Stealing - using credit card online

[blackcoffee]

Just found out ds11 took my card and used it to order online apps. Didn't handle it as well as I could have done, I shouted and yelled instead of staying cool. Money is tight for us and I can't afford this kind of thing. The deceit I find repellent. Advice on how I should reinforce the message calmly, please. Am so upset.

[PedantMarina]

Hmm, I'm sure wiser heads will ride in soon, but for me, it's the deceit. If DC had asked, that might have been different.

Approach it via two strands: the paying-back of the monetary value, and the 'stealing'.

[blackcoffee]

Yes, it's the deceit! so hard to feel you can't trust. He went in my bag, took the card and input the details. I do worry for the future, too, if he can do this at 11.

[blackcoffee]

he's been wailing 'I'll pay it back' and of course he will, out of his bank account. But I can't trust him and I worry where it will lead without really effective consequences for the stealing.

[Boudica1990]

Not much advice I can offer really as I have no DC (mine is still in my uterus as we speak), think paying back is one step but perhaps explaining that the trust has been damaged, and how trust must be earnt and respected.Turn it in to a life lesson too.

My mother had a hilarious way of dealing with a similar situation when big brother did something similar when eBay just started and removed his computer off him and give it back to him a piece at a time over weeks as she slowly got repaid (plus interest) and trusted him again. Took nearly 2 months if I remeber, I was grinning like a Cheshire cat haha

[rootypig]

Make him pay it back in cash - I mean physical money - this will make the card much more real to him, iyswim. Don't forget 11 is still really little and he was thinking about having the apps more than taking your money. Yes, they understand right and wrong, but morality is a huge and complex thing that takes a lifetime to master (vs shiny apps!). So explain to him, help him understand what he did and how you feel, and then be reaaaaally angry if he ever does it again.

[blackcoffee]

thank you everyone, you are being very nice about it!
I wondered whether to get the money back by cancelling an activity holiday he's booked on with the school after SATs? do you think that's fair, or harsh?

[blackcoffee]

he spent best part of £200 btw

[Rosa]

He needs to have a consequence for his actions. The removing and making him 'pay back ' in installments seems a good idea then it has longer to sink in.

[Ememem84]

Initially I thought you might be overreacting. As I thought it was just a couple of apps. But £200?? No way overreacting. Assume apps and inapp purchases??

Make him pay it back. Talk to him about not being able to trust him anymore. And change your password.

Maybe no treats for a while. Take him shopping (supermarket) and just buy the basics. No nice food. Because you can't afford it.

[rootypig]

£200!!! times have moved on since I was a girl
I stand by my advice to make him pay it back in cash, and try to see it as childhood stupidity rather than indicative of his morals but he needs to see how angry and upset you are. I would ban him from computer a set time, and make him do some kind of work for you instead, since work = money. And explain the link.

[LastingLight]

I would be livid if my 11 year old did that, and would also have shouted. I think that cancelling the holiday is fair. Will that recoup all the money? Otherwise extra chores as well. I would also remove his computer/tablet or whatever he used for a period of time.

[blackcoffee]

oh he's seen angry and upset alright! I've been tearing my hair out. I have got one transaction cancelled, just waiting to see about two more (three for 70 each!!) and a random series of little ones.
I will be making him do a lot more around the house and recovering the money. Still undecided about holiday, spoke with HT to explore the idea (have already paid school) and she thinks too harsh ... had no sleep so need to mull it over
He knows we struggle to make ends meet and I've explained about trust, he's ccontrite but I need him to see longer term seriousness of this
really grateful for the responses

[blackcoffee]

Ememem we pretty much shop on basics anyway! it was some stupid FA football coins thing

[rootypig]

I've been thinking about this a bit OP. I was a basically good kid who did some daft and wrong things, and my parents came down on me like a tonne of bricks. I think a tough punishment is fair, absolutely, but should be coupled with the opportunity to regain good favour (contributing to the family in some appropriate way) and once the punishment is through, and the work done (and this point is defined from the start), you're praised for having come through it together and it isn't held over his head. Hope that makes sense. Just musings on my own childhood I guess. The second part of the equation was missing for me, so I thought my parents didn't like me, and that they thought I was a bad person. Maybe they did. But I would have loved the chance to live up to their good opinion.

[alita7]

£200 when you're that tight?! wow.

I would be going for severe punishments. Kids sometimes don't realise that you actually need to have the money to pay back a credit card bill.
I would show him a basic budget of your money. saying you have x amount in a month and must buy x and food costs x etc.
I would take away any means of using the Internet for at least a month. I would maybe even make him pick out some things of his he could sell and no let him have any extras or go to clubs so he learns that if the money is not carefully looked after then you can't have extras. He should also for go pocket money until it is paid for, taking money out of his bank account which presumably he doesn't have access to yet wouldn't have as much of an impact.

This also brings me to another point of how on earth these games can justify such expensive add ons... as you are certainly not the first person I've heard of this happening to.

I know what I say might seem harsh but it's just such a huge sum of money, I know if that happened to us we'd literally have to go without food as we have barely any extra money and you sound similar. I used to nick coins out of mums purse or from on the side but it was rarely more than a pound or 2 and I'd usually spend it on food when I was out with friends or something, not something as ridiculous as those silly apps!

[alita7]

I would also tell him you are cancelling the holiday and hopefully then he will show his remorse by trying to make up for his behaviour and then you can tell him that as he has made an effort to make things better he can still go on the holiday. If he has a bad attitude and makes no attempt to sort things out then get your money back and don't send him.

[DogCalledRudis]

Get rid of the tablet until he's older

[Claybury]

Might be irrelevant but ... When DS was about 6/ 7 he managed to buy some in app purchases on my phone ( I had not learnt to disable in app purchases and he knew my password so it was technically my fault) but I emailed Apple and they refunded it ( about £180!). I am not sure if he really knew he was spending actual money as he was so young. I hope you get some of the cash back.