ABRSM grade 5 theory - need to help dd get up to speed

[maggiethecat]

DD1 is preparing for grade 4 violin after taking a break from the exam track. It's always been in the back of my mind to be letting her do some early grade theory stuff just so that she can get the feel of it (no time in lesson really to do any).

Grade 5 violin will probably be upon us in a blink so I'm thinking about getting her prepped for grade 5 theory (would rather keep going with ABRSM than switch to Trinity).

Would it make sense to get some of the earlier grade exam papers and answer sheets and let her have a bash at those to see how she gets on? Theory teacher? (although I can't bear the thought of having to schlepp to something else.

Anything else to help her along without applying too much pressure? [should add that although she plays well and is well developed aurally, her head is a bit in the clouds with music theory]

[gettingalifenow]

There are guides to music theory which might help - workbooks by Eric Taylor. We have a really thick book which seems to cover everything and then individual books for different grades (browse the Chamberlain website - ABRSM stockist).

I'm not sure my DCs would have made it without tuition tbh, but their schools offered it as an option (one of them switched to Trinity for just that reason!)

[pianomama]

We are having theory lessons separately since September (just booked the exam in Summer)
I found not many music teachers actually want to do theory , took a while to find one.
Unless you know it really well yourself at that level it would definitely be better to have a tutor.
You are right to start now - DS is completely ready for his next instrumental exam but you need to have G5 theory certificate when you apply so he will have to do it in November now. I didn't think it would take him whole year to go through all the material.. And all that extra money to find :( .

[MrsSquirrel]

My dd is going through the workbooks Music Theory in Practice. Her teacher is suggesting she do the grade 4 theory exam first, so she knows what to expect. So far dd and teacher are happy with this.

[RaspberryLemonPavlova]

Have no experience yet myself, but have been looking into it also. I have seen advice that suggests working throught the TG theory books until Grade 4, then switching to ABRSM. They seem to be considered better books.

[maggiethecat]

thanks for all this, will have a look at the suggestions. can't say I'm looking forward to it as she confounds me when she comes out with stuff like 'what's a minim again?'

[Teladi]

Music Theory in Practice and also the companion book The AB Guide to Music Theory - boring but do the job. The AB Guide to Music Theory comes in handy if they do Music later on at school for Higher/A Level.

[maggiethecat]

Ok, we've have the AB guide which I have found useful for myself to figure out some of what she's been doing in practice; will look at MT in practice.

Pianomama, I'm going to try be disciplined about this - probably a few days a week doing about 15 mins a day just to see if we can save on the expense and hassle of having to go to tutor for too long. How old is your ds? I'm wondering if it will be quite uphill for dd who is 8.

[maggiethecat]

Had a look at MT in practice and think that if I were to get all 5 books plus model answers that adds up to a tidy sum. Did you get the model answers Teladi?

[maggiethecat]

Sorry to bang on but I wonder if the questions in the graded sight reading books are similar to the questions in the theory books? Perhaps I could skip out the first few theory books if I worked on those sight reading book questions.

[pianomama]

My Ds is 10 , he had G5 and G4 in his 2 instruments already before starting on theory so we started working from G3 theory.
You have enough time with 8 y.o. , very good idea to start at 15 mins and go through all the basic staff without engaging a tutor. As long as this is systematic it should work well. Use bribes if you have to :).
Out of curiosity - does she play mostly by ear? Is she good at sight-reading?
Normally someone doing G4 should know what minim is - I would bring it up with her violin teacher. Of cause , all children are different and learn in different ways. My Ds is quite techie about his music and actually he does like theory.
I wouldn't get all the books straight away - just G1 + model answers are very useful.

[pianomama]

PS I would do a bit of both , you should try at least one sight reading exercise during normal practice. It builds up very quickly, again should be done systematically though. Somebody told me there is a very good sight-reading app for iPad (unfortunately we don't have one so not sure what it is called exactly). There is also a method where you cover up the music with another book just leaving the first bar and move it a bar at a time as she plays it.Very effective.

