Housing

[mintyfresh]

AIBU to wonder why this huge crisis isn't being addressed by any political party before the election?

I was completely fobbed off when I raised housing as my most major issue with the local Tory candidate on my doorstep today. He couldn't have been less interested

The enormous waiting lists for social and council housing, overcrowding, young people/families forced into renting long term because of high house prices, breakdown of community because of multi-occupancy properties. These are all major issues for the UK and I have seen no real policies to address them.

The only interest politicians have is in whether they have made enough money on their second homes!!

[TheHeathenOfSuburbia]

Maybe the parties are a bit torn on this one, trying not to upset anyone in election year?

Policies tending to bring down house prices will not go down well with Middle England.
Policies that might inflate house prices will not go down well with first-time-buyers etc.
(And I guess the Middle-England types are more likely to vote)

Plus there's the NIMBY factor of no-one wanting new houses built next to them - do you remember the furore about those eco-towns that were proposed a few years ago? Are any of those actually going to go through in the end?

[salizchap]

Basically, I agree with the health of suberbia. Those that have bought a house want to see the value of that house increase. If we start building more homes, values will start to stabilise and even reduce.

It makes me really angry, but that is the way it is. I am one of the lucky ones, I was made homeless after my ex left me with our 2 year old son. (the only good thing he did for us, though I didn't see it that way at the time) I was rehoused, and now live in a housing association flat. But my neighbours next door have 3 children, a girl of about 11, a boy of 9, another baby girl who all have to share one bedroom in a two bed flat with their parents. And others I know have been on the waiting list for over 10 years and are still no where near the top.

Private rents are extortionate, and the possibility of a mortgage is as remote as a major lottery win.

I am afraid this situation will only change when a larger proportion of society is suffering the indignity of inadequate and over-priced accomodation. Numbers count. There just aren't enough of the have nots to make that haves sit up and listen.

[mintyfresh]

That is also my feeling salizchap and heathenofsurburbia. But it is so short sighted - apparently the BNP are gaining in popularity in areas where council housing waiting lists are at their highest. Many would blame it on immigration but it is sheer fact of years of underinvestment in social housing and allowing a property boom to happen.

It is a storm waiting to happen as the number of 'have nots' gets bigger, so why do none of the parties address the crisis?

At the end of the day, more young people owning their own homes is a GOOD thing for society. Like you say salizchap - how can overcrowding like that be good for families?

[TheHeathenOfSuburbia]

It's to do with the money from council house sales not being allowed to be spent on building new ones, isn't it? i think thatcher introduced that, but I'm not sure anyone has repealed it - and if not, why not. There doesn't seem to be any justification for it.

I know Labour introduced that law about councils being able to take over properties left empty for ages, but I'm not sure it's made much of a difference, has it? Maybe there's something getting in the way, the legal costs too expensive perhaps, or the council thinks it'll be unpopular with voters.

[Kevlarhead]

The Baby Boom generation have lots of votes, lots of houses, and most of the housing equity. No politician would suggest that house prices might need to fall, or that the average lone first time buyer only being able to afford a starter home at the age of 37 is a bad thing.

They might as well resign straight away and save themselves the grief.

[TheHeathenOfSuburbia]

Kevlarhead- I am right in the middle of reading The Pinch by David Willetts, about just that, it is very good - in fact I might go mad and say it's the best book I've ever read written by a Tory

[expatinscotland]

things will never change in this country re: housing.

never.

i'm under no illusions my children will stay in the UK once they leave school, if they even last that long.

[salizchap]

Things will have to change, when more and more working families are unable to afford even to rent a small place, eventually we will see flavela-style ghettos being built as more and more people get pushed out of even the rental market (let alone the buying one).

This will cause more unrest as the authorities try to remove people's unauthorised homes. But it won't work because people have to live somewhere.

[ninedragons]

I couldn't agree more.

