insulting religions

(990 Posts)
IneedAgoldenNickname Mon 07-Jan-13 00:39:04

Hi, I've never posted on this topic before, I tend to hang out in aibu, but don't want to start a bun fight!

So, I am a liberal Christian. I firmly believe that everyone had to right to believe (or not) whatever they want, provided that belief doesn't hurt anyone else.

Earlier today I posted a lighthearted status on Facebook, which had led to me being called mindless, stupid, stuck up, thinking I'm better than everyone else. I've been told God is a c**t (sorry I hate that word so much I won't type it) and that the Bible is only God for loo roll!

I'm just really angry that people think its ok to insult me/my religion like that, when I haven't once preached or insulted others.

Obviously the easy solution would be to delete them off of Facebook, but they are people I get on with other wise.

Don't really know the point of my post, just hoping id feel better writing it down. grin

IneedAgoldenNickname Mon 07-Jan-13 19:28:28

Thanks, I've heard of the science delusion, but not read it. I will look those books out, my vicar probably has copies I can borrow!

One of the people who was rude is my twat of an ex, I expect nothing less from him tbh, which is a shame as both our ds' believe. Incidentally, when we were together he agreed with my live and let live attitude, its only since we split that he's started being so offensive!

Smudging Mon 07-Jan-13 19:31:08

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

hiddenhome Mon 07-Jan-13 19:32:02

Thanks for the book recommendations niminypiminy. I'll look those up smile

Personally, I found that atheism had little to offer apart from an empty nihilistic feeling smile

hiddenhome Mon 07-Jan-13 19:37:00

I think if you examine the actual beliefs that the religions hold Smudging you'll find that the badness is not part of the belief, but rather politics or sometimes culture getting in the way. Man will find a way of creating divisions in whatever name, whether it's religion, communism, fascism, whatever. I have yet to come across a religion that promotes hatred and evil. Hitler hated the Jews, but if Judaism didn't exist, he'd have found something else to focus his hatred on.

firefly11 Mon 07-Jan-13 20:54:02

I believe other people's religious preferences should be respected. I have left several atheist groups on FB in the past because I didn't like the way it was commonplace and accepted to mock and insult religions and their followers. It was even more disturbing to see that when the odd atheist stands up and tried to talk sense about the jeering - in a "come on, why are we mocking ordinary people for their beliefs, surely we're all better than that" way- they get shot down very quickly by the other atheists doing the mocking, told to stop commenting or "take your moral highground/self righteousness out of this discussion", etc. And justify that "it's their prerogative to mock or insult if they like, because religion promotes child abuse, etc." And let's be clear. In many atheist forums, teaching a child that there is God and teaching them to pray equals child abuse. confused

niminypiminy Mon 07-Jan-13 22:26:11

Firefly, I believe you. I think the Internet promotes that kind of effulgent aggression - you see the same kind of thing (jeering and so on) in non-parent forums, indeed in all sorts of places on the interweb.

For the 'teaching a child to pray is child absuse' thing, I think Richard Dawkins is partly to blame, with absurd 'no such thing as a Christian child' nostrum.

NicholasTeakozy Mon 07-Jan-13 22:46:17

I honestly don't understand why any sane woman would be a follower of any of the Abrahamic religions, given their obvious hatred of women.

Disclaimer: I am an atheist male who agrees with contraception and who tries to treat everybody equally.

Really, these people hate you. They will never allow you equality.

Sorry you were treated so rudely OP. I hope you don't think this is meant to be like that. This is me just being confused

hiddenhome Mon 07-Jan-13 23:03:11

Jesus didn't hate women.

IneedAgoldenNickname Mon 07-Jan-13 23:28:43

Jesus definitely didn't hate women confused and some women are revered within christianity (is revered the right word?)

Incidentally I'm as equal as any of the men at the church,( unless I want to become a bishop that is, which I don't)

I also agree with contraception, gay marriage, abortion etc. like I said I'm liberal! I even have children out of wedlock

confuddledDOTcom Tue 08-Jan-13 00:58:01

Winds me up to. A friend was over our house the other week and was going on about when he was at uni and his "born again friend" I made a comment about my mum (trying to subtly remind him who's house he was in) and he said "Yes, but my friend was a born again Christian" and I pointed out that both my granddads are/ were ministers (FCoE and Elim which is how I grew up) and he brushed if off again. A little later on I was talking to another friend who was there (who's from a Methodist family) and saying how I believe in faith over religion and personal beliefs and the first one was telling me to shut up!

I've had those status messages too. I had it on a thread on MN recently where I said that faith is personal and we don't have the right to dictate to other people, someone came back and told me to shut up that people with imaginary friends have no right to tell other people what to do...

