Urgent Advice Needed

[stuckbetweenarock]

On advice from another Mumsnetter, Im copying this from another board.

This may be long winded but please bare with me. Married to DH who is Turkish for 10 years. We have 3 DCs 6,5 and 4.

Previous History of domestics violence although I had been scared on every occasion to report to the police. I reported an incident to my GP last year where he hit my nose so badly I was suffering with blurred vision. Again, was too afraid to go to police.

Relationship has broken down over past few weeks and I called the police to an incident by which he cut all the inside of my hand whilst trying to take car keys from me when I threatened to go to the solicitor after he had threatened he wouldn't let me see our daughter who was in Turkey at the time. I phoned the police who classed it as a verbal domestic, but then I went to the solicitor and took out a non molestation order against him for both the children and I. We were called back to court yesterday regarding the order to decide who the children would stay with.

Things had been amicable over the weekend with him apologising for his behaviour towards me saying that he deserved the order but that he was hurt I had asked the children to be put in there. We were civil enough to discuss arrangements for me moving out with the children and I felt that the non molestation order was enough and we decided I would withdraw my application for the children's order as we agreed between ourselves that the children would live with myself.

We drove to the solicitors together and I told him to wait in the car whist I spoke with my solicitor. I told her I wanted to withdraw as we were being amicable but she warned me that if I didn't proceed and that if I was to ever attend court again for anything similar the judge would criticise me for not protecting my children the first time around so I decided to go ahead.

When he found out that we would still be going to court, he was angry saying that Id planned all of this etc and the judge has postponed the hearing until September as it gives him chance to get legal aid.

He was fuming after the whole incident saying that I'd done all this on purpose and I'd stabbed him in the back, when I swear for me it was a split minute decision based on what the solicitor advised me as my statement clearly said that there's a history of domestic violence.

He has told me that he will appoint 3 lawyers to fight his case, that he will embarrass me in front of anybody and everybody. He told me that one lawyer is already chasing my medical history as I've been on antidepressants in the past and he is going to use that against me. I felt I had to use reverse psychology and tell him that I would withdraw any further application made to court because quite frankly I don't believe I have the money or power to be able to compete with him.

Technically we run our own business although the lease is on his name and we live in the property upstairs. I get the usual tax credits and also DLA and carers allowance for our son but it goes into the joint account. I have no savings of my own. We own a property elsewhere that was left to me when my mums died but his name is on the title deeds as we remortgaged so we could buy overseas.
I came to Turkey today to stay with his parents as our youngest DD has been here since April on holiday. I came over with the other two DCs whilst he stays and runs the business.

Basically today I have heard from a mutual friend that he is giving me two choices- either I stay in Turkey, don't come back and he gets me a house here, or if I do come back then I've no choice but to agree he has sole custody of the kids?

When the friend told me this my world has crumbled. I don't have a penny to my name as it's all controlled by him. I have no surviving family to turn to for help. My mums house is empty and I could move there as a last resort but with all the arguing the children have seen, I didn't want to uproot them. He agreed to being the guarantor for me if I rented local using the money from my mums house but he said he won't do that anymore.

I'm absolutely petrified. Can he take the kids from me? He has a record for battery in 2008 and affray in October last year. He has control of the finances and knows I have nothing to my name. He could easily take the money from his parents to pay for top whack solicitors and knows that I don't. His family are the most reasonable people on this planet and despite all that's gone on, they've welcomed me with open arms here tonight. I'm just scared of what he's capable of doing. He's told said friend that I've surrendered etc and now he will be calling the shots.

What should I do? I can't lose my kids hmm

[stuckbetweenarock]

I also have reason to believe he has cheated on me in a brothel but have no proof.

[CogitoErgoSometimes]

I'm sorry you're having such a horrendous experience but I'm very pleased that you've reported him to the police and that you have a solicitor.

However, it's very very important now that you get your DCs and yourself safe and away from this man rather than live a second longer under the same roof. He is violent and he's making threats. When a man like that is in a corner the violence will escalate and you are now in grave danger.

Please talk to Womens Aid 0808 2000 247 and ask for their help. If you can take your DCs safely to your Mum's house, do so. If you'd feel happier in a refuge where he doesn't know the location, please consider that.

You can't afford to rely on him for anything now. Certainly not being guarantor of your home. He cannot 'take the kids', rest assured, even with the finest solicitors. Anti-depressants do not make someone an unfit mother

[TweedleDi]

You need to get back to the UK asap and see a solicitor. Make out verbally that you agree, if need be. Contact Womens Aid. Don't worry about your medical history - he should be worrying about his record!

[adaorarda]

he can't take the children from you because you are on (or were on) medication. Jesus what a numpty he sounds.

i will tell you how you CAN have your children taken from you... by not removing them from an abusive parent or from witnessing the abuse of their parent...

called Women's Aid and CAB, today. you need to find out what you are entitled to. DO NOT allow him ANY more control over you (in form of guarantor etc.) and realise that he has much less control than he would have you believe...

[adaorarda]

saying you don't want to uproot the children is a red herring. OP you cannot allow them to live in the same house as this man. he's a criminal bully. if you have a way to get them into safer quarters, and don't remove them but give yourself a load of excuses instead, you are going to look at fool in court.

[stuckbetweenarock]

My biggest problem at the moment is money- or lack of it...

[stuckbetweenarock]

I will copy and paste the advice from the solicltor...

