ELCS granted but no date yet...

[PinkPlaid]

Hi all, after weeks of negotiations, I have finally been granted permission to have an ELCS - I'm tokophobic.

Just got a call from the consultant to say they are fully booked during my week 39 though, and will have to wait and see if another lady goes into spontaneous labour

My due date is 19 Feb so they ideally want me in for 15/16th, but that's now very much dependent on other babies arriving unannounced. I'm feeling pretty nervous again now that I'll potentially be facing labour - been having some period-like aches and tummy tightening...

Just feels like constant one step forward, two steps back... Anyone else had to deal with this sort of thing? I'm in London so demand for ELCS is quite high, I think.

Thanks all x

[Annie105]

Hi pink plaid no real advice for you but am delighted to hear you have got an ELCS for tokophobia. I'm in the same boat and just starting my negotiations to get one. I'm sure it will work out fine maybe if you start they will prioritise you in as a EMCS that's what my midwife told me when I asked her if that scenario happens!!

Hope you don't get too anxious x

[PinkPlaid]

Thanks very much for your kind response, Annie105, it's been a long road to even get my foot in the consultant's door. I've been asking for a c section since last August and I'm now 2 weeks away and still wrangling. The sooner you can have the conversation with a consultant the better, as you will need two to agree that you need one. Then you're put in a queue

Saw the consultant today and she says there's a chance someone will give birth before their date (20% chance) so I'm keeping fingers crossed. The alternative is to basically wait for nature to take its course, then go in and see what's recommended, depending on how much progress there is. So back to square one of my greatest fear - urgh

[Annie105]

Oh bless you. Not what you need right now that anxiety. I completely get it. I'm sure it will work out fine they won't want to put you or your baby at risk. Ive written a letter on the advice of another poster to take with me as part of my booking in appointment (I'm a little later to my booking in appt due to trying to choose a hospital) and am requesting to see a consultant too... By the sounds of your story I may have a similar path! It's not fair is it?

Keep relaxed as you can... Easier said that done I know!! Xxx

[RedToothBrush]

So its fully booked. Why is your mental health less important than anyone else's physical health? Would they be doing this to anyone who had physical health problems. The fact your illness is anxiety related and this is compounding the problem by in fact raising your anxiety and by agreeing to an ELCS for tokophobia they have acknowledged and diagnosed you as having anxiety issues is frankly unacceptable.

Raise merry hell. Find out what the procedure for anyone with physical problems in a similar position would be. I'm sure they fit people in some how instead of giving them a 20% chance of getting a cancellation. Can you IMAGINE what they would do with someone who had placenta previa? What are they doing with women who are having repeat sections only due to having had one in the past? Are they automatically ahead of you in the 'queue'.

The reason you are in this situation now, and its all booked up, is precisely because of their handling of your case and not taking it seriously and treating you appropriately. This would not happen if it was a physical issue.

Find out, how they intend to treat your anxiety that has arisen from this situation in the meantime. (There isn't anything they can do, in the time frame and this is part of the point tbh).

Do NOT accept this. It is NOT treating your issue. Its not understanding why you are anxious. Its treating with you utter contempt. Please see this for what it is.

PUSH PUSH PUSH (yep that's deliberate) for a date and demand to know why you have been put into this situation given your diagnosis. Raise an official complaint over it.

[Annie105]

Red tooth brush I'm going to read your post above to OP before I try to get mine agreed!! Very motivating!!!

You have hit the nail on the head for her scenario. It's unfair women are made to feel like this when an ELCS is requested for these reasons

[PinkPlaid]

Wow, thanks so much for such a motivating response Red - I was feeling like I was somehow putting them to trouble but you're right - why is mental health being treated differently to physical health.

I have it on my notes that I'm high risk and have been asking for support (& a c/s) since last AUGUST. I finally got seen in JANUARY. You're right - it's unacceptable that they can't book me in after fobbing me off for the entire pregnancy. The midwife counsellor advocated for me personally with the consultants and told them I had been suicidal, so to do this to me now is - frankly - negligent. This is all in my notes, thankfully. Will get photocopies.

I have an appointment tomorrow and won't be leaving till I get a date. DH is coming too because he was shocked at how patronising one of the consultants was to me. She told me if I went into spontaneous labour I'd just have to get into 'mummy mode' and get on with it

Thanks again - I'll update you both on how we get on x

[TheCatsMeow]

Ask them to book it at 38 weeks - I had a provisional ELCS booked in case I decided I wanted one, 39 weeks was full so they booked it for 38.

I went into spontaneous labour and ended up with a semi elective semi emergency CS.

[Annie105]

Go on Pink!!! Stick to your guns cannot believe a consultant said that to you. The absolute cheek.

[43percentburnt]

www.nice.org.uk/guidance/cg132/chapter/1-Guidance

Can I suggest you print out the nice guidelines, staple them to your notes and write in pen that you have drawn their attention to the guidelines. Maybe send an email tonight prior to tomorrow's visit. Write notes for tomorrow's visit and take pen and paper for note taking during the appointment - follow up with an email on what was discussed.

I travelled to a different city to get a waterbirth vbac, as I did not trust the closer hospitals to not change their tactic once I was in labour, so I understand your stress. I found quoting studies, research and statistics meant I was listened to. 'According to nice guidelines...' Works well too. I was initially shocked at how little I was listened to but quickly got used to it!

If your consultant is not prepared to do a section they must refer you to someone who will - see guidelines.