I'm so fed up of people thinking it's acceptable to bash Christians! Not just what they say (which I can understand if you feel someone is dictating) but just because they're Christian.

deleted203 Tue 08-Jan-13 03:05:26

confuddled The comment about 'imaginary friends' is not even original. It is a quote from Yasser Arafat who declared that 'fighting a war over religion is like arguing over who's got the best imaginary friend'

That would be Yasser Arafat, Leader of the PLO, responsible for many acts of bombing and terrorism. He ammassed a personal fortune of $1.3 billion dollars despite shocking conditions in Palestine. He spend many years attacking the Israeli nations and in my view is hardly a man one would wish to quote as 'the definitive voice of sage wisdom'.......Try pointing this out to the poster and tell them that it's the very essence of hypocrisy. Despite his imaginary friends Yasser Arafat was a dictator with an appalling human rights record.

sashh Tue 08-Jan-13 05:50:33

I'm not upset as such, as in I'm not crying, more amazed that in this day and age its seen as ok to be so rude!

I'm sorry you are upset OP. However I am glad we live in a world where insulting religeon doesn't lead to people being tortured to death. We used to.

IneedAgoldenNickname Tue 08-Jan-13 06:20:26

Well I'd agree with that sashh! No one should die for their opinions on faith. Thank heavens we live in a more civilised society than our ancestors did.

niminypiminy Tue 08-Jan-13 09:53:23

Well, except, of course, if you happen to be a Christian in one of the countries where Christians are currently persecuted - for example Sudan, Iraq, Iran, Egypt - to name only some of the most well known examples. And a recent international survey reported levels of persecution of religious people rising around the world - most notably, and markedly, in the UK?

niminypiminy Tue 08-Jan-13 09:53:59

(Finger slipped - meant to have a full stop rather than question mark at the end of that.)

pictish Tue 08-Jan-13 10:04:20

It's like Simon Amstell said:

I don’t want to attack religious people. It feels like an unkind thing to do, it just feels too easy, like the battle’s already been won.
Really it just feels rude, like if you’re at a party and you get into a conversation and someone says "Oh I’m a Christian/Muslim/Jew" its very rude there to say, "Oh how ridiculous!"
I feel we have to treat people with kindness and love and respect, in the same way you would treat a child running around saying "I’m a helicopter!" and you can say "Good for you. We're all having fun. I'm a choo choo train."

grin

sieglinde Tue 08-Jan-13 10:04:49

yes, exactly what I was about to say, Niminy. Let's look at China, for example, where you can be a special sort of RC who isn't really RC; where thousands of actual RCs are in jail. I mention this because all your examples are intra-religious conflicts, and China shows why secularism can't resolve the 'problem' of religion in the way fondly imagined by our detractors.

and sashh, who are the 'we' you have in mind? Presumably not the Romans?

Tea, I'm not after equality in matters of religion in the way I would be in secular life. I'm not looking for promotion from God, or equal pay. He values me equally anyway. He values us all equally and also very individually. So what point are you actually trying to make?

saycheeeeeese Tue 08-Jan-13 10:12:31

The bible does mention dinosaurs grin

I dont know why people have to be so bitter about God and the fact that others find hope and strength believing in him, op I understand why you're hurt I would be too.

niminypiminy Tue 08-Jan-13 10:17:40

Pictish, that's a wonderful use of the passive-aggressive smiley. Also, you knew, really, when you quoted that piece, that under its veneer of niceness it was intended to be very insulting.

EllieArroway Tue 08-Jan-13 10:47:50

I think you need to make a distinction between people insulting you and people insulting your religion.

It is not the same thing.

I would and do happy insult religion (all of them). I consider it facile, divisive and based on ignorance and the world would be better off without it.

But that you have the right to your religion goes without question.

EllieArroway Tue 08-Jan-13 10:50:58

The bible does mention dinosaurs

No, it doesn't.

Oh....

grin

Nearly forgot.

saycheeeeeese Tue 08-Jan-13 10:53:34

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

saycheeeeeese Tue 08-Jan-13 10:53:48

*mighty

saycheeeeeese Tue 08-Jan-13 10:54:41

grin

Bloody phone

sieglinde Tue 08-Jan-13 10:57:42

Ellie, religions are made up of people, believers. Why would I not feel insulted if you insulted the RC church? I AM the RC church. This of course doesn't mean that I will agree with every other Catholic on every possible issue, but RC is who I am.

Let's try this composite of the posts above:

"I would and do happily insult humanism. I consider it abysmally ignorant and the refuge of ignorant people who can't be arsed to learn any history and think they are the pinnacle of evolution. The world would be better off without it. But that you have every right to your erroneous, bigoted opinions goes without question. Now, run away and play with your toy train, dear."

See? See why it doesn't work?

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