Trying to get into C of E school hypocritical? We're Protestant!

[Giuliettatoday]

Hi there,

I've read through several threads on church schools but somehow can't decide what to do.

We're not Anglican, as that church (obviously) doesn't exist in our home country, but Protestant.

My two eldest children are in a non-faith school as we never just wanted to go to church for the "wrong" reasons, also, by the time we had moved to this area they'd been more than full with waiting lists on top, so even if we'd started going to church we wouldn't have got them in anyway, as they needed year 1 and nursery places straight away.

(I now find their school ok, it's really not at all bad, but it's not great either. If I'd had the choice, I would've sent them to the C of E school.)

We did however occasionally attend services at a Protestant church (from our country, so services are in our language and feel like at home!) were we feel we "belong" to and not at all out of place like we feel in some Anglican churches (we've attended them also occasionally, not for getting a school place).

So we are definitely Christian but just not overly eager church goers, like so many other people as well (esp. where we come from).

Now we would really like to send our third child to the C of E school (five minutes away) and yes, I openly admit that the reason is that it is just better in the league tables, ofsted reports and also heard parents with children in that school saying that it's a very nice school and they're very happy with it.

It's just better than the school of our older children (which is not bad either, just not as good as the C of E school).

And this is were the dilemma starts. You stand absolutely no chance at all if you don't attend one of two particular churches in the year before application at least 6 times (yes, it really says 6 times in the prospectus!).

So visiting "our" Protestant church does not help at all. We'd really have to turn up at one of those particular Anglican churches to stand any chance to get a place. But even then I'm not too sure if it counts, when they see the baptism certificate of our son is Protestant. Someone mentioned in another thread that the governors spot these things immediately but in that case it was a Catholic person suddenly going to an Anglican church, surely there's more difference than between being Protestant and Anglican?

Distance applies only if there still places available after those based on church attendance and siblings (which also doesn't apply for us) have been allocated. And after that there are usually no places left at all, they even have siblings on the waiting list sometimes!!

So I don't know what to do now. Also, if we put the C of E school as a first preference and then don't get in for some reason (Protestant baptism certificate, or maybe other parents are long standing members of the church and we've only visited 6 times, or too many siblings...) we might not even get our son into our second choice school (where our two eldest are) as by then it might be full already.

Arrrgh. The safest bet would be just sending him to the school of our two eldest, but I can already hear my in-laws complain why we don't "just" go to church to get him into that church school which I also prefer, but I hate being a hypocrite.

For me it's not "just" turning up there, you have to really pretend you come not just for a school place however obvious it is. You have to meet and greet the vicar and make a "voluntary" donation to the church, haha (haven't found out how much yet). Don't get me wrong, but I'm normally rather open and would love to tell them, come on, I attend six times, pay a specified sum, and then give me the letter, but no, everyone plays that silly game which I hate, it's just not "me"!

And many many parents do it exactly like that, the churches here are apparently quite empty after the school letters have been given out. So why do I shy away if everyone else does exactly that. (Ok not everyone, many are probably genuinely religious and love going to church every Sunday with three boisterous young children in tow, so please don't be offended if you are/do - but I'm always wondering why those church schools that are not as good in the league tables are never full, surely there must be many religious parents who choose the school for the faith, not for their league table position?).

Probably as C of E is not officially my faith, but then Protestant schools don't even exist here, so even if I wanted to, I couldn't send my child to one.

Would love to hear your thoughts.

[Marina]

Have you discussed this with the priest at your Protestant Church? Is it a church which, in your home country, is considered "in communion with the Church of England", or I wonder if what you mean by Protestant is more of a Dissenting/Evangelical church?
I just wonder if your priest might know the priest at the C of E church. We are C of E and our parish priest has gone out of her way to welcome a Sri Lankan Christian church which has set up locally, and establish contact with them.
I don't know what the answer is to your dilemma - but you know you are right about the hypocrisy of attending purely for a coveted school place. It happens a lot in England. As a regular worshipper, I always try and think of the hypocrisy as all the parents', and that the children might be enjoying/deriving some benefit from their church attendance.
I am surprised that the school you are keen on has no criterion for admitting regular worshippers from other Christian churches somewhere in its pecking order. Most Church of England Schools do. EG our local one would consider us third after siblings and regular worshippers at one named church, because we are at another local church.

[marialuisa]

The C of E is a Protestant church. Have you contacted the School and asked how many applicants from other Christian denominations are normally offered places?

[marialuisa]

The C of E is a Protestant church. Have you contacted the School and asked how many applicants from other Christian denominations are normally offered places?

[marialuisa]

The C of E is a Protestant church. Have you contacted the School and asked how many applicants from other Christian denominations are normally offered places?

[frogs]

I thought the C of E was protestant?

[confused Catholic emoticon]

[Marina]

I do wonder what Giulietta means by "Protestant" - maybe this is a language difference thing?

[Bozza]

Yes CofE is protestant. Also if your DS is not allowed a place because he was baptised in your denomination when you were living in a country which did not have CofE that is discrimination.

[Giuliettatoday]

Marina,

I'm German and the largest proportion of people is either Protestant (Lutheran) or Catholic, so it's definitely one of the main Christian churches there.

The thing is, the German Protestant church is not local enough to be considered as one of the other "local" churches - also, as the school is so oversubscribed they probably don't even have to take people attending other Anglican churches around here, as it will be full anyway once places have been given to those attending the two specified churches.

Marialuisa, that's an idea, I'll do that, but obviously it changes every year. I only phoned them once straight after we'd moved here and they wouldn't even send me a prospectus saying they'd siblings on the waiting list, but that was after the official closing dates as we moved here too late. So this time the case may be different as we're well within the official application deadlines next year for our youngest.

[Marina]

Oh if it is German Lutheran Giulietta I think you need to contact that school now (with or without your pastor's intervention) because they MUST have provision for people in your situation. The two C of E schools in London that I know would both place your application third after worship at named C of E church, and then siblings.

[Giuliettatoday]

I also always thought that Anglican was in a way similar to Protestant/Lutheran, but it's not exactly the same, of course there is no Anglican Church in Germany - remember the Queen is the Head of the Church of England.

But maybe it's not that hypocritical after all if I do attend their services? I've already done it anyway occasionally, as mentioned before.

I think I have some serious googling to do to find out more on that subject.

[Marina]

I can hardly think any respectable C of E priest can be rude about Lutherans given where we got most of our theology from during the Reformation...I would say your church has to be one of the closest to the C of E in Christendom to be honest, surely?

[Ladymuck]

You need to check the details of the admission criteria. Our local (over subscribed) CofE look at siblings, regular memebrs of 4 local CofE parishes and then members of any churches affiliated to the Britsh Council of Churches (a alrge and diverse band!). IME each CofE school have individual criteria, so please ask. I also find that well-established school secretaries are very useful for getting inside information (eg based on your current info what are your chances (they'll have an idea of siblings), what if you did move church). I found that when I mentioned I attended church (albeit not a CofE one) they were very happy to help.

[fatfox]

I thought "prods" were CofE too? (another very confused catholic)

[Uwila]

Oh, the poor cofused Catholics. But they are right. The Church of England is Anglican (as is the Episcopal church), and Anglican is a Ptotestant religeon. So is Lutheran. And many more...

But, Ladyluck is right, what you need is to find out the admissions criteria. For example, they might not look at the baptism but rather your attendance at the church. Once youget the admissions criteria then you can decide if you are willing to jump through those hoops.