Any tips, please, for flat nipples, no real milk yet, 5 pound tired baby?

[macneil]

Hi there, I was referred here after posting in the wrong place, as usual. (It's hidden at the bottom!)

My baby is tiny and jaundiced and they didn't let me give her any food for the first 30 hours after her birth, they just kept saying 'try and make the milk come, babies don't need to feed in the first 24 hours', but she was hungry, and now I feel we've been set back too far. My nipples just totally vanish when she is pressed on them, and I'd been gently getting her to at least nudge at them and slightly put them in her mouth, which didn't make them disappear, then the nurse just came back and rammed her into them again until she screamed, and so many of them did this that I'm afraid she's been put off my breasts quite a lot, and it doesn't help that they don't produce anything yet - although finally, the first few drops have started to appear!

I bought nipple shields today and she did slightly suck on them, but not enough to get to the two drops of milk they produced between them.

I'm still bottle feeding - the hospital was quite sniffy about this and said if I didn't continue with the sucking finger and syringe method she may never use my breast. but at the same time they said I couldn't take her home if her weight dropped any more. I desperately want to breast feed, I hate it when she drinks the bloody brown formula and I can't give her anything. I hired a pump and am worried I overdid that slightly today, shooting pains in the nipples now. But hey, got milk.

[mamama]

Macneil, I just posted on your other thread . Didn't notice it was in the wrong place! I'm too lazy to re-type my post, but I put links to La Leche League & NCT who might be able to give you some advice.

Glad you now have some milk. I don't remember the types of pain I had in those first few days, but I know my breasts felt like they might explode & I felt almost as if I had flu.

As your milk comes in, you'll be able to pump more. It's still early days yet, so don't worry too much. Make sure you're drinking plenty and try pumping first thing in the morning - that's when most people have most milk. Once you start expressing, maybe your DD can have EBM instead of formula?

I had a really hard time breastfeeding for the first couple of months but it worked out ok in the end. It is possible to formula feed and establish breastfeeding, so don't despair. Make sure you get some good help. Keep at it and don't feel bad about the formula. I know it's heartbreaking to want to BF and have difficulty but the most important thing is that your little DD has something. If she can't have breast milk, the formula is the next best thing.

And it can take a while to convince them that nipple shields are a good thing. Just keep trying!

I hope someone more helpful pops along soon.

[macneil]

Your post on the other thread is fantastic and exactly what I wanted to hear right now. Thank you so much. I'm going to copy and paste it and print it out to read in papery leisure. Will obviously report back to fret some more or ask painfully obvious questions. But really, thank you.

[mamama]

Glad it was helpful - thought I was just waffling! (Tried not to, obviously )

There are some very wise MNers who will be far more helpful. Hopefully they'll be along in the morning. I'll check back to see how you're getting on, so keep us posted.

And, FWIW, there are no painfully obvious questions. Ask away! There will always be an MNer who knows the answer or where to find it!

[LIZS]

bump in case Mears or Tiktok are around .

[isasmama]

oh wow!
seems like i m reading my own story..i went thru the same 3 months baq.. and mamama's post in the other thread made me becoz it was exactly the same wid me...tho i dint need usin nipple shields...
so well my advice wud b that at the time of feed pump a bit and wen the milk starts flowing try latching the baby on...this erects the flat nipples makin it easier for baby to latch..thats what worked for me...
drink lots..and once the milk starts cumin ull b drenched...hehe so fret not...
its just the start thats awful and puts u off...but honestly ull forget alll abt it once the baby is settled and growing up...trust me 3 months on i have no memories of the haRDshipS

and yea keep supplementing ur baby wid formula if needed...atleast i did that..and still do!
gives me a break and DS is satisfied for a while too not constantly attatched to me!
HTH

ps : congrats and love to the LO!
best of luck!! keep us posted!

[shonaspurtle]

Just want to say congratulations on the birth of your little girl and hang on in there - it sounds like you're really making a go of it

I've had similar problems with flat nipples and have been expressing using an electric pump borrowed from my hospital. I also find it helps to pump for a little bit before I latch ds on as it helps my nipples to stand out better.

I've not used formula as I was lucky enough to have a good supply quite early on but have been feeding ds regularly with ebm from an Avent bottle and he's had no problems combining bottle and breast so far (I cried when I gave him the first bottle because I was sure it'd put him off my breasts for good as I'd read about only using a syringe or cup - ds was having none of that!)

