I have completely gone off Joules!

[higgle]

I have quite a few bits from Joules and often buy presents from the Cheltenham shop. I had an emailo yesterday asking me if I wanted to participate in a focus group and I thought it would be an opportunity to go along and tell them how nice some of their stuff is. I had a phone call back and they asked me if I was between 25 and 45 and when I said I was older than 45 they dsaid they didn't need my views !!!!!!!!!!! to add insult to injury they seemed to have forgotten they had called me and rang back and said exactly the same a second time. I'm afraid that as I've spent a few hundred pounds with them in the last six months (including nearly £90 on mugs) they have now lost a customer. I did think that being a "non person" through age kicked in at a slightly more advanced age than 46.

[Startail]

As a 45 yo YANBU at all

[Chandon]

Hahaha, they donot know whotheir customers are! ( lots of my 40-60 froends wear it. Have not seen a 25 year old in Joules ever)

Nutters

[travellingwilbury]

Maybe they already gave enough people in your age range ?

Being generous .

[travellingwilbury]

Gave -- have , stupid not bloody smart phone .

[higgle]

tw, that is the whole point - the only thing they want to know about you is how old you are - they have said they wanted a mix of people but they only define people by age. I have spoken to the lady who is doing the project and she said that they wanted people from different backgrounds and the "45" point was to ensure they got some people with young children! Why did they just not ask if you had any children?

[BIWI]

I'm a market researcher, and I think it sounds like you've got the wrong end of the stick, I'm afraid.

When we set up projects like this one, we have to fill quotas, which are usually defined by the parameters of a project. In this case, if it was group discussions, the project managers/clients will have decided specifically which age group/social class that they want to include in the groups. These will be determined by the specific nature of the project - i.e. some projects will focus on older consumers, some will focus on younger consumers, some may want to include teenagers, etc.

In each focus group there are 8 participants. The interviewer who contacted you will have been looking for her 8 people in that particular age range - once they are all recruited, then they no longer need any more.

What is likely to have happened to you, is one of two things.

Either the whole project was focused only on 25-45 year old consumers - something that often happens as they may be exploring something amongst a particular target group.

Or they were recruiting groups of 25-45 year olds, and 45-65 year olds - but have fulfilled the quotas for the older groups and were looking now to fill the quotas for the younger groups.

It's great that you wanted to take part, and unfortunate that they obviously fulfilled all their quotas before they finally managed to speak to you.

But that's all that is likely to have been going on - nothing more sinister than that!

[Charliefox]

I'm still reeling at £90 on mugs

[higgle]

No, BIWI, you perpetuate the myth! They want to do research, they want a mix of people, but the only basis on which they select is age. I might be 46 with 4 year old twins. I might be 18 and a real frump, or I might be 68 and really stylish ( though probably not if I got all my clothes from Joules) The point I am making is that on selecting "valued customers" on te basis of age you are making assumptions about them on that basis. Clearly discriminatory because they would never dream of saying "we have our quota of black people" or "we have our quota of muslins" but somehow it is OK to make assumptions about people on the basis of age. By the very act of assuming that people over 45 will have different purchasing patterns they are discriminating. Perhaps they think I shop at BonMarche the rest of the time, or that my Zimmer won't fit up their stairs.

[BIWI]

No, higgle, it isn't like that at all. The reason for grouping people into age groups is on the basis of group dynamics. When you are running a group of consumers, having them all of a similar age in one group makes it much easier, as they are more likely to share similar views. So for example, we would never mix an 18 year old with a 65 year old, as their lifestyles/aspirations are very likely to be hugely different.

You have no idea on this project (and neither do I, as it isn't anything to do with me ) how many other groups they were running, and therefore how many different age groups the project was covering off.

And, with respect, you have no idea what the other criteria were that they might have used to recruit you.

It is very, very unlikely that age would have been the only factor. Other things that they might have included could have been (off the top of my head):

• when you last shopped in Joules
  
• how much you spent on your last shop
  
• how far away you live from a particular branch of Joules
  
• where else you shop
  
• what your attitudes towards fashion are
  

etc

And, with the greatest of respect, they probably do have quantitative data telling them how much different types of consumers are worth to them.

I am not perpetuating any myth here - these are the facts about how market research projects are run. To say that it is discriminatory in any way is, frankly, rather silly.

The limits on the number of people included in any research project are always dictated by the number of places available - (usually) 8 people in one group, and most likely to be around 4-8 groups on any one project.

[higgle]

Well Joules have redeemed themselves by contacting me and explaining that they didn't actually commission the research themselves, the people are doing it for a retail group. They are very sorry to have offended me and are sending me a gift voucher, so I won't be having a strop and chucking all their stuff in the bin tonight!
They are speaking to the research people about their approach.

"You would never mix an 18 year old with a 65 yer old.....hugely different (!!!) I've been to quite a few concerts where there are people of all ages devoutly following the same band. It is very sad to see such views put forward. This might have been the case in the 1950's but not so much today.

[BIWI]

higgle - you know, I have worked in market research for over 30 years now. It's a bit insulting for you to start telling me that you know better than I do. You don't understand the process and nor are you prepared to listen to my explanation.

However, I am pleased that you are at least mollified by the financial reward.

[BIWI]

A couple of other points:

• they won't be speaking to the 'research people' about their approach; or at least not to get them to recruit group discussions in any other way, as this is the way that they are done.
  

• second, yes on occasion you might consider mixing an 18 year old with a 65 year old, where they share common interests, as in the example that you gave. However, usually it would be difficult to do that as their interests, aspirations, expectations, lifestages and financial situations (to give you just a few examples) are so very different. In a group discussion you are trying to encourage people to talk, bond and share - you are trying to create positive group dynamics where everyone feels comfortable with other members of the group.

[herecomesthsun]

48 with a 4 yo and 11 month old here. Not impressed either

[Fluffycloudland77]

They must be really nice mugs.

[AlwaysBizzy]

YABU to buy clothes from Joules..eurghhhhh..over priced, dowdy clothes for wannabe horsey\rugga bugga types

[redwellybluewelly]

BIWI is right in what she has said. I do surveys as part of academic research and demographics are key.

I was once rung by someone doing some market research for Anglia trains. I was the right age, the right distance from the station, used vouchers regularly but I had travelled by train in the last three-six months. They wanted people who hadn't, ppresumably so they could figure oit how to make them more regular travellers.

£90 on mugs. Easy. We've budgeted more to replace our awful tatty collection with Emma Bridgewater stoneware mugs!

[HanneHolm]

Joules is shit clothes for boring women. Hth

[dexter73]

You should get onto Joules HanneHolm. You would save them a lot of money on surveys!

[higgle]

It is lilke most other things, good in parts. The quality of the stripey tops is quite good. I'm afraid anyone who makes assumptions about me on the basis of my age is not going to be in my good books. I work fo ran orgganisation tha tpromotes the rights of a minority group and am trustee of another charity that does similar work, I wrote letters tackling discrimatory recruitment practices ( aged 11) before the original Equal Opportunities act and I'm genuinely saddened by comments that there would not be a good group dynamic in a group that included someone of 18 and someone of 65.

[HanneHolm]

you only need to look at hte people on here whingeing about HOllister to realise its ALL about age you loon!

[HanneHolm]

HIggle


i think you are well meaning but utterly deluded

off you trot to marks and spencer classic collection ;)