[maggiethecat]

Thanks pianomama. Need to work on systematic practice generally. We're good with pieces and scales, not so consistent with sight-reading but will ramp that up.
She's good by ear but sight reads ok. She knows what a minim is to play it but to describe it as 2 beats was perhaps beyond her power of articulation on that particular day

Have an iphone and wonder if the sight reading app works with it?

We used to do the thing of me covering the bars but not sure if I was doing it effectively - need to revisit - oh joy!

When does it get to the stage where you just leave them to get on with it???

[maggiethecat]

She had a laugh at me today. After she had played a piece I said something along the lines of 'we need to do that again' and looking at me incredulously she said 'we???'

Talk about vicarious violin playing!

[TheAvocado]

I recommend a residential summer camp for G5 theory in a week:

www.gamweb.co.uk/pages/BHCoursesDetails.asp#g5tc

gets it out of the way, you don't have the stress of getting her through it, and she'll have a great time.

There are probably other ones, but this is where DS has music lessons and it's fab.

[TheAvocado]

sorry, link didn't work:

www.gamweb.co.uk/pages/BHCoursesDetails.asp#g5tc

[maggiethecat]

It does look fab. Would need to time this closer to when she would be doing the exam which probably will not be within the year.

In the meantime I will get on with some of the books.

[pianomama]

" When does it get to the stage where you just leave them to get on with it???" - depends on the child , some can do it as early as 45 :0

[Theas18]

My kids worked through the books with their piano teacher. She's methodical and exam orientated.

However, whilst theory IS important it shouldn't hold up the progress (and more to the point fun!) they have from playing.

Remember they don't "have " to take all the grades. If she whizzes past grade 6 whilst catching up the theory side she can just go straight in at 7.

also TRinity grades don't need theory grade 5 at all - DS did grade 6 horn trinity whilst working up his theory- mainly because he's a boy that works harder with a target..... Trinity exams are really much the same in content and standard as AB now- when I was a kid they were a soft option.

[Theas18]

re the sight reading- does she play in any orchestras/groups? THat absolutely got the sight reading going for my kids.

[maggiethecat]

good point about theory not holding up progress, will remember that.

she plays in school orchestra but think music that they play is fairly basic at the moment.

[mistlethrush]

I played my way through G&S violin/piano adaptions with my mother playing the piano. Improves the sightreading no end. luckily my grandfather played so I had all of that music and could get appropriate levels.

Re theory - I only ever did one exam (grade5) and I did that purely by working my way through the grade books with my piano teacher - normally at most 5mins per lesson.

[lingle]

sounds like something that could kill off the joy don't you think?

ABRSM must think so too because they now allow you to do their Grade 5 "Practical Musicianship" exam instead of their Grade 5 theory.

It's like music theory but without the vocabulary. You show you can do it rather than talking about it.

It seems a bit more human.

I am attempting to "teach" music theory by stealth as part of musicianship. My kids accompany a tonic/dominant tune on the dominant, then they make it "land" on the tonic on the last note, then you draw a circle of notes, they do it in a different key and hopefully the penny drops that whatever key you start in you drop down a fifth to "land".
Whether or not this will work I do not know!

[roisin]

Ds2 started working through Trinity theory books gr1-4 He did the work, I marked it. He never needed any explanations. His teacher marked the exam paper at the end of each book.Then switched and did the AB gr5 workbook. Had 3 composition lessons with his teacher, then did practice papers.

From start to finish it took 14 months, though he could have done it faster.

Ended up with a distinction :-)

It's obviously easier the more musical experience you have.

[Prosemusic]

//www.learngrade5theory.com teaches #ABRSM Grade 5 Theory at the piano so students can see it, hear it and play it. When students learn in these 3 ways, they can understand it and connect it to their own music. My ABRSM Grade 5 Theory students to date achieve 80% distinctions and 20% merits.

//www.learngrade5theory.com