ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT: This thread hasn't been posted on for a while.
In wishing dd was less chavvy?(635 Posts)
Went to parents evening last night at 14 yr old dd's school, and noticed that some of dd's teachers were doing double takes at us. Basically because we are obviously very middle-class (which round here means BBC accent, no visible tattoos or bad hair extensions), whereas dd presents herself as an out and out chav.
When I imagined one day having a rebellious teenager I imaged her as a pretty goth, or something along those lines. You know - shaved bits on her head, intense hair colours, lots of black, chunky boots, and I smugly thought I'd be really tolerant and approving, never commenting on my teen's dress sense.
This is dd's ACTUAL look: half an inch of orange foundation, thick, thick eyeliner and six layers of mascara. likethis Hair straightened to within an inch of its life and coated with product. Massive cleavage (at 14 she's wearing an e-cup bra and will not put the buggers away), sagging tracksuit bottoms (with a bit of belly hanging out over the top), huge trainers.
She has a strong Sarf London accent. As far as food choices go, she turns her nose up at the food I make and spends her pocket money at the fried chicken shop or buying kebabs. Will only eat plastic white bread. No vegetables. Spends her lunch money on things like Panda Pops and Red Bull.
She doesn't read anything except Bella and Best magazines (I'm an English graduate and teacher so this is like a knife to my heart), and listens to the cheesiest, naffest, mainstream R&B. She has no hobbies and no interest in what is going on in the world. She's already told me she wants to have a baby young. A brown baby. Her friends mostly have mothers who had them at 16 or 17 and she sees teenage parenthood as normal and not really a problem. We live in the borough with one of the highest teenage pregnancy rates in London, and she knows girls only a bit older than her who are having children.
Most of her teachers (weirdly) find her charming but they are also exasperated by her determination to fail academically, despite our support at home and her very good brain. Last night I wanted to disappear through a hole in the floor while her maths teacher talked about her constant chatting in class, her failure to hand in any homework, her bringing fucking SNOWBALLS in to the lesson and then having a strop when she was told off. She does the 'yeh but no but' thing when she's challenged about her behaviour - suddenly speeds her speech up so it's practically incomprehensible, blinds you with a loud flurry of complicated but intrinsically feeble excuses: "Yeh but, you said, yeh, that if I did last week's homework, yeh, like Kelly goes, whatever, he never set no homework, and you didn't tell me to write it down so it's YOUR fault, and and I'm not taking the blame for you not doing that, and Charmaine said, like, we didn't have to hand it in until Wednesday, but I was off Wednesday and you didn't tell me...." etc, etc, etc.
Last night she threw a massive strop as we were leaving the house to go to parents evening because I was wearing a Hobbs coat, DD said I looked too posh and would embarrass her.
I've n/c for this post by the way, because I feel embarrassed to describe myself as middle-class (although I am - privately educated, dad was a senior diplomat) and because it seems so mean to describe my dd as a chav - but it's inescapable that she has adopted a chav lifestyle and way of presenting herself.
And it's REALLY challenging my ability to be accepting of her as a blossoming adult that she's adopted a lifestyle which happens to embody everything I dislike about modern culture. And saying that makes me feel like a pathetic old git, but it's true. I could take her being an eco rebel, a punk, a goth, an emo. But a chav? It's gutting!
I love that post, NaicePig I wish I could write so well.
This is why I never post in AIBU. People come along with an axe to grind and will not let go. It's like the clarifying posts never happened, and you end up in the most maddening one-sided conversation. If I and other posters can see that the OP was signalling her daughter's attitude to babies as fashion accessories then so could the racist-callers here if they were remotely inclined to be reasonable. Asking for clarification was fine; sticking your fingers in your ears and LALALAing through all explanations whilst hammering on and on with your original objection to the wording is just dogmatic and annoying.
I get where your coming from OP. I had an almost 14 year old dd who aspires to move to Newcastle & star in Geordie Shore. She was an angel baby, a loving toddler, perfect little girl. She has changed so much from starting at high school yet I can see under all her layers of make-up she's just a young girl desperate to fit in. For me it's not the joggers that she's obsessed with its the ridiculously tight daisy duke denim shorts, she barely has them off, I've had to gently say to her that she needs to put them in the wash as they are very tight! Everyone else who meets et tells me she is a lovely girl so maybe some of her attitude is an act to me & her dad. I can't wait til we come out of this phase. Got parents night tonight so this should be fun! Good luck with your dd OP, the only advise I could give you is to love her, remember all her good qualities & try to see that she is trying to fit in with her peers.
Surprised this thread has turned out so oddly, it seemed quite light hearted to start with. Oh well.
I think the OP could have been more carefully worded, but after having you explain your scenerio and re reading, it does actually make more sense that you are just quoting your daughter's childish view, of oh I'll just get a "brown one".
Like babies are handbags.
It does seem like she may be trying to rebel especially against you as she makes racist remarks against white people.. or possibly she really does feel its the only way to fit in. Either way, teenagers are shit. They mostly stop being shit and turn in to people if me, my sister, my friends growing up were anything to go by. My babies are still little and mostly unannoying though so what do I know. Wish you the best of luck though
Hmm. I think if any of my kids actually aspired to be a teenage parent, I really would up sticks to a nicer neighborhood with more ambitious families and try my luck there. My folks actually had to do that with our family when I was 12. At my old school, I was desperate to fit in, and the popular girls were the type that didn't think far beyond having male attention; I was also bullied for being intelligent and thus dumbed down my work to avoid conflict. In my new school, in a nicer town, surrounded by nicer and more ambitious peers, I blossomed.