Hi Maria,

I'm hoping to seek some advice from you if possible. The tables have turned completely since court on Tuesday. XX is now saying that he will appoint three lawyers to deal with the case and that he will find everything possible to use against me. He has said he already has a solicitor who is chasing my medical history and will use the fact that I've been on antidepressants in the past.

I have heard from a mutual friend that he has decided I have two choices, to either stay in Turkey permanently and he will sort out a property for me here, or that if I return to England, he will be expecting me to hand him full custody of the children. Quite obviously neither of which I will accept.

I wondered whether or not to play him at his own game and tell him that in withdrawing my application to the court and call his bluff, or just carry on as things are and see what happens when I return from Turkey? At the moment I feel like all the balls are in his court because he has the financial power to call the shots and I'm worried about what he is capable of doing to use against me.


--

In relation to what dad has said - It is impossible to have more than one lawyer. It is also impossible for him to obtain your medical records without your consent in addition to a court order. Wouldn’t worry about that.

I don’t think you should be playing any game. Our advice has always been to safeguard the children, get a non molestation order and get orders in respect of the children (that they live with you and to stop dad from taking them from your care). We advised you to get the orders for the children but against our advice you did not wish to proceed with the childrens orders. This means your position in respect of the children is weakened.

I cannot advise you strongly enough upon your return from turkey to come and see us and obtain an order to confirm that the children live with you. If he makes an application first it may put you in a difficult positon.

Do not tell dad that you are going to withdraw anything as any sort of bargaining tool - or this can be used against you.


It is clear that as soon as dad thinks you are backing down, he is then using things against you and trying to take the children from you. I think you would be foolish not to take our advice and that you should go ahead with the orders for the children

You instructed us that you didn’t want the occupation order to make sure you could get back in the house. Again you should come and see us about this when you return.

Our very strong advice is to keep all of the children with you, not to go back to the home where he is when you get back (if you are able to ) and to make an application back to court regarding the children.

[adaorarda]

your solicitor's advice is sound. i agree that you have done some strange things wrt to the non molestation order/children. you need to listen very carefully to you solicitor and start making the right decisions.

[MegaClutterSlut]

Listen to your solicitor. If I was you I would leave him and tbh I would get out the hell out of turkey asap just incase any of his family decided to take the children. I may be over reacting but I've heard of it happening so many times. Good luck op

[myfriendflickadee]

I'm confused - I thought you said you decided when you got to court that you would get a non molestation order for the children after all, that was why he was so angry because you changed your mind? The reply from the solicitor says that you didn't. Please get an order that includes the children, they need protection too, and your solicitor is right, it will count against you if you don't.

Be brave, don't listen to your husband's threats, listen to your lawyer. His threats are empty. The biggest regret of my life is that I made that mistake 10 years ago, I believed my husband's threats and didn't take legal advice because I was too scared of the consequences of divorcing him (he said he would take our DS, destroy us financially out of spite, kill himself).

Also, please go to the British consulate or embassy in Turkey and ask their advice on your legal position in Turkey, you are not protected by British law there. It may be that he wants you to stay there because he knows he would have greater rights there or get a better divorce settlement. He could possibly get a court order to prevent you taking the children back to the UK and divorce you in Turkey. He may even have the right to take your children without your consent while you are there if you are still married. I don't know much about Turkish law but I have lived and worked abroad and have had colleagues fall foul of local laws - a Spanish friend who couldn't leave her (British) husband when they were posted to Moscow because she couldn't take her (British) son out of the country without her husband's consent, a colleague whose husband divorced her in Dubai when they lived there (both British) as she had less rights there.

Good luck, be strong.

[stuckbetweenarock]

The non-molestration order does include the children. I was just stupid enough to think we could be amicable enough regarding who the children would stay with in the long term etc. Definitely a huge mistake in my part, but it was through fear as everything else in the past has been

[adaorarda]

OP, i think in future you need to remember that you're dealing with a violent criminal here. there is no "amicable" available to you unfortunately. no matter what he says or does you need to get the children (and yourself) out of this situation.

[bellarations]

Get the hell out of Turkey. Go the British consulate/embassy.
Of course his family will be nice to you if his true intention is to take the children. I'm having flashbacks to book /film "not without my daughter" .
I'm not intending to cause alarm, but I've seen it before, my mother fled with my ds and I to wa and men like you have described are sweet as pie when they want to be and turn into a wolf at a moments notice.

[CharmQuark]

OP you have good advice from a qualified , experienced professional. I strongly urge you to take it.

Stop engaging In His drama and start looking after your interests in an objective and businesslike way. Don't get caught up in silly talk of 3 lawyers, 3 lawyers won't all take the same case and you don't just add to the number of lawyers to trump someone. Take no notice if hear he says, just focus in your own legal advice and this time follow it.

Do not tell your ILs your plans. Get your tickets and leave, and when you arrive take the children anywhere but where he will find you until you have the Order in place.

[kaykayblue]

Listen to what your lawyers are telling you, and stop listening to your heart.

It doesn't really matter if "you think" he will be civil, or if you "think" he will do whatever. Why on earth would you put your faith in this man's behaviour when he has physically abused you?????

Stop listening to what you 'think' could happen. Start listening to your lawyers whose sole interest is to protect you and the children. Do whatever they say. Even if you think "oh but it's so sad that.." NO!!!!.

Stop giving a shit if it's sad or not. Your lawyers will be objective. Listen to them.