hunting is illegal so why do it?

(320 Posts)
VicarInaTutuDrankSantasSherry Mon 17-Dec-12 22:26:22

i ride. (well, ive just started but....)
i abhor hunting. hate hate hate the cruelty of it. i think that the RSPCA did the right thing here in this prosecution. why do people of a certain class believe they are above the law?

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/david-camerons-local-hunt-fined-26300-for-illegal-fox-hunting-8422915.html

and we spend money (rightly imo) doing this www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-20739585

mad world. why do people feel the need to kill animals in the most inhunane ways possible?

Alameda Thu 20-Dec-12 12:11:42

it's very difficult to kill a fox quickly and cleanly though, shooting usually = very slow very painful death from wounds

although have never found the vermin control justifications all that convincing, hunting is just fun isn't it and most hunt activities probably fall within the stupid law anyway

£300k is a lot of money, many suffering animals could have been helped with that, shocking waste of money. Withdrew my support from the RSPCA years ago when they stood idly by during the foot and mouth crisis

DialsMavis Thu 20-Dec-12 13:44:53

Why does it matter if Vicar is veggie? There is a huge difference between eating meat and killing animals for pleasure, or even making other animals kill animals for pleasure.

Hunting with dogs is more akin with badger baiting, dog fighting or cock fighting than with buying and consuming meat

littleducks Thu 20-Dec-12 13:54:07

The RSPCA spent £300,000 on legal fees shock I won't be donating a penny to them ever again, whatever the rights and wrongs that is redicolous, even the judge deemed it unnecessary!

Electricblanket Thu 20-Dec-12 16:50:16

Jellykat, I am sorry your local hunt were so vile! We have always had a very good relationship with our local hunt.

There was an understanding with All of the local farmers including those who didn't agree with hunting and the hunt totally respected that. I live in a very small community however, so maybe it comes down to a level respect between us all that was so obviously failing in your community. That is such a shame. I would hate to live in a community like that.

Unfortunatly the only issue now is those who hunt with guns or taken matters into their hands.

dapplegrey Thu 20-Dec-12 17:36:21

Vicar hasn't yet answered my question as to whether she eats fish. She says she is opposed to fishing so presumably she wouldn't want to eat anything that has been caught on a line or in a net.

Ponyofdoom Thu 20-Dec-12 18:09:36

Pandawatch your comments about hunters being psychopaths with bloodlust are so utterly immature and ridiculous even you must realise that in your heart. I hunt because I love watching hounds work and track the quarry and having a thrilling unpredictable ride across fields, hedges and fences. As a farmer, I feel that this is the best, most certain way to kill a pest- it is either killed very quickly or escapes unharmed. This is often not possible with shooting as the fox is largely nocturnal and skulks in hedges etc. I do also shoot and so have no axe to grind. As a meat eater, I have seen the sharp end of both practices and IMHO hunting is FAR easier to justify morally than meat eating. My cousin is a vegan who hunts. At least we hunters have taken responsibility for killing a fox, have risked our own limbs in the chase and have respect for the quarry, which I am not sure meat eaters do when buying packaged meat from the supermarket. The comment about putting down hounds is also stupid, why would hunts put down fit hounds? They are kept until they are too unsound to hunt, which is arguably better than people keeping dogs into a doddery, incontinent old age. Large hounds have a relatively short lifespan anyway and are a kennels kept pack animal so wouldn't be happy with/suitable for re-homing. Hunting horses often go on into their 20s. My current hunter only retired at 19/20 due to melanoma.

OpheliasWeepingWillow Thu 20-Dec-12 18:21:38

Battery farming chickens is vile so why do it... but it's legal.

Honesty if as much money had been plugged into animal welfare as spent on the hysterical campaign against fox hunting animals across Britain would be much happier as I type.

And I'm not in favour of hunting before you ask.

Ridiculous.

VicarInaTutuDrankSantasSherry Thu 20-Dec-12 18:27:44

no i dont eat fish.

i eat organic free range meat which gets shipped up from Devon. Its expensive and so i dont eat much meat, but would rather buy this than supermarket or factory farmed meat.

i believe hunting with dogs is cruel. I see no justification for hunting with dogs, badger baiting, cock fighting, or dog fighting which i believe are all inhumane and all illegal. Why should these illegal activities be ignored? More prosecutions should be brought, a colleague recently arrested several men for badger baiting. I am employed to prosecute people who break the law. I dont think people can pick and choose based on what they want to do, or feel is their right.

pointysettia Thu 20-Dec-12 18:33:31

I'd like an answer from the pro-hunting with dogs brigade re the effectiveness of hunting foxes with hounds.