I would say try to get lots of help and support with latching her onn (face to face if at all possible). I ended up with v, v sore nipples as I was trying to do it myself and not getting a proper latch and I think would have given up if I'd not been referred to a bf counsellor at my local hospital. It does get better though - we're almost 3 weeks now and the experience is completely unrecognisable to those early days.

[hotmulledwinemama]

Firstly, congrats on the birth of your lo!

I had/have flat nipples - caused me problems with dd1 - didn't feed for as long as I wanted - determined to crack it with dd2.

My tips:

Get in contact with a bf counsellor - I got in contact with La Leche - my local contact is fab.

I did use nipple shield with dd1 - but I truly think that this was part of the problem as my milk supply went right down. What I found to be more effective with dd2 was to wear breast shells about 15 mins before I wanted to feed, this got my nips in the 'right' shape.

Apply Lansinoh if your nipples get sore.

Demand feed your lo - as they are little you need to feed 8-12 times a day.

Check out Kellymom.com for fab help and advice.

You can bf successfully even if you have flat nipples, I'm still going strong with dd2 (10 months next week). HTH

[macneil]

Many thanks for these posts, which are so great. I have the breast shells, haven't tried them. Will. typing with one hand again as on pump. cheers!!!

[Quootiepie]

I have flat nipples, and big boobies and it was noted down in my notes DS wouldnt latch, and I expressed onto a spoon at hospital, and when I got home, used my pump and gave DS EBM for about a week. I pumped near when he was due a feed , then tried for 20 minutes with him on breast and if he didnt latch, gave him the EBM. After a week, it got more and more on the breast. I was abit scared to drop the EBM, but a MW told me to... and havent looked back since. He sucks for england now! I think pumping abit before the feed helped, it drew my nipples out, and also coated them in milk. Even if he hadn't latched, as the MW said, as long as you got the breastmilk into him somehow! I bought nipple shields recently for biting, but I found them useless... but they can work for other people Persistance I guess is good... I tried every feed for a week...

[LIZS]

mears ?

[LRWG]

Congratulations on the birth of your daughter!! This sounds almost exactly like my own story - DD too lazy/tired to feed and had to be bottle-fed due to jaundice and low blood sugar. Nipple shields didn't work for us and I ended up expressing for eight weeks, but be warned - it was very hard work (bottle feed, express, sterilise everything... continually), but worth it as DD got my milk.

I expressed for eight weeks before I couldn't cope any longer. The day after I expressed for the last time my DD decided that she would breastfeed afterall (kept falling asleep on the breast before and used me for comfort). So, don't worry about nipple confusion - she can do both and will do, unfortunately, this'll be when she's ready.

Oh - and I overdid the expressing a couple of times and had the shooting pains. Take paracetamol and have a soak in the bath. I didn't express too much from that breast for a day or so afterwards just to let things settle down. One tip is to massage your breast all round, towards the nipple, before expressing and try to think happy thoughts (hard, I know, when you feel like Daisy the Cow) as it'll help your milk letdown. I found that imagining my daughter feeding from me helped a great deal.

HTH and good luck!

[macneil]

it was very hard work (bottle feed, express, sterilise everything... continually), but worth it as DD got my milk.

That's a conclusion I have quickly reached. Such a lovely part of your story that your baby just found your breast in the end. I feel that feeding every three hours with trying on the breast first, then giving her expressed milk, then giving top up of formula, then onto the pumps for half an hour, then, as you say, constant sterilisation of all the bottles for the different milks, means that at the moment all I do is feeding related. My mum's here from england, or I would just go crazy. I just keep thinking, if I could just take out a breast and then feed her for half an hour, I'd save about 2 hours each time! The things I could do!

[deaconblue]

I used to pump for a few seconds which was enough to get the nipples out properly and then latch him on. Then I used nipple shields and didn't need to pump first. Keep trying, it's bloody hard I know. I also gave ds a few bottles in the first 3 days and I think rather than stopping him feeding it gave him the strength he desperately needed to be able to suck hard enough to get my milk flowing. We then bf exclusively for 6 months. good luck

[meiko]

ditto to what shoppingbags said exactly. I gave my DS formula from cup for first few days to get weight and strnegth up.. Also expressed to encourage nipples out before latching on and then used nipple shields. found it helped a lot and by 5 weeks was going ok