But it won't change. You think there is a hole in the pension funds now - if property prices dropped 40% there would be an AWFUL lot of Baby Boomers depending on their BTL who suddenly had no private means of support at all for their old age.

It's now economically impossible to allow a house price crash. Tony and Gordon completely fucked one generation over to fund the retirement of another.

[expatinscotland]

'eventually we will see flavela-style ghettos being built as more and more people get pushed out of even the rental market (let alone the buying one).'

Those happen in places where there is no strong centralised government, in places where there is no housing benefit.

Not going to happen here.

What will happen is more and more young people leaving the country for good either to acquire skills they can't get here (apprenticeships or other vocational education or even university if prices start to get to where it's as cheaper or cheaper to go international) or to get a job that will afford them what they feel is a better quality of life.

Fewer people to support the boomers.

[jackstarbright]

Why are politicians avoiding discussing housing? I'd say it in 3 words. Subprime Mortgage Crisis.

The US's big idea to let large numbers of first time buyers into the housing market. And here in the uk banks were encouraged to offer mortgages to people who could only just afford them. While interests rates were low all was well - but then interests rates increased....and then a whole can of nasty Goldman Sachs worms was opened.

What with the large number of 'moth balled' half built housing estates and the house building industry in virtual shut down in much of the UK - we have a right old mess.

But YANBU - and keep hassling your candidates!

[expatinscotland]

'There should have been more balance kept in the system. Rent prices are shocking.'

Yes, but it's like low wages: the government enables businesses to pay low wages via the tax credit system.

Some say this is good because it allows employers to offer jobs, others say it's not so good because it keeps wages artificially low.

As long as it benefits shareholders, however, it will continue.

With housing/rents, there's housing benefit.

This keeps prices artificially high so the asset, on paper at least, retains its value.

So, nothing will change.

[expatinscotland]

I just don't see it collapsing because the government will always prop up the market: low interest rates, housing benefit for homeowners to keep them in their house, housing benefit for renters to pay huge rents, bailing out banks, etc.

[EggyAllenPoe]

t's to do with the money from council house sales not being allowed to be spent on building new ones, isn't it? i think thatcher introduced that,

the original deal for right-to-buy ringfenced the money for social housing spending..

the problem is all kinds of housing is n high demand, and getting planning permission is phenomenaly difficult.

the main cause = fewer peopl per house. this has meant de-population in areas where little housing is built (though it s not unusual to see a village fighting against closure of its school/pub/post office and at the same time opposing new developments of any kind)

[expatinscotland]

't's to do with the money from council house sales not being allowed to be spent on building new ones, isn't it?'

That's just one factor, though.

NIMBYism is another.

In a village near here, there are literally nothing but pensioners living there.

A housing association wanted to build 11 houses, not flats, but semi-detached housing for shared ownership (so the buyers, of course, would have to be in employment to get a mortgage).

The objection was overwhelming. It was 'social' housing and outright comments of we-don't-want-people-like-that-here.

There are quite a few houses for sale round there, too.

But they've been on the market a looonng time.

Because the owners probably own them outright, however, they can afford to let them sit.

[jackstarbright]

"But surely one day it'll all collapse in a heap? What do we actually produce? Are we bringing in more revenue year on year?"

LeniGrad - you'll be voting Tory next

[jackstarbright]

LeniGrad - You sound like a pragmatic idealist to me. Which is a good thing . Infact we could certainly do with a decent number of those in government next week, especially if we get a coalition!

[TheHeathenOfSuburbia]

Oh, there we go:

apparently they are changing the rules on councils' right-to-buy income, that should help a bit.

Still don't fully understand while the councils weren't allowed to keep the cash in the first place (the knee-jerk answer, that Margaret Thatcher was Satan in a skirt suit, is one I have matured away from )

[crystal123]

LENINGRAD TO WANT LESS As you are aware I don't agree with most of what you say, but to encourage a society to want less is a good thing. I have read the book Affluenza and I feel rampant consumerism can make us very unhappy.