If it's so great, why doesn't everyone in Europe do it this way?

Ponyofdoom Thu 20-Dec-12 18:36:23

Pointy there is a lot of hunting in Europe. France and Ireland for example are riddled with packs of hounds.

OpheliasWeepingWillow Thu 20-Dec-12 18:36:52

This reminds me of the fur debate. What makes mink so special? Why is it more vile to kill mink than a chicken?

Hunting with dogs = nasty, unnecessary and horrible BUT I wish people would direct their energies toward meaningful change on a larger and more pragmatic scale. HFW for example.

OP you just come across as a bit belligerent and narrow TBH

ArielTheBahHumbugMermaid Thu 20-Dec-12 18:42:01

I hate the assumption that those in the countryside are for hunting and resent the hunting ban as interfering townies messing with things they don't understand. I have lived in farming and hunting country my whole life and I will never agree with hunting. Never never never never.

Of course you can be against hunting and eat meat. There is a world of difference between pursuing a wild fox/stag/badger to its violent death, and eating livestock which has been bred for its meat.

Ponyofdoom Thu 20-Dec-12 18:43:03

Vicar, you think hunting is cruel- but compared to WHAT? Shooting? Snaring? Gangrene from being hit by a car? I have seen a number of kills by hounds and they have all been split-second affairs. I would far rather go that way if I were a fox than the other methods, trust me. I think you are much crueller when you eat meat than I am when I ride to hounds. I would rather obey my moral judgement than the law and take the consequences. I have always been and remain prepared to go to prison for hunting. As a fox hunter, I am a member of a cultural minority and will defend my culture to the last.

GhostShip Thu 20-Dec-12 18:44:09

Ophelia - I think it's more the point that we need food to eat, we do not need to wear animal skins to survive.

In this day and age we don't really need to eat meat, but I accept that the transition to veggie can be difficult and expensive for some.

Ponyofdoom Thu 20-Dec-12 18:46:07

Ariel the fox is an amoral predator which has a very good chance of escape and feels little if any fear (from my observations) until the kill which is very quick. Your dinner is a gentle herbivore with no chance of escape which dies a stressful death trapped in a slaughterhouse. I have seen both and can assure you that meat eating is worse.

GhostShip Thu 20-Dec-12 18:46:26

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

GhostShip Thu 20-Dec-12 18:47:31

Oh I laugh at the 'its very quick'.

The fox is chased until exhaustion, then ripped apart by dogs.

Would you like a fate like that?

Ponyofdoom Thu 20-Dec-12 18:48:05

There are antis in the countryside, but very few. Hunting would cease tomorrow were it not for the fact that over 90% of farmers are supportive of hound sports

GhostShip Thu 20-Dec-12 18:49:10

and 'amoral predator'? What does you expect, a wild animal to have morals confused

Ponyofdoom Thu 20-Dec-12 18:50:08

Ghost how many hunts have you watched? I have seen countless hunts. The fox is in his natural habitat, free and confident of escape. They can be more than a mile ahead of the pack for most of the time and will stop to scratch, sniff or wee, they are not distressed until possibly the last few seconds. I would much prefer this fate to the other methods and the dreadful way most people die TBH

Ponyofdoom Thu 20-Dec-12 18:50:45

I don't expect it to have morals, I am stating a fact!!

Xenia Thu 20-Dec-12 18:51:13

Mumsnet campaign to reform the law to allow keeping of animals for fur? I have never understood the new-ish ban. What is the difference between keeping rabbits for meat and using the fur compared with keeping an animal solely for fur?

ArielTheBahHumbugMermaid Thu 20-Dec-12 18:51:46

Of course a fox is amoral. It's a fucking animal. How many animals have morals? We're supposed to have morals though. And how the fuck do you know I eat meat?

Ponyofdoom Thu 20-Dec-12 18:53:08

Oh cheers for the vile comment Ghost I think you must be losing the debate to play the insult card. Yes hunting is the most amazing sport which has given me the best days of my life and I am very proud and lucky to hunt

GhostShip Thu 20-Dec-12 18:53:58

You stated it as part of your point, it is irrelevant and stupid to point out that a wild animal is 'amoral' confused

Ah here we go, I have to have been to a hunt to be able to comment. Fact is, I have many friends who are in similar circles to yours who once thought this okay but have now opened their eyes.

If you want to do it, do it. But don't try and condone it by saying its part of our culture. It is wrong, immoral and barbaric. No words you use to say otherwise will wash with anyone with any sense.

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