Mumsnet Talk

Yes HerRoyalNotness! I remembered something! (I'm known as Dopey in my family, which is why I'm celebrating...) It does seem worrying about the possibility of anti-English. Guess I couldn't pretend to be German or something? I'm glad that there's an English speaking part of the city, because although the DCs and DH are good at languages, and I am also fairly good, it's still quite daunting! Schooling is definitely food for thought, because at the moment the DCs go to a fairly good one (like I mentioned, it's international and allows them to do extra languages) and I'd like them to continue with that sort of standard. Private sounds too expensive for me, even if the company pay the 25-50% offered.

Is there any reason you wouldn't go to Boston, I was very impressed with it.

I know several families where the parents work in NYC and the family lives in Greenwich/Darien. The state schools are very good there and the lifestyle is pleasant, not too hectic. The trains are reasonably good for the commute. From our visits there it seemed to be very family oriented with plenty of facilities like parks and beaches.

One of my school friends lives in Alaska now, she says it's really great if you enjoy an outdoor lifestyle but it's rugged, the weather is harsh and you have to be organised and self-reliant in the winter, even in the cities. If you have any propensity to cabin fever then give it a miss because you will be fairly stuck indoors during the dark months.

Do you know much about the offices themselves? Are they big enough to have an opportunity to progress? Are they all quite multi-cultural or do they tend to be mostly locals?

One thing I would say, that caught some friends of ours by surprise, is that if you go to the US it doesn't matter how long you've held your UK license they will charge your insurance as though you are a brand new driver. Our friends were staggered at the cost of their insurance.

Vancover
Auckland
Lisbon
Adelaide

would be my list and in that order

I don't know why I didn't consider the USA, I just kinda skipped over it. NYC sounds good from what you say, and from what you say, Alaska will suit. We are quite an active family, I kayak quite a lot, as does the rest of my family, and we enjoy camping, being outdoors etc; I am a bit worried though, because I've never lived in a place with a chance to have cabin fever, I've lived in cities for most of my life, and there's always a chance to go out to the park or the shops, so though I'm okay on short trips when I'm stuck in a tent/room, I'm not sure how I'll deal with actually living like that.

The offices will allow progression for me, but DH not so much in anything but the larger places (most places in the USA would, as would Tel Aviv and Lisbon, possibly Toronto, and maybe some more, I'll have to check). However, promotion for him will mean a minute rise but less of what he enjoys, so he isn't currently keen to actually be promoted, although being in a place where we have the space so there's a possibility that he can be, if we need the money. The English company is quite international with a few people who stay in London for a week but live in France, and other employees who were relocated from other divisions.

The insurance thing sounds worrying bran. I don't drive much, DH normally doesn't, but depending where we live, we'll need to drive more. In England, would the same thing happen- an American who came over will be charged as a brand new driver, or with experience? Does anyone know what happens with other countries?

Thanks for the advice bran!

Interesting ivy. Lisbon is high on my list, as are places in Canada (so Vancouver) but I'm veering off the further away countries like NZ and Australia. Is the lifestlyle a lot better, or cheaper? Whenever I think about moving to Australia for instance, I know of some people who live in Sydney, but no one else, and no one really from NZ, so I'm sort of getting my views from their experience (not really clued up on moving overseas!).

Thanks for the reccommendations. A lot of people have recommended different countries but it's nice knowing what people think the best ones are, and in what order.

See I would live in NZ and be happy, but Australia would do my head in - sorry

I really like vancover and spent quite some time there and feel it has so much to offer

When we came to Canada we brought our English Insurance details with us, which helped with the premiums. We pay about CA$1200/year for a brand new GLK350 Merc (small suv type thing). We don't think that's excessive. From what I understand, insurance is a lot higher for instance, in Toronto. (anecdotal from a friend who moved there recently)

Re NZ, and I'm from there, it is a lovely, lovely country to grow up in, and I would love to move back with my DC. However, it is very far away from anywhere, it is quiet, a bit backward, and insular (IMO).

I would like to go back for a couple of years at least, for my 2 to spend time with their cousins and enjoy the life they do, but alas our company has no work there. The closest we could get would be Oz, I've lived there too, the major factor that puts me off, is not the Ozzies, but the arachnids!! <shudder> <buys big girl pants>

Again, far from UK, but if you're not close to your families, that may not matter as much. Great weather, it has a wonderful laid back vibe, friendly (Brisbane), beautiful beaches, close to Asia for holidays, a puddle jump to NZ for a bit of a look see. I'd probably give it another go, I've lived near Sydney, and 2 places in Queensland, and enjoyed all of them.

Australia - Melbourne is lovely and where we'd move if we did but when we looked into it . . .it is so very expensive in Australia now. Housing costs more, books food and clothes cost more. Only thing that doesn't is fuel. Lovely lifestyle but insular in the sense you have to fly. A long way to get anywhere. Good for a holiday but of decided it wasn't for us long term.

I'd still be tempted by Vancouver myself as I loved it. English speaking and lovely!

No problem. PM me if you have questions about Lisbon or Sydney.

You want an outdoors lifestyle?
Calgary.
I've just finished a grant application for $30k of canoe, kayak and paddle board eqt.

On the water, climbing, hiking in the summer, and skiing all winter. What's not to like?

<pointedly ignores whistler>

What an amazing offer!

You've had a lot of interesting answers.

