Combi gas boiler is kapuut - advice please

[vinegarpuss]

We have been quoted approx £2000 to fit a Worcester combi boiler - does this seem reasonable? I have no experience of this type of thing, any advice welcome

[BecauseImWorthIt]

My boiler is troublesome, to say the very least, and in one of the many visits from British Gas over the last week they have suggested that it may be time for a new one. The engineer said that one through BG would be about £2000, although you could get one a lot cheaper elsewhere/fitted by someone else.

So sounds about right.

However, he also said that if you buy through BG they will let you spread the payments over time - not sure if you have to have a Homecare agreement to do this though. We have Homecare 400, so pay a bloomin' fortune every month! (Although it's been worth it as we have had to call them out so many times for our boiler)

[vinegarpuss]

thank you for that - it's a lot of money to pay out at this time of year so I will look into that

[lubeybooby]

Mine was £2000 but that included removal of the old one, moving new one upstairs and re-routing all the gas pipes.

[Merle]

Not sure if this if helpful but I am going to join in and whine.

We have a Worcester Bosch combi boiler, fitted and maintained by British Gas.

It has been the most unreliable piece of equipment ever, we are now up to the 50+th breakdown.

We have never got to the bottom of why it is so unreliable. It broke down last Saturday, and now this morning. I have written complaining letters before, but got nowhere. This morning, when I phoned up to book the engineer, I got the details of Customer Relations, to start to complain again.

Can't say that I would buy another, given this history.

[BecauseImWorthIt]

Goodness, a boiler that is worse than mine!

[greentown]

Just going through the process of getting a new boiler too and have been quoted £2000 - £2600 for new boiler alone and/or to incl 6 new small double radiators.
Plumbnation is a good website for boilers - sml combi will run in around £800 incl vat (1-3 bed property) + all the extras thermostat, timer, flue pipes etc so generally about just over £1000 total. the extra £1000 must just be for labour which seems rich for about 2/3 days work but there you have it. Screwfix are good for radiators - about £50 each +/- on average for bog standard.
Surprised to hear about the Worcester boiler problems - all the plumbers we've had round say they're the absolute best, followed by Vaillant, and the after-service is tops. British gas will be the most expensive for anything but I guess you pay for the name/brand.

[vinegarpuss]

this is for a large combi 37tdi (sound like a car), removing old one, fitting new one. No radiators etc as these are all quite new. I googled it and it is £1200 just to buy - so the labour and pipes/stuff must make up the rest.....

[Merle]

Greentown - I know, they are meant to the best, that's why we were ok about shelling out in the first place. When it works it is great, but it is pitifully prone to breakdowns and I am at my wits end. I do wonder if it is a fault with combi boilers generally, which noone tells us about - they are prone to problems,due to the moving parts.

[greentown]

Merle - you're making me doubt whether we should have a Worcester. We've allways had combis and only ever had one really ancient one break down on us. Have had a new Baxi which was excellent and recently an old Vaillant which was again excellent. Even now we're using this really ancient thing by Sime? which still works well but is in the wrong position and is ready for a change.
Personally, because we're a wee household, I would always have a combi anyway but I'm having second thoughts about Worcester.

[greentown]

All the plumbers say Worcester have an excellent breakdown service too - you'd think they could have sorted your boiler out by now.

[Merle]

I know. I should have been more assertive, but the years have gone by, been busy etc.

We have had Worcester people out, we have had full services from BG, trouble-shooting etc. We have spent £500 on a magnet, to gather any metals which might be floating about in the system, clogging it up. There are periods when it works well - sometimes as much as 6 months at a time, then there are periods when it is dreadful. We are in such a period, and it is only early November (pessimistic emotion).

I think we need a back-up hot water system, but this really wasn't the idea when we paid out for what we thought was a good brand. I probably should be doing some consumer research on the net, rather than moaning on here, but you've caught me at a weak moment (aka waiting in for an engineer).

[greentown]

Blimey - sounds terrible. Does that magnet thing work? We've had lots of plumbers trying to sell this thing which supposedly draws the sludge out of your system using the wonders of magnetism - sounds like there might be a lot of profit in it. I think you're supposed to empty it every six months or so.

[ByTheWay1]

We had the magnet thing fitted free when we bought our Worcester boiler (British gas) - we've had no breakdowns in 4 years - just minor problems with a leak, a faulty rad valve and the usual crappy freeze of the condensate pipe last year in the continued sub zero temps - we fixed that ourselves anyhow. But nothing with the boiler itself.

We have the BGas service cover , and when they service the boiler, they do the magnet sludge too - and my goodness is it filthy!!.

[Merle]

The magnet seemed to work, in fact when they first did it I thought it was the real answer to our problems - we have cast iron radiators and I think that they are unsuitable for a combi boiler, although BG will never admit it. Anyway it seemed to work for a while, but now there are problems again.... I've never emptied it and can't remember being told to. We have an engineer here so often that I assume that they do it.

[ByTheWay1]

I wouldn't assume they empty it...... we ask them to do it after one BG engineer said "do you want me to do it?". Which made me think it is a nasty dirty job and may get "overlooked" IYKWIM.

[greentown]

yes - it might be best to have a look, you never know - might be the answer!

[PigletJohn]

The Magnaclean is extremely good at capturing black sludge (iron oxide) that comes from corroding steel radiators, usually. You can add a chemical such as Sentinel X400 which loosens old sludge so the Magnaclean can capture it. You ought to be opening the Magnaclean yourself and scraping the sludge out. It is not much more difficult than opening a stiff pickle jar, and you will be amazed and delighted to see how much it catches in a week. Eventually (unless you still have a defect causing more corrosion to occur) it will stop finding any and will stay fairly clean for months on end.

Adey's Magnaclean was the first modern, mass-market product to do all that, and for several years it cornered the market. Unfortunately however the build quality is not first class and they tend to leak in time. The canister and lid are made of hard plastic, with a very powerful magnet sheathed in stainless steel inside. I understand BG stopped supplying them because they had so much trouble getting call-backs to leaks. I have used Magnacleans but in my own house I have a Spirovent, which is a very solid brass device that captures particles. However it is not as dramatic and fast in use as a Magnaclean. My system is very clean though so there isn't any black sludge to capture.

If you have a very dirty system I still think it is worth fitting a Magnaclean, even though you may have to replace it in a few years. By that time your system should be clean and you could have gate valves fitted to the pipes to make it easy to replace if necessary.

Before a new boiler is fitted to an old system, the old system is supposed to be thoroughly cleaned so all the old dirt is removed, and an inhibitor added to prevent any new corrosion occurring. Damage or clogging to a boiler caused by dirt and sludge is not covered by the manufacturer's guarantee; they sold you a clean boiler, and it isn't their dirt.