My box of formula says water should be 40-50C- that isn't right is it?

(33 Posts)
raininginbaltimore Wed 25-Jul-12 11:26:07

I ordered my Hipp formula, as I am ff from start (medication reasons). I got their new one and looked at instructions and it says water must be at least 40-50 degrees C. I thought it was 70? Have guidelines changed?

I might ring them but thought I would check with you knowledgeable lot first!

nickelbarapasaurus Thu 26-Jul-12 16:42:23

I would probably allow 10-15 minutes then - 30 minutes for 1 litre is scientifically worked out, and I can't be arsed to work it out for 160ml, so I would say long enough if you were making a cup of tea that you would start to drink it - that's about 10-15 minutes.

As long as it's not immediately boiling, then it doesn't matter.

Spiritedwolf Thu 26-Jul-12 13:51:38

I found this interesting because I figured that if I need to use an artificial milk then Hipp might be my preferred choice because a. I like to use organic animal products when possible and b. Hipp don't seem to have made quite so many crappy marketing decisions as Aptimal/Cow&Gate, SMA/Nestle. (Possibly because they are a smaller player in the market than any ethical stance?)

Its rather annoying to find that they are misleading people about the safe temperature to cool water to before mixing with forumla, thank you for bringing it to my attention. I think it might just be better to make it up with the 70 degree water and doing without the probiotics, if that's what their sterile ready-made milks are like then its hardly bad. As long as we don't go for Hipp because of the probiotic claims I guess.

Fingers crossed I'll be able to breastfeed (40 wks + 1 preg with my 1st), I'm sorry that its not an option for you raining. Try not to beat yourself up about it, it can't be helped - your mental health is vital. Take care of yourself and your baby in the best way you can.

I tend to think of it a bit like pharmacetical companies, I don't really like everything they get up to, but I do rely on the medicines they produce to stay healthy. Luckily, boycotting life/health preserving products isn't necessary to take a political stand that these companies should act (or be forced to act) more ethically - there are all kinds of other things we can do, sign petitions, write letters, start online discussions.

In the event that I ever needed to use a Nestle owned brand of formula for my baby (because no others were available), I would do so, but I'd still keep boycotting their sweets/cereals/coffees/petfoods etc as I do at the moment.

raininginbaltimore Thu 26-Jul-12 08:12:27

It can be higher than 70, just not lower. They suggest not boiling water as it may kill some nutrients.

The DOH guidelines annoy me because they say 30mins, but then they say a litre or water takes 30mins. Why would I boil a litre of water to make a 160ml bottle? But that is a personal bug bear of mine smile

Should have said as well decision to ff is also to do with management of condition. Lack of sleep could risk triggering a manic episode and I remember how intense and relentless it was feeding my ds in the early weeks. FF means that I can share with Dh and therefore get slightly more sleep (!) or at least getmore regular sleep.

Thanks for all the advice. It makes me cross that some people will follow advice on box, which could be dangerous.

BrightJumpers Thu 26-Jul-12 08:06:21

i used hipp - water at 70 degrees- my baby is v healthy and happy on it. i didnt know they recommended cooler water, and am v disappointed about this as it is clearly against dh guidelines.

i did use a thermometer at first (ordered off amazon) as obvs all kettles are different. the key to safety i found is quick cooling in a bowl of iced water as soon as you have made it so the milk spends as little time as possible at room temperature which is when bacteria likely to breed.

ff can be a bit daunting at first. you are not stupid! the guidance is confusing enough without hipp making it more difficult.

RuthlessBaggage Thu 26-Jul-12 07:56:51

I think the reason for not using water straight out of the boiling kettle is the scalding risk rather than 'nutrient bruising'.

You can make it up with half boiling water, then half cooled boiled from fridge. Hot kills bugs, cold assists cooling.

SamraLee Wed 25-Jul-12 23:47:18

It just has to be 70 degrees or higher. Don't leave the kettle to cool for more than 30 minutes, is the usual advice.

GoodHeavensNo Wed 25-Jul-12 23:41:52

THick question alert.
When you make a bottle - does the water have to be 70 degrees? How do you know it's 70 degrees, do you have to use a thermometer?

Can't you just use boiling water, and then leave it to cool?

nellypackedhertrunk Wed 25-Jul-12 23:11:45

Please don't feel stupid. No one thinks that. The emotion I feel is being cheesed off (that's me being polite) with the formula companies for advising parents to do something unhealthy. If I was in your position I would have assumed that the manufacturers instructions were correct so actually you've showed far more intelligence than most people, including myself.

