Moving house for a better school - is it worth it?

[knickerelasticjones]

Hello

My DH and I are in a rightly blardy muddle about this.

We have two DDs (2.8 and 3mnths), still both wee, but we are already thinking about schools. Problem is our local primary is ok-ish(but not great) and our local secondary is really not that great.

The thing is we LOVE our house and know that we wouldn't be able to afford anything as big / nice as this in a 'better' part of town. (Don't mean to imply that we live in some huge palace - it's a 3 bed terraced house. But I still think we are really lucky to have that).

So what to do?

Does a 'good school' REALLY have that much impact on a child's education? Or is the most important thing the support that we give our DDs?

I also feel like such a snob cos even thinking about moving implies that the schools that our neighbours kids go to at the moment are not good enough for our children. IYSWIM.

Has anybody else been in this situation? Would really appreciate some experiences from you wise MNers....

[frogs]

Like everything else, it depends.

If the move is from the catchment area of an okay school to a good school, then it may not be worth it.

If the move is from the catchment of a terrible school (defined by poor teaching and discipline and low academic standards rather than the kinds of homes the kids come from) to an okay school, then it may well be worth it.

The support that you give your dc is the single most important factor, but you also need to ensure that you can send them to a school where they feel safe, will be appropriately taught and will stand a reasonable chance of finding some like-minded souls.

Go and visit. See several schools, even ones you're out of area for, and get a feel for what the differences are, and how that matches up with what you want for your dc. It's the only way.

[artichokes]

We are sort of in the opposite situation to the OP. We live in the catchment area of a BRILIIANT primary. People move into our street just to get in. But our house is a bit small for us and we have no garden. DD is only 15 months and I would love to move to a bigger place. We can't decide whether it is madness to move out of the area of this school when we could hang on for 3 years, get DD in, then move. If she were in the future siblings would get priority regardless of where we lived.

I spoke about this to a friend who is an educational psychologist. She reckons that at primary level kids only need a goodish school to do well. AS long at the teachers have class control and there is no bullying she reckons a bright kid can thrive anywhere. The most important thing is that the parents encourage and engage them with reading etc at home. However she reckons secondary is rather different and you need a good school to stop your kids getting distracted and losing interest in education.

Hope that helps. Good luck with your decision.

[Evenhope]

Before moving you need to be sure you will get a place at the school.

We moved house when our children were 11, 10, 8 and 6. We moved because we didn't like the house we were in, needed more space etc but only looked at houses within walking distance of good primary schools.

The school wouldn't give us a yes or no until we'd exchanged contracts and you exchange on the day you move. They then told us they were full

As the house wasn't my first choice (it was DH's) had I known the school was full I'd not have bought it.

So we have a school at the end of our road, less than 2 minutes walk. We have the inconvenience of other people parking in our road to take their kids to the school but we had to drive to one further away.

[PestoMonster]

You should also bear in mind that schools can change. For instance our local primary school was under 'special measures' when we first moved here and dd1 was a baby. However, there was a change of headship, and by the time dd1 was ready to start school, it had been completely turned around by the new head.

So you could find it happens the other way round for you. A supposedly 'good' school can easily slip by the time your lo's are due to start. So I would consider this before doing anything too drastic like moving.

[Marina]

I'd expand on what frogs says about it all depending.
We would have had no worries at primary level where we used to live. However, we'd have been totally stuffed at secondary level, and I am not exaggerating.
Local markets can be weird things. We have moved from a posh and lovely suburb in London to a much less posh and attractive one further out. We sold our small and squalid flat and got a substantial if slightly tatty three bed house...and access not only to several very good state primaries (and one lovely independent one), but also in the catchment area for a number of good state grammar and non-selective secondary schools.
I do think a good school makes a big difference in the life of a child because they spend so much time there. You are absolutely right to say that parental input is critical, but most children will be happier in a school which is well-managed and not Failing or in Special Measures.
Only you know whether good schools and cost of housing are inextricably linked in your town/area. In SE London, the state schools are massively better in laughable surburban affordable Bexley than they are in pricier, prettier, more cultured Greenwich.

[knickerelasticjones]

thanks for the replies - lots to think about.

Artichoke - the comments from your ed psychologist friend are really useful. TBH it's more the secondary school that is a concern than the primary. In terms of academic achievements of pupils it ranks in the bottom quarter of schools where I live. (I know that it's INCREDIBLY premature to be worried about secondary when our DD2 is only 3 months, but for a variety of financial reasons we're much more likely to be able to move now, than in 10 years time.)

Frogs - I really agree with your comment about finding like-minded souls. That's actually one of our main concerns. Both my DH and I went to state schools where we had quite a hard time and were picked on as being 'posh' etc. as we came from middle class backgrounds and didn't have the same accent as the vast majority of the kids. I was lucky in that I did find a good groups of friends, but my DH says he barely had a friend at school and absolutely HATED it. He also did really poorly academically and basically dropped out, despite being very intelligent. So I'm scared that we might set our DDs up for the same sort of thing.

BUT at the same time I don't want my kids to grow up in some middle-class bubble of affluence, I"d like them to meet lots of different people so they can learn to judge people on who they are, not what their background is.

OH thank God for mumsnet as I find it really hard to discuss this with some of my RL friends without sounding like such a snob.

