Short Luteal Phase - any one else???

[hippychick66]

I had the coil out 3 months ago and have had 4 cycles since. Although I ovulate on or around day 14 I seem to be having short cycles (22 -24 days). I've discovered this is called LPD. My GP has given me a progesterone gel to put up after ovulation just for a few days. This is meant to help the lining of my womb prepare for the embryo (it's used in IVF apparently).

GP's not sure if the short LP is cos I've just had the coil out and cycles not settled down yet or cos of my age (43).

Never had this problem in my younger days .

2 healthy pregs with my wonderful DS's.

Anyone else in the same boat??????

ps. I do have endometriosis as well - not sure if connected in any way.

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

LPD is controversial - some gynaes think it is a problem whilst others do not.

I would actually be looking to seek a referral asap to a gynae at a subfertility unit in your circumstances and this is also because of your age.

You need to firmly establish what your egg quality is like now. This can be tested for and you should be having bloodwork done regularly to see what your hormone levels are like. At 43 your chances of conceiving again readily are not as high as in previous years.

Also your man should be tested at the same time as your tests are being done to rule out any male factor problems.

Endometriosis is a separate issues from LPD and the two are not connected. Have you had previous treatment for the endo, it may be that this will have to be looked at again.

[neenz]

Atilla, What is considered a short luteal phase?

Mine is usually 10 days (in a 28-32 day cycle ie different every month).

I have been taking my temps so I know it is 10 days, although this month it seemed to be longer but then my temps weren't clear so not sure when I OV'd (if at all).

I needed Clomid to conceive my twins because I wasn't having periods at all after a miscarriage. I got pg natually then and MC'd at 10 weeks.

I have definitely been having sex the right time of the month but have not conceived - could the LP be a problem?

[WorrisomeHeart]

Hope you don't mind me lurking here - will be v interested to see responses. We've been trying for 5 months (not long in the grand scheme of things, I know) and I've been temping which has shown me that in a 27-28 day cycle I tend to ov around day 16-18, which means my LP is at best 11 days. Are there any remedies that can be taken to lengthen this, or is it a clinical issue only?

[fifitot]

In Taking Control of Your Fertility (my bible!)Toni Weschler says that a short LP is less than 10 days but 10 days itself can be rather short. Embryo needs time to implant.

Apparently acupuncture can help lengthen a short LP. I conceived with a LP of 10 days.

[MidgeMungoAndMary]

I've conceived readily (6 times altogether but nos. 3/4/5 ended in mc) with a LP of no more than 10days so it is certainly possible, providing that everything else is in order too (lining of uterus, etc).

[hippychick66]

Midge sorry to hear about your MC's. How awful for you. Can I ask you - did the docs think that the short LP contribute to the MC's or was that a separate issue?????

I only ask because LPD is linked with early MC because the womb lining can't sustain the preg.

neenz some websites say anything under 12 is short whereas others say as long as it's over 10 it's ok. I had 11 day LP's for 3 months then last month it went down to 7!!!! which is why I got the progesterone gel.

[MidgeMungoAndMary]

No, was just bad luck I think. First and second mc were mmc, discovered at 12wks (one got to 6-8wks, the other 10-11wks) and the third was at 5wks. All tests came back normal so just bad luck. I think if the LP is too short, then it prevents conception - so not sure how it could be linked to mc?

[MidgeMungoAndMary]

Oops, a short LP won't prevent conception but it could/would prevent successful implantation...which didn't happen with me, hence no link with mc.

[hippychick66]

Thanks for the reply midge, sorry it's taken a while for me to acknowledge - Hubbie wont get off the laptop!!!!

I see what you mean about the short LP preventing inplantation rather than actually causing a mc.

I must admit I was quite worried about continuing to ttc just incase I managed it and then MC'd. Thanks for the info.

Did you ever manage to extend your LP?

[hippychick66]

Just googled LPD and MC's. There seems to be some people who think that it's linked and others who agree that the problem is with actually achieving a BFP not with MC. I found this statistic - About 3 percent to 4 percent of women with LPD are infertile and up to 5 percent have a history of repeated miscarriages.

Those numbers sound nice and low so i'll go with those!

