Frequency of feeds

[aliphil]

My 6 wk old DD will often feed for 45 minutes to an hour on one side and then 20-30 minutes on the other. Then she'll go anything from 2-4 hours without a feed. Is this normal? My ante-natal group met up yesterday and everyone else's babies seem to feed for shorter periods but more often.

Also, in the last couple of days she has started sucking really really hard, and it often hurts. Is this normal, or does it mean I'm not producing enough or something? She latches on well - I've got people to check that - but I keep being told it shouldn't hurt by now.

[aliphil]

It doesn't hurt like when she isn't latched on properly, more like when she tries to pull away without coming off - but she's tucked in close. I think I may have a blocked duct on one side, which I'm attacking with massage, hot flannels and ibuprofen, so I wondered if that would stop her getting enough or make it harder work for her.

Lansinoh is wonderful.

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

Are there any other signs that she may not be getting enough milk that is making you worried? Are you getting plenty of wet and dirty nappies? Is she bright and alert at times? From your post, I don't think supply is an issue though.

Personally I wouldn't leave a 6wo for more than 3 hours in the day without a feed but if your baby is happy and thriving I wouldn't worry too much .

[aliphil]

Yes to both wet/dirty nappies and alertness (currently kicking and cooing on DH's lap). When she goes over three hours it tends to be because she's been asleep - either at night or in the sling.

[mawbroon]

Does she match any of these symptoms here?

The pulling/slipping off thing coupled with the length of feeds and the hard suck make me wonder about tongue tie, also the blocked ducts.

What do you think?

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

That link has just made me cry mawbroon. I struggled so much with feeding DDS and asked for help from many people, none of whom were much use in the end. Really wish I'd known about MN then.

[mawbroon]

Sorry to hear that JiltedJohnsJulie , didn't meant to upset anybody.

Do you think your DDs might be tongue tied?

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

Oh I know that and don't worry about me. I think that's why I hang around here sometimes. It was so shit for me and the sleep deprivation nearly drove me insane. If I can stop just one person from having the same experience then I'd be happy.

[mawbroon]

All I seem to do just now is post about tongue tie.

DS2 is almost 7yo and we are dealing with the consequences of untreated tongue and lip ties.

That's why I am hanging round these parts too. Hopefully I can prevent others having to go through what ds is going through just now.

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

My DS is 8 and is having speech therapy. Are they the same sorts of problems your DS has?

[mawbroon]

No, funnily enough, everyone thinks of feeding and speech being the only things that tongue tie affects, but his speech has always been great and although we had problems feeding, he went on to feed for years!

His tongue tie also caused a high palate which has caused severe orthodontic problems, he is about to get braces to expand his palate and even up his jaw sizes. He also suffered sleep apnoea on and off (linked to high palate) and has trouble breathing through his nose and lots of ear trouble as the palate takes up the space needed for the nasal passages and eustacian tubes.

Linked to the tongue tie directly, he had allergy and intolerance, reflux and terrible bloating, dreadful sleep problems (didn't sleep through much til school), really fussy eating, erm there was more, but I can't remember off the top of my head.

Sorry for the highjack OP, but this is why I feel so strongly about proper checks for tongue tie.

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

Think you are the only person I've come across who has had similar problems but your poor DS. Mine doesn't have half of those problems but will need a brace and didn't sleep through until he was 5.

[mawbroon]

Is he tongue tied? If so, I would advise revision.

[mawbroon]

PM me if you like JJJ, rather than highjack aliphil's thread! Sorry aliphil!

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

Yes, sorry for the hijack aliphil, will back out now.

[aliphil]

No worries about hijacking, mawbroon and Julie! DD has some of the symptoms in mawbroon's link but not all. The paediatrician at the hospital and a La Leche League counsellor both said no tongue tie, but having read the stuff about it being hard to diagnose, how can I be sure they were right? The LLL woman did say the frenulum was very prominent but that it didn't seem to be causing her a problem - but then DD wasn't at all keen to open her mouth! Worried now ...

[mawbroon]

You can contact milk matters (they were who I linked to), they have a virtual service where they help to identify tongue tie. It would be a good starting place I think. And if there is a tongue tie, they can point you in the right direction for knowledgeable help.

[aliphil]

Thanks, I'll look into that. I might also print out the list of symptoms, mark the relevant ones and show it to the health visitor and GP at our check-ups next week - worth a try.

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

Think that is very wise aliphil. When I read mawbroons link last night I thought it said that not all tongued tied babies have all the symptoms but agree that milk matters virtual service could be a good thing to try. Have thought about it today and think DS might have had upper lip tie.

[mawbroon]

Lip ties rarely come on their own JiltedJohnsJulie. I have read that they are almost always accompanied by a tongue tie.

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

Where were you when I had DS?

[mawbroon]

Did you say he was 8? Where was I, hmm I was child free and blissfully unaware of the stress and heartache that tongue tie can bring!

I am so sorry you had such a bad time trying to breastfeed. The more I learn about tongue tie, the more I realise how lucky ds1 and I were that he managed to feed despite fairly restricted tongue and lip ties.

[aliphil]

I checked DD using the list and images here, and I think she does have a tongue tie. I think also a lip tie - I had this, not knowing what it was till now, until it was removed as part of an orthodontic op when I was 17 as they said it caused the gap between my front teeth. (DH thinks he might have it too but won't let me look!) It sounds like I should ask my mother if I had tongue tie - she's a doctor, she should know! - or possibly related feeding problems.

[JiltedJohnsJulie]

Sounds like it could be that then aliphil. DS also has a lovely big gap between his front teeth, which I really like. Just to offer a ray of hope, I went onto feed DS until he was 2.8 .

[mawbroon]

aliphil, as I said downthread, lip ties are usually accompanied by a tongue tie, so you probably have tt as well.

Where are you in the country? (you don't need to say of course) There is a clinic in Huddersfield where the dentist uses laser for tt revision and he does upper lips as well. We travelled a 480mile round trip to get ds1's tongue and lip done a couple of weeks back.