Japheth, forefather of the northern peoples (Japhetic Eurasia) i.e. everybody else

That just underlines why it is a bad question to ask. Better maybe to turn it around and ask who has a traditional claim to be descended from Ishmael?