I am confused though. I'm meant to add the prog gel from day 18 - 21 and then stop and wait for either pregnancy or AF. but the leaflet says the gel can also be used up until wk 12 of a pregnancy. Are you meant to start using it again if you get a BFP??? Think I'll check with GP.

[hippychick66]

Anyone out there using the progesterone gel as well as me???????????????????

[KERALA1]

My cycle is short (21 days). Never found out when I ovulated but managed to conceive twice by doing the deed at the end of my period. Sorry if TMI!

[hippychick66]

Thanks. Sounds like you ov quite early which means even though you have a short cycle your LP is probably normal (I think that's right - God we turn into right little gyneacologists don't we!!)

I think with me it's defo a case of 'the more you know - th worse it gets' Wish I could just get on with it.

glad to hear of your 2 successes. In my experience on this site - NOTHING is TMI

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

neenz.

Normal luteal phase is approximately 12 - 16 days and needs to be at least 10 days for implantation to take place. A short luteal phase can cause fertility problems making it difficult for a women to get pregnant.

As mentioned earlier though some gynaes do not think LPD is a a problem whilst others do think otherwise.

[hippychick66]

attila what does neenz mean??

You seem very knowledgable about LPD. Can you tell me pls - if I am successful in getting pregnant with a slightly short phase (usually 11 but last one was only 7!) will I be more likely to lose the pregnancy because my womb lining isn't up to the job? Or is it a case of once implanted it's irrelevant what your LP was.

I'm getting very worried about this

[hippychick66]

just got the neenz thing - it's a person from earlier - sorry

[onemoretimetoday]

Short Luteal phase is very definately linked with m/c. I have had 5. What it means is that your progesterone levels are dropping too early if they are ever reaching high enough levels. Linked to this though is your lining, in a LPD or even in a cycle where your LP is 10 days your lining may not be getting thick enough to allow implanation. All of these can contribute to conception but early m/c generally less than 6 weeks. LPD is not well recognised in the UK, the theory is that there is something wrong with the egg rather than with the second half of the cycle but this is not necessarily the case. It can be addressed by use of progesterone supplements such as cyclogest. I've had 5 m/c all due to this prob but had a healthy DC after 4 m/c due to progesterone treatment. I had a 10 day lp and an early m/c at 5+5 earlier this year but am now 15 weeks pg after progesterone treatment again.

Good luck

[hippychick66]

I am going to use the progesterone gel this month and see if it extends the phase. If I am lucky enought to get a BFP should I ask the gp if I can use the gel for the early stages of the preg too?????

[hippychick66]

Good luck with this pregnancy One more time - you defo deserve it

[Cerubina]

I have a short LP as well (only 5 days left to its own devices) and have been prescribed cyclogest to prolong it, which does seem to work. Something else you can take to help it is vitamin B6 - I can't remember where I read about it but it is quite often suggested as something you can do for yourself. I take 100mg per day which is apparently quite safe.

[hippychick66]

Thanks Cerubina, I'm looking into the B6 thing - along with Agnus Castus.

Good luck to you.

The progesterone that you take - is it in the form of a gel you put 'up' or a cream you rub in or a tablet????

[Cerubina]

It's a pessary so probably quite similar to your gel, but to be used for 14 days after ovulation. It seems to do the trick in terms of extending my LP but sadly apart from one m/c there's been nothing needing implantation support . Have to keep trying though.

[bext]

Does anyone take Agnus Castus for this?
I have a LP of 6 days and read that Agnus Castus can extend this but the bottle of pills I bought says 'don't take if you're pregnant' on the back so I'm a little nervous to take them!

[Carlotta27]

@Cerubina i know this is late to ask but wondering if the pessaries worked for you ? I have a 5 day LP and so worried about it x

[Brassica]

Hi Carlotta, I used to be Cerubina. We had a host of difficulties with conceiving, on both sides, so short LP was certainly part of the difficulty in getting pg but not the only part.

In the end I had a second positive test on cyclogest + pessaries but lost it about 6 weeks, then had investigation for early mc which diagnosed blood clotting problems. I had ICSI which resulted in a twin pg, and used heparin until about week 27 and pessaries for the first 16 weeks. Results are now at secondary school.

best of luck with your attempts. It’s so all-consuming when you are trying to get through it and I hope you get lucky.