to think gov's Youth Contract proves NMW too high

[takingbackmonday]

The gov is ploughing more money we dont have to 'tackle' youth unemployment by subsidising half of the minimum wage businesses pay new staff.

AIBU to consider this yet more proof that NMW should be either lowered or abolished. Business taxes should also be lowered. The economy's a mess. NMW is set to high.

[GypsyMoth]

Too high?

[DooinMeCleanin]

I guess you're not on NMW then?

[takingbackmonday]

I'm actually on less

[StealthPenguin]

You're on less than the minimum wage? Right

min·i·mums or min·i·ma (-m)
1a. The least possible quantity or degree.
1b. The lowest degree or amount reached or recorded; the lower limit of variation.

[DooinMeCleanin]

So you're not paying tax then? That's why the economy is fucked. It is illegal to owrk for less than NMW you know.

[Scarletbanner]

Minimum wage for apprentices is £2.50. Is that too high?

[GypsyMoth]

Are you under 18?

[WorraLiberty]

Yeah I'm with you OP

Let's abolish everything and just pay them with a bowl of gruel

[mollschambers]

Too high?

Erm, no.

And I think big businesses should be taxed more.

[MrsTwinks]

you realise NMW of £6.08 isnt for young people right? thats only OVER 25? Under 25's is arround £4 something IIRC. Its illegal to work for less, which means your employer isn't paying into taxes etc or he/she would have been discovered. I'd say illegal workers are more why the economy is fucked rather than NMW being too high. You try living on NMW in he southeast without benefits, where private rent could be your entire weeks wage.

[takingbackmonday]

No, not under 18. Writing a PhD with a scholarship that works out at under minimum wage.

Let the markets decide.


Businesses are taxed too much already.

[takingbackmonday]

I live in SW London. Yes, it's hard. You make sacrifices. I don't own a tv, don't smoke, have started shopping at Asda etc.

[GypsyMoth]

Asda??

[GypsyMoth]

So op, you are just a student then?

[takingbackmonday]

Yeah doctoral student. Working on libertarian economics.

I think it should be abolished. It's artificially high.

[mollschambers]

You've started shopping at Asda? Guffaw. The hardship....

Methinks OP is on the wind-up.....

[DooinMeCleanin]

Do you have two children to support? I do. I'm on NMW as is DH. Come back and tell us it's too low when you have a family to support and a mortgage to pay.

[SydSaid]

Not smoking is a sacrifice?

Shopping in Asda is a sacrifice?

It would seem that the reason you get less than minimum wage is that you are not, in fact, working.

YABR(idiculous) op. And U.

[MrsTwinks]

can I ask what uni, because if thats what you are coming out with I'd like to avoid it.

Have you tried living in the real world, no easy access to credit/student loans/student discounts on NMW. Paying TAX on your NMW, playing council tax. Really have fun with it when you do. Even Asda won't save you

[Bramshott]

But the NMW is lower for under-21s isn't it? So surely if the problem was that the minimum wage was too high, it would be over 21s who would be out of work as the businesses scrabble to employ the cheaper youngsters?

[DonInKillerHeels]

May I point out that PhD stipends are tax free?

My funded PhD students, with London weighting, are on 16K. Tax Free. I think that does, actually, work out above minimum wage.

[takingbackmonday]

Yes, I have.

And no, of course I will not say which uni!!

[HecateGoddessOfTheNight]

It is very difficult for the small business to afford staff. You need staff to grow, but before you can grow you need to employ people, but employing people takes you to the edge of bloody bankruptcy!

That is a real problem for the small business.

It is bloody expensive to have employees and there is no point pretending otherwise. It's not always affordable to have staff, even if by having them you would eventually grow and be able to afford them, iyswim. It would be good to have some recognition of that and some help for people who would like to employ people but simply can't afford it.

catch 22. need money to employ people need to employ people to grow business and make money need money from growth to afford to employ people to grow in the first place...

It's very difficult to jump that hurdle.

Also, the higher people's wages, the more expensive living becomes. Because the increased costs of employing people gets passed directly on to the consumer. So it becomes more expensive to live therefore wages need to go up therefore everything costs more therefore wages need to go up...

that's another catch22 and how the hell do you solve that one?

but people need to live. They need to eat and they need a roof over their heads and it's bloody hard to do that on minimum wage!

I wish I knew the answer. Wish I had a solution that would take all of the above into consideration. Because you can't look at one part of it. You have to see and understand how one part affects all others.

[takingbackmonday]

Don - private scholarship from the uni, not research councils. My university is also not in London so no weighting.


My point was not 'it's easy to live on NMW and raise a family etc so let's lower it' it was that surely if it was lower there would be more jobs available.