Quick background; I have 2 DSs, aged 10 and 11. Because of their age, XP doesn't have PR for them. I left the family home and the relationship 7 years ago (when DS1 was just turned 5 and DS2 was 3) because XP was, among other things, physically, emotionally and financially abusive, controlling and had issues with drinking and drug taking in front of the DC. There are no court orders in place either forcing or stopping contact. XP has seen DC 7 times in 7 years. My 'new' DP and I have been together 4 years. We have lived apart due to distance, 300 miles, and work/studying commitments until now but are moving in together in a couple of months. I am 4.5 months pregnant with DP's child. XP is apparently expecting his 4th with his 'new' partner (they were married 6 months after I left). DC currently have the XP's name, they want to change it. I have sole PR for them just now. DP wants to adopt the DC, they are very keen for this to happen. I wouldn't seek to cancel contact with the DC's father, although this has always been supervised and would remain as such.
Sorry, that wasn't especially quick 
So... while I like to think of myself as reasonably intelligent (don't we all 
) I am having a hard time making sense of the directgov website's advice, as is DP. We looked at it separately and both reached completely different conclusions based on the same information. That is partly due to the interchanging of terms such as 'spouse' and 'partner' and their legal implications and partly because in some places, the advice contradicts itself. It also differs from the advice given by a friend who is currently going through a step-parent adoption herself tears hair out
Can anyone give me some advice on whether DP and I need to be married for an adoption to take place, if adoption is really that much different to just getting DP PR and what the XP's rights are in this?
One of the things we have been getting puddled over is whether XP would be notified/have to give permission. AFAIK for PR I can just tack DP on with XP being none the wiser (as I said above, XP doesn't have PR) whereas for adoption he needs to know and agree. Sadly he is the type who would object for the sake of it, and he could do so with LegalAid which we won't get (I am currently eligible but won't be after moving in with DP) so any ideas of how much XP could stick his oar in and how long he could drag the process out for would be gratefully received.
If he does object, I believe that the courts have to get someone to make an assessment of me, DP, DC, our house and income and also the same of XP, as well as speaking to us about why we want the adoption and to XP about why he wants to block it. I assume they would also speak to the DC as they are of an age to know their own mind to an extent. Does that sound about right from anyone's experience? Does anyone know what sort of reasons he could give for blocking the adoption that the courts would consider valid?
Obviously no advice from here, however awesome, is a replacement for actual solicitors advice but I wanted to avoid wasting my free half-hour LegalAid just on clearing up misunderstandings from the directgov site, then having to pay a small fortune in fees.
Any comments gratefully received and apologies if this is in the wrong section, I am but a n00b and this one looked about right. I'll gladly delete and repost elsewhere if there is a more suitable place for it.
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Legal matters
Adoption and an uncooperative XP. Possibly complex.
PiousPrat · 11/04/2011 00:22
Thank you for the replies. So speedy at this time of night!
TMOAD I will have been with my DP for 4 years next month. Despite not living together full time, we have been together alternate weekends and most of the school holidays during that time, either at my house or his. The intention has always been to move in together and would have happened about 2 years ago but his work field is very specialised so he can only work where he is, and I was at uni doing quite a specialised degree which I couldn't transfer as only a handful of places offer it and none near him. Backing out of living together won't be terribly simple either, since I am expecting his child so it is certainly something that will be worked at.
CJdamoo that sounds pretty similar to my circumstances then. Does your DH having PR give him much the same rights as adoption would? I am having to move schools for the DC since we are moving so far and he can't fill the forms in to get things started as he currently has no rights or responsibilities at all. That is the sort of thing we want to enable him to do. PR and deed poll are our back up plan if adoption isn't granted or would be too much trauma for the DCs.
Prh47bridge that is interesting to know. May I ask your source about needing to be married for PR? It isn't that I doubt you at all, it is just completely different to what I understood from the directgov site so if I have misunderstood that, I need to double check my understanding of everything else so it would be great to have another source to go to!
I am aware that 'we want to be togevver' doesn't qualify as a valid reason for the courts to approve an adoption, especially when the birth father has (albeit limited and infrequent) contact with the DCs. However I do believe that we have a good case for applying for adoption since (and again, this may just be my misunderstanding) that seems to not only grant my DP rights but also to remove them from my ex.
Without wanting to bore you with details, my ex was abusive to me in front of the DCs. DS2 has only just, after 7 years, overcome his phobia of having things touching his throat after seeing me be pinned against the wall, off the floor, by my throat when he was 2. He also stole from them to support his drug habit, has never had sole care of either of them, even for an afternoon when we lived together, because of his drink/drugs problem. He had Class As in the house when the children were there (not the fun party ones either). He absconded with DS2 one day after we had had an arguement over the phone, he drove into town, found me and snatched DS2 out of his buggy and drove off. He then hid when the police arrived at our house. Obviously this is all on record and is the main reason for XP only having supervised access in public places. XP has been threatening and abusive to me on a number of occasions since we left and quite regularly threatens to take me to court for access/residency/etc and makes these threats to the DCs to pass on to me, so they are aware of it all.
