ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT: This thread hasn't been posted on for a while.
To have filmed my ds1s preschool nativity play even though(283 Posts)
We were expressly told no filming.
I did zoom in on just him ( as much as was possible ) and only filmed a few short clips, not the whole event.
I felt I would have really regretted not having captured the memory, and my son loves watching himself on film, and has already enjoyed watching the clips and singing along to the songs.
And I just don't see how a video of fully clothed children would be satisfying viewing for a peadophile. With this vein of thought surely we should start making our children wear burkas.
Idk why there is a question mark at the end of that.
Posters here don't have any right to make demands about your behaviour, of course, but a school isn't a public place so they can impose restrictions as appropriate and ask you to leave if you won't stop filming when they've asked you not to. How are they to know you can be trusted to keep the footage private if you have already ignored the request not to film it?
If they didn't impose a blanket ban on filming, and made provisions for the majority of parents who probably want at least one photo, then people wouldn't have to break the rules.
It is the schools duty to protect the child, but they also have an obligation IMO to cater to the reasonable and simple desire of the majority of parents.
Schools fail vulnerable children when they don't make fair provision for the majority because of the fact that parents will understandably be very tempted to break the rule.
Aside from the various serious child protection issues could it also be so the children aren't just performing to an audience of held up phones. Nothing I hate more than going to any kind of performance to sit behind a sea of blue screens. And the quality must be shite - especially if filmed 'illicitly'. I say go old skool and use your brain to remember special moments!
'And I just don't see how a video of fully clothed children would be satisfying viewing for a peadophile'
Rules don't work like that. They aren't issues with a caveat 'If you can't see no rhyme nor reason for this rule or don't agree with it, feel free to ignore'.
It's a shame you can't have a recording of the event, but other parents who stuck to the rules haven't one either. YAVVVU
Ok - let do the maths of Facebook. Average school size is 200 kids. So assume 200 sets of parental units. (Yes - kids have siblings but a lot of them also have parents who are no longer together so those kids will have two sets of proud parents.)
Average number of friends on FB? Maybe 100?
So that's 20,000 people who can see the photo. Obviously there will be overlaps and people abroad so let's cut that down to 10k different individuals. In the Uk there are maybe 45m people who are old enough and young enough to use FB. This group is pretty identical to those young enough or old enough to be a threat to a child.
10k / 45m = 0.022%.
Now in a child's life there is maybe 20 people who can recognise them instantly I'd say.
So probability that there is no overlap is (1 - 0.022%)^20 = 0.9956.
So probability of overlap is 1 - 0.9956 = 0.43%. Ie 1 in 228.
So for each child at risk that has a filmed nativity play with parents popping it on FB there is a 1 in 228 chance that a close family or friend could have the picture on their computer screen.
Ok - my numbers are not perfect as I've made enormous assumptions but I think I've shown that the risk is not so small as to be non existent.
"I think the rules are put in place as a knee-jerk response to media hysteria. I think they are put in place without being thought through. I think that schools believe that "erring on the side of caution" with a blanket ban will make it all okay.
For the small minority of serious child protection/identification cases which do exist (and which examples have been given on here) far more stringent and complex protection needs putting in place than banning every parent in the country from videoing school plays."
I suspect that what happens is that the school have asked permission. When they get a 100% 'yes, no problem - take photos' then they don't worry about banning it (which is why some people are on here saying 'My school don't have a problem with it'. That should probably mean 'There are no parents in my child's school/class who have objected, for whatever reason'.).
However, if a parent says on their form 'No photos' then the school may discuss options and one option is just to say No photos. It might not be the most imaginative one, but if they've taken it then there is almost certainly a child somewhere in there who can't have pics taken. Otherwise they wouldn't bother. And it will be just one aspect of the 'stringent and complex proetction measures' taken. An aspect which other parents seem to feel free to come along and over-ride.
You could say they only need to ban posting them on FB or other social networking sites. All you have to do is look back at the earlier stages on the thread where one poster proudly announced that not only would she take photos but she would continue to post them on the internet to see why this might not be the best solution.
The point is, you won't know as a parent if there are kids like this in the school - they don't walk round with labels. But it's more common than I think people realise.
I have worked with kids (at a visitor attraction) for over 10 years. I work with both school visits and holiday clubs. I came across at least four cases (either siblings or individual children) where foster parents told me certain information to help safeguard the kids (who could collect them, no pics allowed etc). And that's just where I was told. Around 25% of parents ticked 'no photos' on the form - we liked to take pics to help us promote future events and also use to illustrate any articles etc we might write so always asked. I have no idea what most of the reasons were, but this is just for a holiday club where kids spent a couple of hours a day.
People have also asked about kids appearing in newspapers etc. I don't know how other places handled it, but if we were going to have a reporter up, we checked in advance with the school. Sometimes it would be a yes, other times they'd pull us to one side and point out a child or children for whom the answer was no. We got 'no' for at least one kid in the class maybe 1/3 of the time. Then we'd work really hard to have that child elsewhere (without them realising it) while the photographer was around. So when you see a pic of a class on a day out somewhere, you can't assume that 'how come they can have their pics in the media when I can't even take a picture at the school play' because chances are, those kids aren't in the pic. It will have been organised.
Rules are put in place because there are children in very real and dangerous situation. If you've never been made aware of it, you're very lucky. So are the kids you know. It's not media hysteria. It's what a scary number of kids have to live with.
This has made for an interesting read.
DS's school have said no filming as they are going to record the dress rehearsal. Reasons given are that patents can watch without having to record it themselves and the sound quality will be better.
After reading this, I suspect it is to protect vulnerable children who won't be in the dress rehearsal but will be in the main shows.
I would also like to add that disobeying any school rule in such a blatent manner does undermine the school and the teachers and sets a very bad example.
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