Becoming very worried about 3yr old's behaviour...Advice needed please.

[Mummymonster]

I know I tend to fret unnecessarily about DS but I am now becoming rather concerned.

DS is 3.4, he is (I like to think) intelligent. He has a large vocab, knows colours (inc shades) shapes, is very adept with a pc and the internet (for 3...clicking/dragging etc) will happily spend 2hrs or so at a pc telling you about what he's doing) loves playing out etc etc. He's friendly, happy, chatty and polite.

However...His nursery teacher has mentioned that he fails to make or maintain eye contact. He also gets distracted very easily and will become uncontrolably giddy. As one of his teachers mentioned liable to become 'disruptive' He is also liable to bite when tired and run about with his bum in the air, leading with his head on the floor. in addition he will shake his head violently and today he was banging it hard on the stairs.

Today he hit giddiness at home and would not listen to me or DH, ignoring every point we made and continuing with his inappropriate behaviour. In that situation he only seems to respond to a loud voice or sharp tap (and I'm not happy about resorting to that). Thursday he ran across a busy road despite being told to wait patiently. (Thank god for drivers with ABS) That scared the bejabus out of him but only for 24 hrs.

I am following the school's line of positive disipline so I maintain a continuity of approaches between home and school. I am finding it very very difficult as he sees the 'planned ignoring' as carte blanche to play up. His mannerts have improved no end but....arrggghhh!

The Head of the nursery suggested he may benefit from going full time as soon as it can be arranged. They have also suggested an intensive course on the positive behaviour initative.

I'm at the end of my teather. He is a wonderful child in all other respects. I am concerned about his behaviour (my DB had undiagnosed ADHD and I saw the awful affect that had) but I don't want to seem to be joining the band of mums who think it's fashionable to have a LO with an issue. DS has a good home cooked diet, limited sweets and fried food etc so I doubt it is a dietary issue.

Advice on how I should approach this and what I could do would be greatly appreciated.

[PeachyIsNowAChristmasFruit]

Quote:

'but I don't want to seem to be joining the band of mums who think it's fashionable to have a LO with an issue'- Ok, if you want advie it might be nice to be kind about Mums whose kids have problems and not perpetuate such shite? A dx is HARD to get.

But for the sake of your LO.......


What's your gut instict? Is it a phase? All of this could be. or have you had niggles for years? Because often your answer to that will tell you what you want to know.

If you are really concerened see your GP and ask for a referral to a paediatrician. That's really the only way to get a definitive answer. I'd be wary about putting a young child who is showing any concerns straight into full time care: might seem like a punishment to him, don't you think?

[Mummymonster]

Apologies in retrospect to all, unfortunatley it is a term that has been used towards me in the past by someone who in all honestly, I should never have listened to in the first place. I do not want anyone to feel I am judging them at all.

I am considering speaking to the nursery head in the new term (tricky to do anything pre xmas break) and maybe the GP

[COPPERfeelunderSantasTOP]

Fashionable to have a LO with an issue?

My first thought was that at 3yrs old he's supposed to be playing about etc but obviously it's hard to tell from a post on here. Could it be that he's bored at nursery? Do the staff have consistent strategies to manage his behaviour while he's there? Tbh I don't see how going full-time will help, unless it's to tire him out.

[COPPERfeelunderSantasTOP]

Cross-posted there.

[Mummymonster]

And Thanks Peachy, I do think a full time place at U4 is excessive. Again, apologies for my previous ill judged comment.

[DumbledoresFairy]

Mummymonster, is he your oldest? It is just that my three year old is an absolute trial at the moment too - not necessarily the same as your ds, but equally difficult behaviour. He is wearing me down physically on a daily basis. But he is my youngest of four and I have seen it all before so I know what he is doing is normal and will stop one day. I don't know if you have that perspective on your ds?

BTW, I am not going to comment on whether he has a condition as such or is just going through a phase, as I really don't know. But if it helps to know that other 3 year olds are equally challenging, you might be reassured.

[Twiglett]

Ignoring the possibility of SN

Personally I think it might be wise to consider that the 'positive behaviour reinforcement' does not work in isolation

I think all children need to have clear parameters .. and particularly 3 year olds .. this was the age when my DS was at his most challenging tbh

I think you should use a firm voice (does not need to be a shout, but may be), a removal from the situation to a space and ignoring

I think he's probably confused about where the parameters lie if there is no firm reinforcement and repetition of what is and isn't acceptable how else would he know what's OK behaviour .. by osmosis?

[Pinotmum]

How do you find his eye contact? Does he make and maintain eye contact with you? I am reading 2 hrs at the pc correctly?

[Mummymonster]

Thanks Copper. I have thought that he may be getting bored. He has always had lots of stimulation at home. Are the school just seeing DS as being 'naughty' rather than fed up.

BTW can I really truly apologise again for a glib comment. It's not like I'm not aware of the hell parents face to get a child statemented. I feel sick to my stomach and wish I could take it back, I really do.

[Mummymonster]

Pinot...He does spend far to much time at the PC I am ashamed to say. He does do 'educational' things on it and it's always accompanied with lots of discussion (what, why etc).
His eye contact is awful, 1 second at the most before he's searching for something else to look at.

[Twiglett]

gut feeling (no research to back up) but I actually don't think its too healthy for a toddler to use a computer ... unless sitting on their parent's knee for a few minutes

I'd be concerned at the lack of eye contact .. can you sit him on your knee facing you and play pat-a-cake style games or tell him a story or chat to him? will he stay for that?

[bobsmum]

MM- soundsa little familiar. My ds is just 4 and started 5 mornings at nursery for the first time (unlike all his peers who've been in institutionalised care since 2 ish).

