Mumsnet Talk

I just want to know what your school policy is on children who have soiled themselves? Particularly, nursery and reception. Do you have two people clean up, do you not clean up until parents are called, do you get the parents to come in or does something else happen? There was an incidence at a school that I did a days supply which made me deeply concerned - to cut a long story short a boy was left in his soiled clothes for over an hour because of child protection. I dont want to go into details because I dont want to be outed but surely the rights of the child to be in clean clothes and the lack of dignity is just as important?

ds has/had soiling problems and is always cleaned up and changed and I'm told when I pick him up at the end of the day.

Clean up as quickly as possible, either with two members of staff or an unlocked door policy and another adult in the area.

my ds occasionally does this, and hes been cleaned up and put in clean clothes.

I must add I am sad but not surprised at what you mention as we didn't send ds1 to the local preschool attached to the other school in the village because they said if he soiled they would leave him until I could come in to deal with it and he would have to wear pull ups not pants

same here indith, ds cleaned, changed and i get handed a bag of dirty clothes

No idea on official policy but children are always cleaned up, even my ds2 in yr 5 who had an accident as he was poorly was helped to clean up. It was done very discretely and with minimum fuss.

Unless the kids have bladder problems, why at that age are they still soiling themselves at school?

Schools do not really have a choice on this matter- they must act in loco parentis and carry out their duty of care.

Leaving a child to sit in excrement whilst a parent is called is a clear breach of this duty of care, and is negligent.

However, no teacher can be compelled to change a child- rather they can volunteer or direct a member of support staff to do so.

Any school with a policy of not changing children and calling parents are leaving themselves wide open to legal challenges.

Schools are also not allowed to discriminate/refuse admission to a child who regularly soils themselves.

Oh and when any of my reception age children did this they were cleaned up and changed and parents discreetly given bag of dirty clothes at home time.

In my ds2's case they called us but that was because he was poorly so we went and collected him, but he had still been helped to clean up wetc and given spare clothes.

ds2 has had lots of problem with soiling due to chronic constipation. He also has been in 2 different school during that time.

First one, they send him to the toilet with a change of clothes/pants and some wipes and told him to clean himself up. That put him off so much he never told anyone he had had an accident again. (think small toilet cubicle, dried on poo that doesn't want to clean up.) TA around to 'support'. He was in reception.

Second school, they just took him to the shower room, gave him a shower and then gave me a call to check if I was happy with it (I think they were concerned I wouldn't be happy about him being undressed etc...). I was delighted tbh as each time there has been an issue, it has meant ds hasn't stayed in dirty pants for longer than necessary. They told me at the end of the day if there has been any issue.
Have to say that from that first issue with soiling plus knowing that he has some health issues, they simply dealt with it as if it was a disability (It is actually recorded as such on his 'form').

Agree about the dignity issue and also on a health pov. Staying with dried on poo for a long time means very sore bottom (which can bleed if going on too often). Not nice.

It depends.

If it's a medical issue and happens often then we will change a child. Parental permission recorded, logs kept and signed, etc.

As a one off 'accident' then parent phoned and asked what they wish to happen - we are always guided by them.

Waynetta most kids at reception and nursery aged are prone to the occasional accident - either due to holding on too long due to shyness/excitement or not wanting to be left out - often 'accidents' are no more than not wiping properly as they are keen to get back to their friends, occasionally it might be more. Even toilet trained kids can have accidents - that's life I'm afraid.
Our school makes parents sign a consent form (one of many) at the beginning of the year to allow kids to be changed and it explains how they cope with it then.

Not a teacher but our dd has had a couple of accidents. Both times she's been cleaned up and we've been told, discretely, at pick up.

Oh ok, didn't know it was that common. I guess in very shy kids who maybe don't want to put their hand up to go to the loo it must be just something that happens.

Not even just shy kids but kids that are just busy, engrossed in what they are doing or just being in a new environment, being nervous about using school toilets etc. Any number of reasons.

