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Politics

Childcare tax vouchers

16 replies

henny2 · 01/10/2009 15:21

What is Gordon going on about now - childcare vouchers used by the middle-classes to pay for pony lessons! Not possible as they can only be 'cashed' by registered childminders. He later said the savings were used to pay for pony lessons - so what - we are always hearing about an obese nation. What about all those benefit funded big screen TV's and gadgets we keep seeing in the news. angry

OP posts:
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girlwithapearl · 07/10/2009 19:52

I am so furious about this proposal to scrap childcare vouchers. I have just gone back to uni so my previous meagre income has gone. Totally reliant on DH's income. Can't say that we are badly off, on the breadline or anything, but every little helps.
I am going through all the hoops to employ my nanny by the book - paying taxes, NI etc - which basically means we have no spare income per month. Having the voucher just eases the burden that little bit. I know so many hard working parents who will be really hit by this.

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summerof76 · 07/10/2009 20:12

I agree - childcare vouchers are one of the only benefits available for hard-working middle income families (those who don't qualify for Working Tax Credit etc.). Many of these families have very little disposable income once childcare costs and bills have been paid. I am very angry that the government is planning to stop the scheme and see it as a disincentive for parents to work.

I also think that when the government talks about "free" places for 2,3 and 4 year olds this is very misleading. As most of you will know "free" places are limited to 12.5 hours per week (15 hrs from January next year). Fine for SAHMs who send their children to pre-school for a couple of hours in the morning, but for working parents, these "free" places only cover a fraction of the cost of a private day nursery.

Childcare vouchers can also be used to fund after-school and holiday clubs for older children. There are no "free" places offered for these.

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kaballie · 07/10/2009 20:25

I love these vouchers but between me n DH we bring in enough to feed, clothe, house ourselves and the LO's and would still be able to without the vouchers.I might not be able to go on holiday twice a year, shop for new clothes all the time or afford a new widescreen tele but I'm alive and happy.

Why the government are paying for nearly a 3rd of my child's fees I don't know and we are at the low end of the salary scale, just above the 'child poverty line' apparently!

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GhoulsAreLoud · 07/10/2009 20:40

Gordon Brown: "It is not fair that around a third of tax relief for childcare goes to the 6% of parents who pay tax at the higher rate."

Why isn't it fair? They pay more tax in the first instance and the tax relief they receive is far less generous than tax credits which benefit low and middle income families by an average of £68 per week.

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EatingSwansHorror · 07/10/2009 20:43

C'mon guys.

How many of you NEED those vouchers. How many of you will go without food or clothing? How many of your children will actually suffer because of this? You might have to cancel your Sky subscription at worst. Or stop eating organic. Or have to cancel the annual holiday. Let's get this in perspective. We are very lucky in this country. We also have to face the fact that we're in a recession and we have to start clawing money back from somewhere. I'd rather that it was from the comfortable middle classes than from the NHS or education budget.

Also bear in mind that this isn't planned until 2015. We'll all be home and dry by then.

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EatingSwansHorror · 07/10/2009 20:48

GAL

It's simple. It isn't fair because higher tax payers EARN more than lower tax payers. Ergo, they have MORE money and shouldn't be given MORE back by the government. It's ridiculous to say that someone paying the highest rate of tax needs to claim the £1,500 maximum allowed. If they can't afford to live off £35,000 plus and paid nursery fees then they need to go on a money management course to be honest.

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GhoulsAreLoud · 07/10/2009 20:55

They earn more, they get bugger all off the govt but this. Unlike low and middle income families who are eligible for all manner of tax credits.

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GhoulsAreLoud · 07/10/2009 20:56

Oh, this and child benefit.

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EatingSwansHorror · 07/10/2009 21:00

They get LESS cos they earn MORE. I know. Let's give the rich MORE and the poor less. That's a fab idea. Make the gap bigger. That sounds like the kind of world I would love to live in.

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GhoulsAreLoud · 07/10/2009 21:03

You are being obtuse eatingswans.

Why did you change your name to post on this thread by the way? Are you embarassed to contribute under your own name?

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EatingSwansHorror · 08/10/2009 09:27

There is nothing obtuse about what I am saying. It's my opinion, that doesn't make it obtuse.
Oh, and I changed my name cos it came out of the Daily Mail headline generator tonight and it made me laugh, not for any bizarre sinister reason that you may think! Why are you checking on my name changing? I find that a bit odd? Anyway, over and out. Bored now!

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GhoulsAreLoud · 08/10/2009 09:58

How childish.

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ProfessorLaytonIsMyLoveSlave · 08/10/2009 10:24

We don't NEED the vouchers in that we'll starve if we don't get them. We NEED them in the sense that if we don't have them the already slightly marginal "should I WOH or not" question gets tipped further towards not. I'm currently a very few pounds better off a month from working. If we lose childcare vouchers then it probably ceases to be worth my financial while to work, so I drop out of the workforce and pay no tax at all[1]. I'm struggling to see how this is a massive win for the economy.

And what's the "saving" being used for? To provide, specifically, 10 hours' free nursery care for lower-paid parents of 2 year olds. From the sound of things, this is likely to be like the "free places" for 3 year olds and be five 2-hour sessions a week, which will be as much use as a chocolate teapot in terms of enabling lower-income parents to work, and of no benefit to those who'd rather use childcare or child socialisation arrangements other than a nursery. The whole set of "get children from lower-income families into nursery care" initiatives appear to be motivated by a sense that the poor are one vast featureless underclass whose children need to be rescued by being funneled into institutional childcare at the earliest possible age, and I find that a profoundly un-Labour and anti-working class attitude.

While scrapping childcare vouchers would hurt us personally, I wouldn't mind so much if (a) I were confident that there would actually be savings that wouldn't be offset by lots of middle-class women dropping out of the workforce and out of paying tax entirely and (b) the savings were going to do something useful like offset some part of the deficit or actually alleviate the childcare tax burden of lower paid families in some meaningful way. Extra childcare tax credits for the low paid? Vouchers for the low paid to be spent on any registered childcare of their choice at a time convenient for them? Those ideas might have some merit. But 10 hours a week of nursery education specifically for two-year-olds is a big pile of steaming crap.

In my opinion, of course.

[1] Hypothetically. In practice it's not coming in at all because Labour will lose the next election for five years, at which point my DCs won't be in FT childcare any more. But a hypothetical me a few years younger would be making very different choices about whether to return to work (i.e. not doing it).

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JustAnotherMum2b · 03/12/2009 20:27

So, childcare vouchers back on for basic rate tax payers - great

And free childcare for 1/3 of 2 year olds kicked into the long grass - not so great

If childcare is really a government priority, why not both? I know its tight financial times etc but c'mmon, this is small fry in terms of government spend... They could sort it with half the money apparently saved yesterday from stopping every regional police force wasting their time buying things separately.

Gordon and Mr Balls: Get your priorities straight and keep your promises.

(ps. Free childcare offer for 3s and 4s is fantastic, open to all, taken up by people from all different social backgrounds, and I can have whatever sessions I want where I live. Professor Layton you're talking tosh!)

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oldwomanwholivedinashoe · 03/12/2009 20:33

FFS the only thing I get help with is child care - in the form of vouchers. we are getting seriously in debt as my husbands business goes down the drain in this recession. we work like hell. I pay SH** loads of money into this country. if they lose the child care vouchers it'll be tempted to take my family abroad to live - where I will appreciated for my expertiseand not expected to suppot the disgusting situation which is our benefits system here.

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MaryMcGinty · 21/10/2010 22:21

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