2 more things spring to mind:

You should consider the possibility that one of you ( more likely you DH from what I read) might get to a point where lack of opportunities for professional/personal growth might enter into play.
7 years is a long time. So choose a place where you would have more plausible opportunities to change jobs easily within your industry or make a career change + not have to struggle with visas/residency.
Try and make sure you BOTH get a full working visa and not a work visa + dependent visa.

Once you've narrowed it down on purely practical terms (financial/education etc....), maybe have a chat with the kids? At 12, they should start having clearer aspirations, dreams etc.... and may help you tip the balance?

Good luck and keep us posted!

I get moving fever every few years, I would find it very, very hard to make a decision for such a move.

If you move to, say, Australia for 7 years with children the ages yours are then they will go right through secondary school and onto uni there. Their friends will be there and they will probably want to stay. So make sure you also would want to stay as it is a long way from the UK.

My DD is looking for work in Canada and I am v relieved as she was in Australia before, Canada seems much nearer.

Also NZ is lovely but not much work for your DCs when they leave uni.

USA, Canada or France I would say. But you need to visit and look at schools.
Canada and USA are both great places but the distances are huge so you need to check out where you plan to live, where are schools and be sure they are feasible distance-wise.

Gosh, that's very difficult, OP. You've got far too much choice.

I think I would consider the Dc's education, and your career prospects, and the cost of living. Those three issues would be at the forefront of my mind.

Your DCs are nearly 13, did you say? So they are in Y8 and just coming up to the stage where they get locked into one country's qualification system. If you want them to do GCSEs and A levels you'll need an International private school in most of your places. For instance, if you and they go through the US system then they'll graduate High School but not have UK qualifications, so it'll be a bit more complicated (though not impossible) to get into UK universities, if that's what they want to do.

Do check things out very thoroughly. For instance, I live in Malaysia at the moment and non-citizens are not allowed to attend government (ie state) schools, so expat DC here have to go private. I know that Malaysia isn't on your list. All I mean is don't assume anything that you take to be normal or obvious in the UK translates across to your new country.

People say Vancouver is great. Also that Australia is v expensive at the moment. Also that Dubai has a good expat scene (though cabin fever v likely there).

I would suggest Canada, If Canada, NZ and Australia are the top due to speaking English, then Canada is the closest. As an Aussie the standard of living is highest in Canada IMO

IIWY, wherever you decide to go, I'd find a school that offers the IB programme, our DD has been in the Brit system, IB, Brit, IB and is now, once again following the English curriculum.
Not sure how long we'll be here so I am a bit miffed with DH for accepting a job in a school that doesn't do the IB.
Anecdotal advice given to me by a Brazilian friend is avoid the country. According to her, children get kidnapped ridiculously frequently

If you're thinking British/EU Uni for your DCs stay in the EU.

If you want good bilingual schooling that has an IB option go for Paris or Lille. The other French cities will have bilingual schools or a European stream but they would then be locked into the bac.

I would be very tempted by Stockholm, although it is expensive, or Lisbon which is a lovely city.

If your DC weren't near Uni age I would be going further afield but EU residence means EU fees...

If you're thinking long term and get language classes then Sweden is a great option. There are international schools that teach most subjects through English and are free. A big plus would be free Uni - and not just free but financial support to go!
In Sweden the state provide language classes for immigrants for free too. Kids get extra support in their home language - again for free.
Swedish is a Germanic language so the German should help them pick it up. Sweden is cold and dark in winter and gets lots of snow but they Get fantastic summers and lots of people have summer cottages by the sea or lake that they move out to over the summer.
It is close by for visiting friends and family in the UK. Mortgage interest rates are low so as long as you have a 15% deposit housing is affordable - especially compared to London!

You need to research the reasons why your company may or may not keep on operating in any of the destinations on offer. And choose somewhere with a vibrant economy - you will have a much better family life.

Okay as someone has mentioned University, I'll point something out. Having been out of the UK for 7 years your DC will be charged Overseas fees for university. So it might be a good idea to go to a country where theUniversities are good (fortunately idiots somewhere like the US, you should qualify for the same benefits as home students there).

mummytime - if the OP's family stays within the EU, her children will only ever be charged home fees.

My brother and his family moved to Vancouver a few years back. It seems idyllic, particularly if you're outdoorsy people as there's just so much to do. My niece and nephew seem to be flourishing in the schools as well. The winters can be a but heavy but it's a city that's prepared for a bit of snow.

If it was me my first choice would be somewhere in Canada. There's always the French-soaking part if you want to feel you've definitely moved somewhere foreign

Certainly I'd choose Canada over the US at the moment. I think there are still going to be a lot of economic problems there. I've got friends who moved to NZ and that also seems fantastic but it's just too far for me.

Also, mummytime, even if you have been out of the UK for quite a while, if you can prove good connections to the UK eg house ownership, and a job to come back to, then even seven years is not too long.

My DS was out of the UK for two years and got home status once we provided all the information on passports and DH's contract etc. My friend's DD had been out of the UK for eight years and got home status because her parents could provide enough evidence of a connection to the UK (ie home ownership, plus temporary secondment, plus intention to return etc).

Oregon is a lovely State, quite liberal for the US with stunning countryside. Not too expensive either. Boston is a great city too with easy access to skiing in winter and lakes/beach in summer. The US obviously has great universities bit you pay a lot for them.

I would be drawn to the US but if I wanted to stay in EU then Starsbourg or Montpelier or Lisbon.