How to help DS1 with maths when......

[CardyMow]

His abilities far outstrip my own? . He is in a state primary, and though they do 'differentiate' the work for him, it's not by nearly enough. He has just started Y4, he is 8 and a half. The school are giving him Y5 worksheets, which are too simple for him. I have managed to teach him about squares, and square roots, and long multiplication and division, but he is writing his own algebra sums, doing them, and asking me to mark them.

This might be a good time to point out that I am absolutely POO at maths, it was always a subject I found very difficult, I was always in bottom sets, and failed my GCSE. I cannot do fractions or times tables properly. He is better at maths than I am, and I don't know what to do to help him to stop getting bored with the maths in school, and keep his fire (and ability for it) going.

He is on the G&T register at the school, but that only seems to mean that they give them the work for the year above. He is messing about in class because when he finishes his work in 5 minutes, he is told to just sit quietly. . For a further 45-55 minutes. And is getting into trouble for this.

He had his IQ tested (by the school) last year when he started Y3, and got a 'raw' intelligence score of 132. He was 7.5yo. He is also G&T in English, science and Spanish.

Does anyone have any ideas on how I can hel him when he is better at maths than me? I can't afford tutors etc due to low income.

[rabbitstew]

My mum was the same... terrified of maths! She even attended adult learning courses to help her understand the maths we were being taught. Fortunately, my dad was good at maths!

Any chance he could teach himself if you buy him a workbook?! Hopefully they'd have the answers in the back!!!!!

[CardyMow]

Haha to getting anything out of DS1's school, they kicked up enough of a fuss when I insisted they differentiated his work in maths to stop him from messing about....Even dc on SA+ find it hard enough to get IEP's, let alone the G&T dc. Plus I have no option of changing schools, due to DS2's year being FULL at every school in a 30 mile radius, and can't have DS1 at a different school when I don't (can't, medical reasons) drive.

He has finished the Y7 and 8 books that I bought for him to do at home (text book things from Smiths..that have answers with them for me ). But should I get him the Y9 one, when if he asks for help explaining the concepts...I might not be able to??

[Milliways]

Have you tried the 10 ticks site?

They have some games here
Disclaimer: I last used this site some years ago so may not be any good now....

[CardyMow]

I'm not terrified of maths, just..err...not very good at it! I try with maths, but college for me is not an option, again, not enough money around.

[rabbitstew]

Do you have any trusted, helpful friends who are good at maths?...

[CardyMow]

Err..NO! . I am trying my best, and if he was learning French, I could really help him, and he is quite able to work on Y9 chemistry at home with me...But I was very good at those subjects. It's just me, as my DP is worse at maths than me.

[rabbitstew]

Oh dear! Could you persuade him he wants to learn French instead?...

[Kammy]

Has he got Murderous Maths books? They explain the concepts quite well (I think, but I'm sort of in the same position as you, not being particularly good at maths).

Could also look at the nrich website for games?

[snorkie]

He will have to learn to work independently I think (no bad thing). You need good maths books that have the answers in. I second the murderous maths suggestions, but they're more for reading around maths than full of problems, if that's what he wants. You could try him on those logic puzzle books or sodukus for a change maybe? I wouldn't worry too much about what he's doing at school, if he reads around the subject and keeps his interest going it won't matter that he isn't forging ahead. And do encourage him with French - that would be a really excellent skill to side-track him with instead.

[mathanxiety]

Can the school supply more challenging material for him?

[CardyMow]

Oh he does sudokus a lot, and logic problems puzzles. Isn't doing French at home with me going to be counter-productive when he is learning Spanish at school?

He does prefer 'doing' maths problems more than just reading about it, he tends to learn through doing IYSWIM.

Where would I get the murderous maths books from?

[rabbitstew]

I don't see what's wrong with learning French at home, just because he's learning another language at school?

[mathanxiety]

You can never overdo languages, LL. French at home would be the perfect complement to Spanish at school, and a really good brain stretcher. It would also show him that while you may be behind him in Maths, you know a thing or two that he doesn't.

[Kammy]

You should get them at any good bookshop, childrens section, often near 'Horrible Histories'. There's a whole set, but as snorkie says, they are much more reading for pleasure than lots of puzzles. But ds loves them and it might help to explain concepts to your ds.

[colditz]

Expecting an 8 year old to sit quietly for 45 minutes because the work you are repeatedly setting them is too easy is not meeting their educational needs. he needs an IEP.

