Why are some people put on a pedestal?

[Crumpetlover]

When they usually are people that don't bother doing anything for anyone else and are generally aloof and think they're brilliant?

Those that bother with people, make an effort and care about others get walked over. Those that walk over others, and have a high opinion of themselves get people absolutely falling over themselves to do things for them and to be their friend.

I'm beginning to think life would be a lot better if I focussed on myself all the time and didn't make an effort for anyone.

[Bonsoir]

Don't make an effort for people who don't make one back for you. Martyrdom is a learned behaviour and not one that wins you true friends and loving relationships.

[Offred]

In order to maintain the hideous levels of inequality in our country it is necessary to raise people to not want to hear about inequality or other people's difficulties, also to prize selfishness. If you are going to help others you need to do it for that reason, I don't think it is likely to win you friends

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

IME it's difficult people that get a disproportionate share of attention. Starts with everyone making allowances for little horror younger siblings while the sensible older ones are expected to be trouble-free saints. At school the hard-working, quieter ones get nothing because the ones with 'issues' take up everyone's time. Workplace, friends, hobbies.... everyone's so keen to be in favour with people with 'challenging personalities' but take nice, normal, reliable types utterly for granted.

My solution? a) Don't play the game. b) Be yourself. c) Develop a difficult side :)

[Crumpetlover]

I agree, Cogit0. Think I need to work on my difficult side....

[janelikesjam]

Interesting posts.

I like the way Bonsoir puts it, and agree. OTOH, I actually think some people who give alot can be very respected. A couple of 'givers' I know I would even say are quite charismatic.

Yes, the 'difficult side' sounds interesting concept though not sure what it means, exactly ?

p.s. Personally I think I am fairly caring and make an effort, but I think I can remove myself and 'play hardball' if I have to .

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

"Yes, the 'difficult side' sounds interesting concept though not sure what it means, exactly ?"

For me it means not automatically dropping everything to help others, saying 'no' more often, making feelings known rather than keeping quiet and avoiding a scene. In short, being a lot more assertive and less reliably amenable.

[Crumpetlover]

Hmmmm, I think I have shown my difficult side this morning lets just say that. Unleashing my assertive side now!

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

Once unleashed, it is never again tethered.... :)

[Crumpetlover]

I keep being very assertive lately. Can't bear unfairness or people who speak to me disrespectfully.

[Smithson6]

I have a friend that identifies very strongly as someone who "helps" others and I find my relationship with her very difficult.- "helping" too much (outside of normal reciprocal friendship) is about control imo and I think it really affects the quality of her friendships.

[Yarg]

I think many people confuse assertive, confident behaviour for 'thinking you are brilliant'.

My mother's like this: sneers and snipes at other people (usually women) for 'thinking they are it', 'lording it over everyone'. This is normally when she has encountered a pleasant, confident, extrovert person who makes her feel inadequate.

Tis very wearing.

[bradywasmyfavouritewiseman]

I used to try and do everything for everybody and was always agreeable.

I put myself last, ended up , depressed and generally fucking fed.

I learnt to say no more. I still help people but I won't kill myself or keep bending over backwards for people who don't really give a shit.

I used to care too much about what people thought of me. Now I don't and I am happier.

I am still (imo) a good person. But i an not a martyr.

[Crumpetlover]

There was one person in particular I was thinking about when I started this thread and she is supremely selfish, rather than just assertive or confident.

[TheLightPassenger]

ah brady, maybe when I grow up I will be more like you. I think Bonsoir is bang on.

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

There's a fine line between assertiveness and supreme selfishness but I think a lot of people - women especially - believe they have crossed that line when they still have a long, long way to go. When I read AIBU questions like 'am I being selfish to send the DC to the childminder even though I have the afternoon off?'... I despair ever so slightly.

The person who is supremely selfish... are they also quite physically attractive?

[Crumpetlover]

Yes, I'd say she is quite attractive Cogit0. Not necessarily stunningly beautiful but very photogenic and stylish. She puts lots of pics on Facebook of herself.

I agree about the fine line. She is the kind of person that never offers anything to anyone, whether it's her time or support, yet expects it from everyone else. It's almost as if, anything she wants, and people are falling over themselves to provide it. She's pregnant and friends in our circle were giving her maternity clothes and baby clothes, but not in a helpful way, more in a way to impress her, and she was so ungrateful. She's totally aloof and non-plussed by everything.

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

There you go then. There is a long and noble history of vain/good-looking/attractive people having a coterie of obsequious adorers :) I've known a few and, if it's any consolation, when they get older and their looks go they can find it's not so easy to click their fingers and expect others to come running. In the meantime, those demeaning themselves by sucking up shouldn't be surprised if they end up being treated with contempt

[MoaneyMcmoanmoan]

Can I nominate "Develop a difficult side" as phrase of the week or whatever Mumsnet calls it?

Love this.

I think as women we all need to give ourselves permission to do this - not just be "nice".

I don't like the sound of your aloof acquaintance OP. It's always irritating to see fawning hangers-on dazzled by a pretty face. Be glad you are secure enough not to be one.

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

I first came across the fawning, hanger-on, boot-licking, ass-kissing phenomenon when at primary school. :) Two girls in my class were the 'popular ones', patrolled the playground arm in arm with haughty disdain, and the others would literally compete to be friends with them! Occasionally they would fall out and others, sensing an 'in', would step up their efforts. Even at that tender age I found the whole thing a) quite funny and b) slightly baffling. Whenever I've met people like them since, I give them a very wide berth.

[MoaneyMcmoanmoan]

Yep Cogit0 I wouldn't be a 12-year-old again for anything. Watching DD navigate it is hard enough.

SO good to get older and be able to avoid playground politics. Unfortunately not everyone has made the leap... bit sad really.

[Crumpetlover]

Yes I'd say she is very like those girls in the playground. Lots of hangers on and admirers

[CogitOCrapNotMoreSprouts]

Arrested development :) Quite fun people watching, isn't it?

[whiteandyelloworchid]

Yes ivenoticed this before, esp when I used to work, the difficult people would get away with loads, the nice ones would get dumped on


Also I think there's a certain amount of trying to win friendships, as people think oh the nice ones are in the bag so to speak, so they work really hard on the er more difficult people in a desperate attempt to make them like them

It's rather amusing to watch really

I also dont do things I don't want to do, I've learnt to say no and it feels good