Other than that, OP, I'd suggest taking lots of pictures of your daughter during this fine phase and showing them to her friends years later. Like maybe on her hen night, when she's all well-to-do classypants and acting too embarrassed to wear a weenie whistle.
Yes and a thread that is fundamentally about how to cope with the effect of peer pressure on your teenager. I would be equally upset if my DD had got sucked into the culture of the "cool" madams at her private school, they may not have been lampooned into a stereotype (although apparently DDs call them sloanes, but a very different subculture to the sloanes of old) but they are still orange, model themselves on glamour models / playboy bunnies, think it's cool not to work and are left very vulnerable by their predatory use of their sexuality, binge drinking and drug taking to gain attention. But then my parents were upset when I got in with the hippiest hippys with their long hair, hippy hats, patchouli oil, beads, and that was just the boys.... and they didn't know about the heroin. One of my boyfriends ended up dead and another is still in jail in Bolivia.
Even though my daughters never turned orange there was a phase, 14 is the absolute low, when I was regarded only as an embarrassment and loser, I just had to weather the storm, keep the communications open, laugh with them, and keep the boundaries in place. Now the younger one is 16 and I have just noticed lately more conversations that are genuine adult exchanges, treating me as someone worthy of respect. DD1 says that though she envied the girls who were allowed to go clubbing all night etc. she also recognised that they weren't happy and she secretly appreciated that I cared enough to lay down boundaries (which to be honest I was probably all the more strict about because of what I had got up to as a teenager behind my innocent parents backs)
the rdiculous thing is at the core of this thread is we have 2 upset parents
1 x upset as her daughter is off the rails
1 x upset as she felt come comments were very offensive to her kids
so how the fuck it turned into this...very sad
We have taken a look at the thread now.
Can we ask that folks report posts to us that they feel break our Talk guidelines , including racist comments and personal attacks, rather than posting or PMing about them please.
This thread does seem to have gone off topic, can we please direct everyone back to the OP?
We're getting loads of reports about this thread, and because it's so long we're going to suspend posting while we have a proper look and work out what to do.
I've had enough of you now Hortensia I think you really messed up at the start and it's gone nowhere but downhill since.
Oh and I had a gothy 14 yr old she was a miserable bugger and wandered round as if her world was ending it wasn't fun I can assure you,
Having the thread pulled?
Isn't that a bit precious.
yes it is precious but the point I was trying to make is it went off in tangent did you actually get any advice on how to cope with her, the humour wasn't wasted on me most of it I didnt personally find some of it funny, your dd is an individual and she hasn't turned out the floaty teen you hoped she would and then they torrent of oh dearie me I feel your pain rubbish teenage girls want to fit in they need too your dd sounds a handful and I do think you sort of went about asking for help int he wrong way, just my opinion of course teenagers are a pain in the arse and tbh you are just going to have to accept her dress sense as it is and challange her atttitude,
I'm sure she doesn't really hate you Hortensia.
Are you getting some support in your relationship with her, and the challenges with your other children ?
Could you get some counseling to help you explore things, try different approaches, and get some more support ?
Having the thread pulled?
Isn't that a bit precious.
Re: spending more 1 on 1 time with dd - yes. She hates me but still appreciates having time with me without the boys.
this thread should have been pulled frigging pages ago. no constructive advice taken all laughing and gawfawwing at chavvy ways of middle class teenagers , it is vile, Horatio I hope you can manage to sort your dd out as I said pages ago she isn't a chav she is 14 and rebelling
Yes, now that's a much more useful avenue to explore ....
Do you manage to spend any "quality" time with DD - just you and her, doing things she (and you) would especially like ? Sounds like she may be competing for attention with challenging sibs ?
Stephen Covey is very good on the value of one to one time between everyone in a family in his great book "The 7 Habits of Effective Families" - he's my top guru ! (well, one of them)
It has also been my humble experience, as a mother of kids aged 12-33 ( yes really ) that some people who have only younger children can lack empathy, and assume it will never happen to them. It might and might not.
I don't blame those types of parents for that attitude - I might have had it myself in the past .
Experience is a great teacher for us all, kids and parents.
As someone said up thread , teenagers are often challenging boundaries and go by their own views ( often peer influenced) rather than ours.
Just utterly pissed off how some people seem to haunt these boards LOOKING for things to take offence at, and then derailing perfectly well meaning and good humoured threads.
You can understand though that op is upset - she came here looking for support and now is defendant in the Court of Mumsnet. Accused of lying and being a racist due to some remark of her daughter's.
Anyway mumsnet will probably pull this thread which is a shame.
Op - is your daughter just attention-seeking? It seems you have had a lot to deal with.
There is a world of difference between reporting the views of someone else and holding them yourself . End of.
And it wasn't the main point of the thread.
I'm really sorry to hear how hard your family life is. It does sound challenging.
Teen years can be so tough hey ?
I think you'll find Mrs DeV is upset by this thread too.
And I think you'll find that comment will be regarded as a personal attack
I think you should have stuck to stating that you weren't racist and you were just using your daughter's words to describe how she sees things.
It was fair enough IMHO for people to question what you put, but I accept what another poster said, that your response should have been believed.
Anyway, that's my opinion - the middle way ?
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