His teacher has picked up that he's bright to the point where she says he's possibly stifled and held back by the nursery situation. His behaviour can then be disruptive and he is prone to toddler-like tantrums when he's made to sit down in a group or be quiet for any length of time.

He's being seen by an educational psychologist after Xmas. his teacher was at pains to make sure I knew she knew that this behaviour was tied in with his intelligence, but that socially he was quite behind and just didn't "get" what was expected of him. But she thought with guidance and strategies he could learn and adapt at being in formal education IYSWIM.

I'm still waiting to see any strategoes tbh, but I have noticed he often is just taken out of group/circle time and does puzzles with a teacher - he seems to carve one-to-one attention. But don't most boys of this age?

I agree that full time might just be overwhelming at this age. I'm concerned that even a year from now,ds will struggle with the expectations of full time primary school.

[COPPERfeelunderSantasTOP]

I think that it might be worth asking for a referral to see someone, even if only to put your mind at rest.

What was his general development like when he was younger? Are your concerns fairly recent or, as Peachy says, have you had a niggling feeling for a while?

When he tells you what he's doing on the computer is it a 2-way conversation or does he just talk at you rather than to you IYSWIM?

[bobsmum]

'crave"

[Jimjams2]

I wouldn't worry about eye contact all that much to be honest. Think it can be a bit of a red herring.

Have you tried fish oils (get a decent brand though, and if he tends to hyperactivity I'd avoid eye-Q and go more for omega 3's rather than 6's).

[Twiglett]

is ability to maintain eye contact not important at this age Jimjams (interested question?)

[belgo]

Have you tried cutting out TV and computer? How much physical exercise does he get - running, jumping, kicking a ball around.

I've found my nearly three year old's behaviour has improved since she started going full time to a nursery school, walking there and back every day, and no TV or computer in the afternoon/evenings.

[PeachyIsNowAChristmasFruit]

Not sure about from JimJams perspective, but from ours eye contact seems to trigger an ASD! reaction if not there, and whilst it can be a factor, plenty of ASD kids have good eye contact ( ds3, for example) and plenty of NT kids find it a poor area.

BTW, when did he last have his eyes tested? just a thought.

3 is a hard age for some, my sister (nursery manager) argues that the Terrible Two's nickname should be renamed Terrible Three's, so I would worry more without a bit of off behaviour, TBH.

As he is bright, search social stories on the net and try and devise one to dow tih eye contact and looking at people... these stories are often used with SN, but thats a shame as they're most useful for ANY child.


My advice in these situations is to get a referral from GP if you are worried: appointments can take 8 months or so to arrive, and can laways be cancelled if things resolve themselves. But it is also not to worry too much, chances are he's just hit a small developmental glitch which will resolve rather quickly.

[Jimjams2]

IME its not that important. Not in the way that people outside the field think anyway. When watching ds2 and ds3 hawk like I wasn't reallly bothered by eye contact at all. Ds1's eye contact is actually pretty good. If it was part of list along with doesn't point, is unable to play, isn't talking, then I'd note i, but I'd never give it much weight alone.

It sounds really food like to me Mummymonster. I would never say go on an elimination diet without professional help, but neurotypical ds3 has a lot of behavioural issues related to food. As your DB had ADHD I'd look into potentially trying a gluten /casein free diet (again ime if it works it will work quickly and very obviously and if it doesn't isn't worth doing). You can get a test to see whether its likely to work, if you preferred. We had the test with ds3, made him strictly gluten free after the test and switched him to goats milk (which does have casein- but a different form that is digested more easily- it gets complicated) and he changed dramatically.

DS1 and ds3 get very headbangy on the wrong (healthy) foods.

[Jimjams2]

Yep exactly peachyclair- that's what I mean. IN fact I seem to remember being told that "ds1 definitely isn't autistic because he has such good eye contact" ho ho ho.

[PeachyIsNowAChristmasFruit]

I'd agree with JimJmas there, DS1 has a casein free diet and has had from shortly after birth, fortunately as I have the casein thing diagnosed we knew what the prolem was. From my perspective, apart from the obvious things- diarrhoea, stomach pains- when I have casein its like there is a sheet of reinforced glass between me and the world, and the wprld is running about a minute ahead of me. Sounds bizarre, but that's how I experience it. It varies though.

DS1 has been on a gluten free diet for a few months though, anyone who knows us will have noticed a remarkable lack of Guess what DS has done... threads lately LOL! The difference is HUGew and for us is the diffrence between coping and not.

[COPPERfeelunderSantasTOP]

That's really good news about ds1, Peachy!

[PeachyIsNowAChristmasFruit]

I know think thats why we're able to focus on getting ds3 a dx now, we're out of that dark tunnel. Felt amazingly better after we applied for a stetment too- lazy so and so's at the LEA not yet replied but as soon as I did I felt my responsibilities were fulfilled, does that sound silly?

[mumofhelen]

My opinion in these situations - If in doubt, get your GP to refer yourself and son to a peadiatrician. Otherwise, the uncertainty will go on and on and on and gnaw it you day and night. Trust me on this one - When the peadiatrician said my dd was and I quote is "one of the healthiest specimen" he'd seen walk through his door for some time, and that there was nothing wrong with dd, it was so reassuring it's difficult to put the relief into words. What's more, it got all the other so-called "professionals" off my family's case. Conversely, had there been a problem, I know that dd would have received TRUE and genuine professional help.

[COPPERfeelunderSantasTOP]

Not silly at all, Peachy. You know that you've done your bit and it's in someone else's hands now. It must be a relief.