[43percentburnt]

Oh and you can request better painkillers for post section than paracetamol and ibuprofen if they say that's all you will receive.

You can also ask them to delay clamping the cord or to milk the cord (slightly quicker), as long as it's not a threat to your lives.

Hope you get it sorted.

[RedToothBrush]

She told me if I went into spontaneous labour I'd just have to get into 'mummy mode' and get on with it


THAT IS APPALLING.

I was told that due to my condition - tokophobia - if I went into spontaneous labour I would STILL get an ELCS. I would be treated as an emergency, just the same as if someone awaiting an ELCS for physical reasons would. They would simply fit me in at the next available opportunity when a theatre was free provided there were no more emergencies that were more serious ahead of me. Any planned ELCS would just get bumped until later in the day.

I do think you are being played and strung along to be honest, if that's what you have been told. I would feel like they had no intention whatsoever of giving me an ELCS if they had not given me a date. My anxiety would be sky high and I would be suicidal at the prospect of it. Neglect is the exact right word.

My fear that someone would 'trick' me into a VB was part of the reason I was given a date early - so that they could build up a relationship of trust with me and allow me to deal with my anxiety rather than inflame it.

Do you really think that someone who had a physical reason would not get a date at all, and be told they had to sit it out until they went into labour?!!!

"Get on with a VBAC despite the risks, as ah well, you should just get on with it... Its your fault for getting pregnant again after a CS first time round. You should have known better and not got pregnant if you had a problem with that. You having a VB is better for our CS rates regardless so you can damn well try it whether you like it or not. Its not our problem how that turns out for you. Our department won't be the one dealing with your long term problems if you have any anyway. As long as you don't die on our watch, its fine!"

Yeah, I'm sure they'd be saying that...

'Mummy mode' is a derogatory and dismissive term in its own right and ground enough for a formal complaint imho. Utterly appalling and contemptible.

Get those guns blazing girl!

Good luck.

[Mummyme87]

Why don't they book you for the first available slot after 39weeks, and wait for a cancellation?

[PinkPlaid]

Hi all,

I saw the consultant this morning and it didn't start off well - she could only offer 22 Feb as a date - which is 3 days after my due date. I was about to start kicking up a fuss when she said 'hang on, there's been a cancellation' and rushed off. 10mins later she came back and said 'done' - I'm now booked in for the 15th .

I can't tell you what this means to me, and I can't thank you all enough for putting some steel back into my backbone. I was sick with worry and going half-mad at the thought of a 'natural' birth. Fingers crossed baby stays put and that everything goes smoothly on the day itself. Now to practice some calm thoughts ... X

[Annie105]

Fabulous news!! Well done to you!! X

[Woody16]

Pink, have you now been given a clear plan as to what will happen if you were to labour spontaneously before your section date? I hope it was discussed with you (and not just the appallIng get on with it mummy comment!), you should be taken round for emergency section. If it wasn't agreed ask to see them again.

I fought throughout my pregnancy for an elective section based on my fears and being fully informed of risks/benefits. It ruined my pregnancy, I was constantly exhausted as lay awake all night for 8 months panicking about labour. My local hospital made me go through consultant midwife counselling and cognitive behavioural therapy with a therapist before seeing obstetrician at 35 weeks who said no. I was offered a second opinion appt then it was cancelled as they said it would still be a no as that was hospital policy. I was referred to another hospital by my midwife at 36 weeks and saw an obstetrician at 36+6 weeks who immediately agreed to it and booked it for 39weeks. I finally slept and was able to enjoy my pregnancy... For 5 days at which point I went into labour. I went to hospital and waited petrified and in agony to see the on call cons, I was 4cm already and things were going fast. He opened with "did anyone say what would happen if you went into premature labour". I burst into tears as I knew what that meant and was so scared. He explained that at 37w risk to the baby would be significantly higher and he wouldn't want to cause the baby harm- however he did still give me the choice. Ultimately I agreed to try to labour as long as I got an epidural and could change my mind and have the section at any time. Labour was very fast and I ended up having forceps which was one of my hugest fears, however I didn't have any significant damage which was my main concern. It was an extremely traumatising experience having never planned to labour or given any consideration of how to cope with it. But 3 weeks on i feel I've more or less recovered from the emotional shock of it now.

I'm not trying to frighten you and hope I haven't, just think it's important to have a plan for if baby tries to come early as I didn't as I never thought it would happen!

Also wanted to share my story for anyone else reading who is trying for elective section, some hospitals will just say no as that is policy and they will not budge, but there is always the option to go elsewhere even if it's late in your pregnancy.

[PinkPlaid]

Hi Woody, thanks so much for sharing your experience with me. I really hope you're feeling ok now?

To be honest, you've described my greatest fear - going into spontaneous labour and having a forceps delivery. I'm utterly terrified of being damaged (& the baby too) by an instrumental birth, and get anxious at the thought of anyone touching me 'down there', let alone the prospect of an episiotomy or forceps being introduced. I've not had any internal examinations so far and want to keep it that way if I can.

I sooke to the senior midwife about spontaneous labour and she said if I had any signs to come straight in, and they'd assess best next steps. I think if things were progressing quickly, I'd opt to try natural labour, like you. I'm pretty scared of having an emergency c section too, but isn't everyone I suppose

Fingers crossed things will go smoothly, but I am going to write a birth plan tonight to try to make it clear how anxious I am.

Thanks again - I do hope you can enjoy the little one now x