[snorkie]

ds used to get them out from the library, until I relented and bought the whole set (they sometimes do cheap deals at eg the book people).

If the school will differentiate properly then great, my experience is like that of the OP
that if they do differentiate they tend to still not give work that really challenges the child. He shouldn't be being told to just sit quietly though - they should provide something and preferably something meaningful, but with maths it's better in some ways not to get ahead as you then perpetuate the problem. Going sideways is better if you can manage it.

French alongside Spanish is a prime example of going sideways! For a bright child 2 languages should be fine and they are both romance languages so should compliment each other to a degree.

[CardyMow]

Colditz...I can't even get the SenCo to meet with me to draw up an IEP for DS2 who has SN and massive problems with writing, she just won't make an appointment with me. How on Earth am I meant to get her to meet with me for a dc that will quite happily make lvl5 at the end of Y6 SATS (considering he is working lvl5+ NOW at the start of Y4). The school does nothing unless you are 'only' on course to get lvl 4 at the end of Y6, if you are below/above that...it's basically get on with it. (And let the parents do the rest)

[colditz]

I barged into our SENCO's office the pother day (after asking at reception if she was busy) and sat myself down, explaining that I wished to talk about Ds1's statement.

She looked absolutely horrified, but, you see, I was smiling.

[Timbachick]

Murderous Maths available through Amazon.

Can you get some Bond papers (available from Amazon/WHSmiths). They do maths papers, 10 minute test papers etc and are pitched at different ages (7-8, 9-10, 11+, 13+ etc). If you decide to get these do go to Amazon as they are nearly a third of the price you pay at WHS.

You can also got to www.elevenplusexams.co.uk - they have a selection of downloadable worksheets that may be useful.

Your DH sounds marvellous. Keep challenging him with Bond papers, and worksheets. If his school is much like my DS's then don't hold your breath for assistance. I repeatedly asked for help in proving challenging work for my DS who was becoming bored with work that was just too easy for him. Each and every time I asked I was met with a brick wall. Rely upon yourself if you get no joy from them. Many schools now appear to have little interest in gifted children - they teach to test and only want to get them to the level they government say they should get our kids to. Greater effort seems to be made to help those lagging behind (as it should be) but little effort seems to be made for those already ahead of the game.

A company called Galore provides workbooks preparing children for 11+ and 13+ examinations - they have an extensive range of books you can buy as well - maybe you want to have a look there?

Good luck.

[mathanxiety]

Links to some US sites (but maths is international) here for students who can work on their own. Some have forums (fora?).

[AlgebraKnocksItUpANotchBAM]

you could get him to teach you?

any way you can get on a free maths GCSE course? some places (FE colleges etc) offer it for low incomes. my DH may do it at some point (and English too)

[AlgebraKnocksItUpANotchBAM]

also if he likes logic puzzles, WHS do a really good puzzle magazine called Beyond Sudoku which may be worth a look.

[minimathsmouse]

Hi Loudlass, We have just taken DS1 out of a school for the same reason. Working beyond Lvl 5, school not offering challenging work. I got the same impression about end of year 6 sats, no interest given to children who will coast a level 5 and those who will never make lvl 4!

We tried for a year and eventually gave up. No IEP, no extra help, found that my son was being used as a TA to help less able DCs and the teacher was terrified of DH and I, not to mention that where she set harder work, she would not mark it in front of DS or give extra work when he had finished. Conclusion her maths may have been weaker than DS's.

We are Home educating now for two years, I teach maths at KS1-2 but DS is on a IGCSE course.His maths is better than mine, he picks things up quicker, ticks over quicker and is more intuative than me We are also using conquer maths on the net, which is fab. It gives a short tutorial, worksheet, explanation/revision sheet, marks their work when they input the answers and gives you regular reports on their progress.Its so easy to follow that you could watch the tutorial with your DS and then help. It covers KS3-GCSE and there are 100's of lessons.

[CardyMow]

HE not a possibility atm, have 3dc's at school, 2 of whom could do with HE for different reasons (DS1 for advancement, DS2 for help with his writing), but I'm 25 weeks pregnant, and it's just not feasible. Plus how am I meant to teach him maths when I can't do it? Plus on our (very limited) income, there would be NO scope for money for groups to socialise, not even free ones, as we cannot afford transport. In so many ways, HE is not possible for me, but it IS something I have given serious thought to in the past. And discounted. I overstretch to buy him books to work on at home as it is!