So, with all that in mind, I have been to the solicitors a number of times over the years and each time been told that he would never get so much as an access order, since the courts would see that I offer more than they would give and he doesn't keep up with even the minimum they could require of me and so not waste their time taking it to court. However, that hasn't stopped him trying and involving the DS's in his attempts. That is why I am keen to revoke his potential claim to future rights, so that he cannot continue to use them and upset the DCs. I am not proposing stopping contact, so long as the DC want to which has always been my condition. Another change recently is that they simply don't want to. I think after seeing with DP what a real Dad is like, they have realised that their own was sadly lacking and that they don't have an obligation to him to visit. It may just be that they are at a selfish stage as well though so obviously it is something we would continue to offer and talk over with them over time.
Sorry, that was really long again. I was trying to avoid putting too much detail in my initial post and boring people but seem to have done it here instead
KristinaM I think I may have to give up on the directgov site, as I gleaned from there that it is only 6 months before we can apply for PR, unless the 2 years is how long it takes for the entire process to reach completion?
I do agree with you all that there is a lot going on with us right now, new house, new school, new living arrangements and new sibling (well, 2 but one who they actually live with and see) and ordinarily I would agree that it would be best to just let it be for a while, however I think I am feeling a sense of urgency as my FIL (DP's Dad) recently died very unexpectedly and it has brought home to me how fragile and short life can be and also that if I were to die tomorrow, that there would be no one with a legal claim to my DC and even had I been living with DP for 3 years (for example) and they were settled with him and their new sibling, that if I die there is nothing stopping their birth father applying for custody of them. I am quite certain that it would be a cold day in Hell before they were given to him over the man who has been a father to them, and taken out of their home and area to be sent to a man who they barely know who has 4 other children to care for. However, given how fresh the memories are of helping to sort out my FIL's estate, I just don't want to add that level of stress and uncertainty to it. My FIL was a highly organised man and we could lay hands on every single piece of paper we would need within minutes of wanting them and it was a straightforward case, but it was still a lot to do and I don't want to lumber my DP with that, the sole care of 3 mother-less children & a potential court case as well.
I realise that is incredibly morbid though 
Again, thank you for your replies, especially at this late hour, and apologies for rambling. Is this the right place for this thread btw? I have since found the Adoption sub-forum and don't know if there would be more appropriate?
PRH Sorry I wasn't doubting you at all, rather my own ability to interpret the directgov site! The main page on PR doesn't mention step-parents at all and another page I found after much digging said that it could be granted to Grandparents as well and implied that up to 6 people could have PR of the same child. I think my confusion has arisen because in some places the site uses 'civil partner' and in others it uses 'partner' and since they are considered legal term, I assumed they were being used in the correct context rather than interchangable to mean same sex spouse. You sound very confident in your opinion though so I will defer to your knowledge and abandon the directgov website as it makes my head hurt Thank you.
Kristina I do have solicitors letters offering him contact (every other weekend) and subsequent ones stating since he hasn't been in contact for 2 years, that this offer will be dropped to once a month until consistent contact is reestablished, then the reply to that one demanding residential access for 2 weeks and a few more following a similar pattern, as well as a log of all contact and it's outcome (I have logged bloody everything I think!) so hopefully that would go some way to establishing contact history and XP's character but I guess that may not be enough.
wasthatthatguy I wish I had a few grand to spare! Don't we all
Thank you all. I really do appreciate your replies and I am sorry if I have come across as moany. I guess I have just gotten myself a bit righteously indignant that XP can block adoption when I genuinely feel it would form more stability for my DC and allow them a decent shot at a more settled family life, especially since he is sadly uninterested in the actual DC themselves and more in using them as a pawn to have a pop at me or make life harder 'because he can' and I had this nice little picture in my head of me, DC and DP walking out of the family court as a proper, official family unit and it was such a sweet picture I am having a hard time letting it go.
By the sounds of it though, applying for PR for DP then changing names through deed polls seems to be the best way to go. I am just sad that there seems to be no way of preventing XP from deciding on a whim that he wants to threaten court action whenever he feels like it as this has a negative impact on the DC and makes them feel insecure. I can understand why the law is as it is, to protect the family unit and to ensure children have a right to contact with their fathers except in extreme circumstances where that contact would pose a risk of harm to them, but it seems a shame that in doing so, it also enshrines the rights of lazy buggers who don't want to do any actual parenting, but don't want to give up bragging rights on the kids either.
So to recap from what is on the form, we will have to marry but XP doesn't have to be notified or give permission, since he doesn't have PR and I can change the DC's names at any point?
If it is going to be an uphill battle with no guarantee of success for adoption, I think that may be our best bet then. I suspect we will wait to change their names until after the (lowest low key ever!) wedding as we are being awkward and double barreling our names (both the end of the line name wise and both of us want to carry it on, plus his surname doesn't 'go' with our names without mine in between as a buffer) and it may be easier to change them to what will then be my legal name, rather than change them from XP's name to Myname-DP's name. Does it take long to do a name change by deed poll? It would be handy to have it done before they start their new schools so we don't have to start them under one name then change it a month later, but we are a bit time limited on fitting in a wedding, between school finishing here and being able to move there, giving notice of intent to marry and giving birth, then them starting the new schools.
Bloody inconsiderate timing of the baby to decide to arrive
Thank you ever so much for your help, I think I have a clearer picture of how to progress now :o
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