I just want my kids to get a good academic education, while still learning that there are lots of different people out there....

[knickerelasticjones]

Hi Marina - yes there is a similar situation in the city where I live too.

Some of the most expensive and beautiful part of town to live in are in the catchment for some of the poorer secondary schools.

Luckily our council provides a street by street map of catchment areas so before you move house you can work out exactly which school you would be in the catchment for.

And as far as I know most of the good schools are over-subscribed so you really only get in if you live in the catchment.

[Heated]

The biggest influencing factor are the parents. Then the school. I teach in an outstanding school but the key factor is the attitude of the pupils towards learning, which comes broadly from home.

Visit the schools now to get a feel for what they are like. See if the head is nearing retirement & what the staff turnover is like, as a new person at the helm can make a big difference. Read the ofsted report and then visit to see how the areas for action are being acted upon. Compare schools according to result on www.upmystreet.co.uk

If you do move, check you are well within catchment since catchment area shrinks the more successful the school is - could be a very expensive mistake!

If the school was in special measures, had appalling results or a sizable number of badly behaved pupils then my children would not be going there. Otherwise I would want to judge for myself, having attended a comp which attained average results (refelcting the intake) but from where I received an excellent ed and went onto a prestigious uni - unlike my privately ed brother!

[Dinosaur]

Marina, I must ask you more about where you live and the schools there (and I know I have an opportunity to do so coming up veyr soon ).

[bluenosesaint]

Do you have to move house?

We moved dd1's school without moving house - we rang the school, spoke to them at length, visited the school and enrolled dd within the week. She started there in the next academic year.

Luckily its still only a few miles away (although across boroughs) and isn't a nightmare to travel to and from.

[Marina]

Will be glad to talk more about it dino
It's astonishingly affordable round here for the the schools quality IMO but of course the trade off is no tube, no cafes, no bookshops, no theatre nearby, and an overwhelmingly monocultural environment devoid of character (this is how I feel about it in my bleaker moments - all the locals at our church are lovely though, it's not a total howling wilderness)

[Orinoco]

Message withdrawn

[moonstruck]

It's so hard when it comes to choosing schools. When we moved to this area three years ago the school my child now attends was in special measures but as has been mentioned here before the new head has completely turned it aroud and it is now very popular. We actually sent her to the best performing school league table wise at first but this turned out to be on the decline and her present school is gaining momentum, so we moved her. Can you sit tight for a while and watch devolopements/ visit the schools a few times/ talk to other mums?
There are not a massive amount of like minded souls in my Dc's schools but she is part of a group of 5/6 children who are delightful.
I think, if you are happy in your home and your area, a local primary school is the best choice unless it is truly appalling. But I do plan to move for secondary school, I think that is much more important

[knickerelasticjones]

Moonstruck - to be honest I'd happily sit tight and send my DDs to our local primary as it is pretty much ok and we know lots of local children who go their. (DD1 already knows 3 children who would be in her year, which I think is a lovely thing given that she is only 2!).

But as I said before I just don't think we'll be able to move in 10 years time - basically my DH will be in his mid fifties by then so we'd be unlikely to get a mortgage which would allow us to move to an area for a better secondary school. So it's the secondary that is really the problem and not the primary.

From reading all the replies I've decided that I really do have to go and check these schools out though! What do you do? Can I jsut phone up and ask to come and have a chat / look around? I don't think I phone the secondary though - if I told them how old my DC are they would think I was nuts!

[OrmIrian]

How strict are catchment areas with regard to secondary schools? In our town there are 4 schools any of which the children could realistically go to. OK, none of them are outstanding and several I wouldn't send a dog to . But the one we've chosen for DS#1 seems pretty good thanks to a new and very effective head.

[Heated]

But the secondary will have an open evening and more revealing perhaps, open mornings - well worth checking out. Ring to see when they are.

Just phone up the primary school/s,say your are a prospective parent and ask to be shown around.

[Heated]

But the secondary will have an open evening and more revealing perhaps, open mornings - well worth checking out. Ring to see when they are.

Just phone up the primary school/s,say your are a prospective parent and ask to be shown around.

[moonstruck]

Just phone them-any good school will be happy for you to visit at your own convenience.
YWhat a dilemma to be in- it would be great for your daughter to start this school with existing friends. I know exactl what you mean about secondary schools- I have only one within walking distance which is a very bad place. So I either move beforehand and ny children have to make new friends or be prepared to travel further; probably out of borough.
I don't know, the responsibility is immense sometimes isn't it?

[knickerelasticjones]

oops! previous post should read go there not go their. Lets hope DDs get a better education than me.....

ormIrian AFAIK the catchments are quite strict here - at least when it comes to getting into the good schools

[Fizzylemonade]

We moved to a completely new area for DH's job BUT did get a smaller house to get our son into an amazing primary school. He started in sept and now we can look to move next year to the bigger house we originally wanted. It gives us more scope as we are not worried about the "catchment" (we don't have that here unless the school is oversubscribed, it always is, then it goes as the crow flies in concentric circles from the school gate)

Secondary school wise, we would be willing to pay for private school should the local school nosedive. Having had an average education with little parental support I believe that the Heated is right; parental involvement makes a huge difference.

My friend works is a primary school where they have just expelled a pupil whose parents didn't even bother to show up for the expelling!!!!