I don't know your personal story other than what you have said here. I'm sorry that you have to cope with your condition together with working out what is best for your baby. However, it is really important that you do what is best for you regarding the Bipolar Disorder - and that in itself will turn out to be the best for your baby because you can be there for him/her. You've already shown yourself to be a great mum by querying the information you had. You're doing a great job and don't tell yourself anything else.

showtunesgirl Wed 25-Jul-12 23:07:25

Why do Hipp believe they are above the Official DOH guidelines? hmm

showtunesgirl Wed 25-Jul-12 23:07:25

Why do Hipp believe they are above the Official DOH guidelines? hmm

raininginbaltimore Wed 25-Jul-12 22:44:57

Thanks. Yes I have checked. I will be restarting lithium for my bipolar disorder almost immediately (going to feed for at least a day).

Lithium is a pretty nasty drug, and I have done lots of reading. There is not enough evidence to make me feel safe using it. I have to have regular blood tests to check kidney and liver function as it can destroy them.

It had been a long, hard decision.

TinyDiamond Wed 25-Jul-12 22:40:11

OP, I'm sure someone may have directed you here if you've had other threads about it before. But have you definitely checked that your meds cannot be combined
With bf? Doctors will tell you no for anything stronger than paracetamol but there are experts that can talk you through it properly.

There is the drugs in breastmilk helpline run by the breastfeeding network (just search for the number) I think
It is staffed Monday to fri.

If you have an iPhone there is a free app called lactmed which is really helpful for doing your own research too

I use the HIPP baby milk in bottles, will this have been made up the same way? confused

5madthings Wed 25-Jul-12 22:02:53

raining i use the hipp formula, like you i figure its 'organic' so better and i ignore their instructions and make it with 70 degree water, my 2 seem fine on it like that, if i have killed the prebiotics then it doesnt make that much difference, not all formulas have the prebiotic anyway! and i would rather do that than risk them getting poorly.

raininginbaltimore Wed 25-Jul-12 21:53:22

Thanks. Yes I was discussing that. I do want to be able to prepare a feed in advance and take out in cold bag.

It is annoying that they have marketed this in a way that means it can't be made safe.

YoulllaughAboutItOneDay Wed 25-Jul-12 21:42:07

No one thinks you are stupid.

What a stupid way to develop a product more like. Oh, we know that it needs to be prepared at 70 degrees to kill potentially harmful bacteria, but we want prebiotics in. Ah, sod it, we'll tell people to use 50 degree water.

Also interesting that they say they believe that temperature is ok if the milk is used immediately. What about the situations where you need to pre-prepare a bottle. As I think I've seen you discussing on threads (don't want to search past threads. Feels a bit stalkerish!) there are safe ways of doing that with 70 degree water.

Bloody formula companies making things so hard angry.

raininginbaltimore Wed 25-Jul-12 21:40:45

I am wondering if there is a way of querying it with, I dunno department of health. I am thinking that it isn't right that the instructions are against guidelines.

AuntPepita Wed 25-Jul-12 21:33:47

I bet no-one thinks you are stupid! You are following the manufacturers guidelines - it is NOT YOU that is stupid.

midori1999 Wed 25-Jul-12 21:33:42

Don't feel stupid. You are doing the best for your baby, you are doing the best you can and you can't do any more than that.

Babylon1 Wed 25-Jul-12 21:33:37

You're not stupid at all, don't think that sad

It's better to ask and be certain than to just wing it and get it wrong. smile

You'll get loads of great support here, so don't ever feel daft for asking anything and never ever advance search me to find some of the ridiculous questions I have asked grin

raininginbaltimore Wed 25-Jul-12 21:28:43

I feel a bit stupid now. I thought I was doing the best thing for the baby, without breast milk. Bet loads of people think I am stupid.

nellypackedhertrunk Wed 25-Jul-12 21:22:15

What a rubbish response. Formaula has to made with boiled water cooled to no lower than 70 in order to kill the intrinsic pathogens within it. Perhaps HIPP should read the following document from the World Health Organisation:

www.who.int/foodsafety/publications/micro/pif_guidelines.pdf

raininginbaltimore Wed 25-Jul-12 21:08:47

Yes, my midwife is great.

I realise it is a standard reply. Argh. I got Hipp for a few reasons- one because we can buy it online at no extra cost. And because I can't BF I thought I would try and do the best and get organic. I know some people will think that is daft, but it is hard enough knowing you can't BF.

I think I will just have to make it at 70, and kill the friendly bacteria. But presumably not kill the nutrients. I wish it wasn't this hard.

RuthlessBaggage Wed 25-Jul-12 18:55:32

Spontaneous reply there...

Do you have a supportive midwife available to discuss it with?

Finallygotaroundtoit Wed 25-Jul-12 18:41:26

< L.Fermentum hereditum, originally derived from
breastmilk.>

Never heard of it!
Sounds made up to me.

And they are trying to imply that their formula has bm in it hmm - it does not

Also rather sneaky is the suggestion that they can flout national guidelines and throw in 'bacteria from the home' to be as significant as non sterile formula contaminated before it's even opened.

Naughty and misleading angry

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