Idiot's guide to renovating a house please

[lamandler]

I've got myself in a right old pickle about a house we are about to exchange on. It's a few doors up from where we are renting and needs lots of work. I know there are a cast of thousands we need to talk to but I have been completely overwhelmed by advice (architect/no architect/planning permission/permitted development, etcetc).

We want to do loft conversion, move bathroom from ground to first floor, wiring, heating and decorate - then eventually do a side return extension on ground floor.

It's a victorian terrace in London.

Can anyone give me a step by step complete idiot's guide as to what I do now, and who i need to contract in what order?

[fresh]

If you're a novice then I suggest you do speak to an architect. As a starting point they can help,clarify whether you need pp (although you should be able to find that out on your local authority website).

Speak to a couple on the phone first, check out their websites to see if they do small residential projects, ask locally for recommendations.

They can do as much or as little as you want, from design only to design and specify, to design, specify, tender and project manage. It's up to you to decide how much help you need.

[oscarwilde]

About 6 months ahead of you. Found architects to be sod all use actually. Met with 4 and the only one who was any use was going to cost circa £20k as a % of the total build to "supervise" proceedings. He was also the only one who gave us a half accurate cost estimate [circa £150k with nothing particularly fancy in the way of kitchens and bathrooms] I'd suggest that it's on the low side. I'm really, very glad that we didn't start any work on the basis of the £60-80k estimates we had from the earlier architects.
Not wanting to put you off, but take your probable budget and double it, or revise your estimates on timescales :(
Lessons - it's a bit like a wedding, you get the cost of the reception from the hotel or venue and think ouch, that's a bit steep but just about manageable. Only later do you realise that all the other bits and pieces basically double that spend.
So you can get a basic quote to convert an attic from £25 to £40k depending on the size. All well and good - then you add in the light fittings (you'll want spots unless you have huge headroom), you'll want more than the standard allowance of two plug sockets, you'll opt for more expensive insulation, velux windows that open at the top rather than smack you between the eyes, etc etc. All the bits and pieces add up shockingly fast.

If you love the house, then go for it :) Just be realistic about the amount of time, effort and cash it is going to take. If you have small kids in tow, ask yourself can you deal with it. The kitchen extension will take circa 12 weeks to do which is a long time to be without a working kitchen.

[tawse57]

Do not underestimate the stress involved and the possible REAL damage to your physical and mental health as well as to your relationship.

Hope it works out for you but please go into it with your eyes open.

Double the cost and time of any estimates you get is always a good rule - especially in London. Frankly, if something is going to cost you tens of thousands, or over a hundred thousand, to modernise then seriously consider just paying that extra sum for a house ready to move into.

Over on that housepricecrash forum they used to have a thread about all those grand designs houses pointing out how many of them were later sold for less than the renovation costs, marriages split up, etc. Might be worth a read if you can find it.

Best of luck.

[lamandler]

Jesus

Too late to back out now! We will just do what we can afford and do the rest over the years to come - it's the only way we can afford a house where we want to live.

Anyone have some positive stories (please)?

[tawse57]

I heard of a young woman who ate a poisoned apple, fell into a deep coma and was awoken by a kiss from a Prince.

[BerylStreep]

I used an architect on recommendation from a friend. He charged £500 for drawings, and another £500 for technical specification and submitting the planning application. We changed our minds on the drawings a bit, so we paid £1400 altogether. Best £1400 we have spent.

I was pretty certain about what I wanted - loft conversion and a single story extension to the kitchen. My architect spent a bit of time with me discussing exactly what I wanted, what my 'problems' areas were, and he came up with a completely different idea - double story extension (but small - only going out 6 feet, but up 2 stories), and rearranging the rooms upstairs. He was dead against the loft extension, saying it would always look like an add on and after-thought.

We went with the architect's design, and the house flows wonderfully now. (Incidentally, when we were getting quotes, the original plan of loft conversion & kitchen extension was significantly higher than the double story extension).

We had done some building work about 4 years before, in the kitchen, and a lot of it was pulled out and redone - so a lot of it was money down the drain - I wish I had spoken to an architect then.

So my advice, from experience, is speak to an architect first - they will come up with ideas you won't think of, and will actually save you money by not doing things in a piecemeal fashion. If you are planning to do an extension, you would save money by doing this at the same time as the wiring & heating.

You don't need an architect who is also going to supervise the build, if you are satisfied that you can manage / supervise it yourself.

Oscar is also right about doubling the amount you budget for - our building work was quoted as £26,500, but ended up at £32,000. That doesn't include the cost of 2 new bathrooms, tiles, doors & hardware, light fittings, new sliding sash windows, new kitchen (but we reused appliances), and carpet. In total the whole thing was about £65K, including fees.

One more thing, when you are getting quotes from builders, be as exact as possible on what the specification is and on what the price includes - i.e. Vat, skips, scaffolding, installing electrics to your spec (not allowing for one single pendant, as my builder claimed), tiling, builders public liability insurance etc. This is where the architect comes in - he will put all of this on the building spec.

To summarise - I would be doing this in the following order:

1. Speak to an architect to get ideas.
   
2. Speak to builder to get rough cost of build, to see if you can afford it.
   
3. Back to architect to finalise drawings and get architect to submit the planning application for you (if needed).
   
4. Once planning comes back, architect to draw up building spec (with everything possible on the spec - e.g. plumbing requirements, all electrical sockets & light fittings, insulation spec, tiling etc)
   
5. You might need to get a structural surveyors report for certain bits - ours cost about £400.
   
6. (This is the bit I didn't do, and wish I had done) Give the building spec to a Quantity Surveyor, to price it up.
   
7. Either go to builders for quote (armed with your QS report to ensure quotes are realistic), or put it out to tender, based on QS report, to say 'this is the job, this is what I am prepared to pay'.
   

7a. Make sure you have a contract with the builder - covering timescales, variations to the build (i.e. if the founds suddenly need to be 2 feet deeper, who pays?) etc

1. Before work starts, contact council to advise on building control. They are a god-send, and will come out and check on the progress of the build, and stop your builder from taking short-cuts. Builders always say you don't need them, but you do.
   
2. Start writing cheques.
   

10. Consider divorce.
11. Enjoy your newly renovated house as the work becomes a distant memory.

[fresh]

I recommend Kevin McCloud's grand designs book, it has loads of sensible advice about starting from scratch, including a description of what each professional will do for you.

And excellent advice from berylstreep. It can be done without bankruptcy or divorce!

[lamandler]

Fantastic berylstreep, just what I needed!

[lamandler]

To beryl again - your architect sounds spot in, you in London perchance?

[BerylStreep]

Sadly not. There seem to be lots of architects on here though.

[tricot39]

Pm me for a London architect suggestion

[lamandler]

Thanks tricot, just did