And then obviously illness or health problems or a child having sn's, there is a whole raft of reasons children may wet or soil themselves.

In no way is Dd shy, she was just 4 at the time, she's an August baby so still quite young. I think a couple of accidents in a new environment at such a young age can be excused can't they? They weren't even full poos, she just did a little in her pants before making it to the loo. Anyway they don't have to put up their hand in our reception. They can go anytime they want.

are you genuinely interested in reasons why waynetta?
Im sure there are different reasons for different children, but in my sons case he has ASD and toilet training him has been a long slow process. He's nearly 6 now and still has accidents despite him being 'mostly' trained for the last 3 years.

We have this issue at our school. If it is a one off or occasional accident staff change the child. There are always 2 members of staff present.
However there is a child who continually soils himself on a daily basis. With only 3 members of staff and 36 other children to supervise and teach it puts the school in a difficult position. We will phone the child's parents if they are available, but as a mum I hate this and where possible I will change the child.

What tethersend said. Bladder and bowel control are directly referenced in the new EYFS, under Physical Development strand Health and Self-Care. Even the Early Learning Goal for the end of Reception states that it's expected that children are usually dry and clean during the day.

I teach nursery. I clean up poo and wee. I change nappies. I mop the floor. I have 26 very challenging children. If there were 2 of us changing a nappy there would only be 1 TA or sometimes nobody left with the other 25 going bananas.

I can't imagine deliberately leaving a 3 year old sitting in poo for any length of time.

My school asks parents to sign a permission form or changing. If permission is not given then the form clearly states that staff will take appropriate action and will change anyway if a parent or carer cannot immediately quickly get to the school to attend the child. All parents give permission unsurprisingly!

As a reception teacher, I've dealt with it a couple of times.

In that situation, I always try and take the view of the parent. Would they want their child sitting in their own poo for ages? No.

2 members of staff will then take the child to the disabled toilets near the front office, so there are other staff around. The door is closed enough to give the child some privacy, but left sufficiently ajar so that other staff can listen it as appropriate.

Not a teacher, but when my kids have had accidents (they are Y2 now), they have been cleaned up and changed. In nursery (attached to school) there was a nursery nurse who dealt with the children who had had accidents. In reception and up I think the teacher would provide clean clothes but not sure to what extent they helped. I remember my DS having an accident in Y1 just before I collected him at home time. The teacher had given him paper towels and tissue, a plastic bag and a spare set of clothes but left him to sort him self out in the toilet, so I went in to deal with him.

Wayneta, my Ds was still soiling in yr4.

Google encopresis. It's extremely common. And sadly, because it's so taboo to discuss soiling in any child above toddler age, it is not unusual for children who soil to be left in excrement for the remainder of the school day.

I've lost count of the number of times I went to school at pick up time to spot Ds at twenty paces in obvious discomfort, and then as he got closer, to smell him, then have to go home and literally shower and scrub him off, as the accident had been so long ago it was dried and crusted. But apparently 'no one noticed'. Mmmmmmmm. It's a good excuse for doing nothing, if not exactly believable.

Children who do this regularly need a care plan in place, with school naming the adults who will change them (and agreeing any extra remuneration necessary) and the school needs to be working in consultation with the family and doctor to agree a plan that will work towards future problems. The school nurse (yes, there is one. Ours was crapola and only available on the telephone as I don't think she ever went near the actual school) can usually be persuaded to help set one up.

It can take over 6 months to retrain a bowel in encopresis cases. And of course children with other sn are often not in the position to respond to treatment, or have other complicating neuropathies.

Why are they soiling themselves in nursery or reception? There could be a number of reasons... my dd was three and soiled herself because the she said she was waiting to tell the teacher she needed the toilet and the teacher was too busy. The teacher said she didn't need to ask but my dd always wanted to check first.

I think it's not unreasonable to think that a 3, 4 or 5 year old might have the odd accident at school. Starting school is very stressful and that could be a cause of accidents.