Ok, be gentle; where will this maths level place her?

(39 Posts)
Iamnotminterested Wed 17-Oct-12 17:02:16

DD's school will be setting them soon, think after half-term so beginning of November. There will be 3 abillity sets, plus a fourth for children who need a lot of support/SEN/ EAL etc. Where do people think a result of 4c would put her? Thankyou.

As others have said, I would work on instant recall of multiplication and division facts if she doesn't already have this. A short speed test a couple of times a week should be enough.

I think that practice is the way forward with Maths at this stage. She should know what topic she is doing at school, and the textbook will probably have some extra exercises she can do each week to consolidate those skills.

Make sure she feels able to ask if she doesn't 'get' something.

trinity0097 Fri 04-Jan-13 08:02:52

I think that some parents get far too hung up on what set their child is in and forget to stop and realise that your child has been put into that set for many valid educational reasons and you should not be upset by what label the set has, the school is doing what's best for the child. OK in a tiny fraction of cases a child ends up in the wrong set, but that's why they are not set in stone and child do move sets when teachers feel it is educationally beneficial for that particular child.

Magdalena45 Fri 04-Jan-13 00:15:04

Used to work in secondary schools, so would guess they've been placed in a middle set? But try not to worry whatever set it is., I've seen many kids from even the lowest set get A's at Gcse... And a number from the top who don't! Your dd will do well with a supportive parent; makes a big diff

oldpeculiar Thu 03-Jan-13 23:00:48

Does she know her multiplication and division facts instantly? That is very important.
I'd take her right back, and build up her confidence on basics.Not from a workbook, but with you and practical 'props' so she can see how it works and really understand.
Easy stuff, fun lots of your attention.

Iamnotminterested Thu 03-Jan-13 21:45:32

Trinity the second half of your post is helpful, so thanks, but do I really deserve the comments in the first paragraph? Yes I know she is below average at maths, and let's face it, if her years' cohort is made up of children of MNetters who are all level 5, natch, then God help her. Sorry for not doing big smiley smileys when I put that she is at a 4c but be honest, would you?

trinity0097 Thu 03-Jan-13 08:23:54

Why the sad face, you couldn't reallyk have expected anything else considering your child is below average in Maths! And from my experience of teaching Maths in KS2 and KS3, those children who get a 4c are usually really a good Level 3 who have been coached to get enough marks to just get into Level 4.

I would get copies of the CGP Levelled assessment books, the Level 4 one first, then try the Level 5 one. http://www.cgpbooks.co.uk/pages/productDetail.asp?book=ML4W22 I would also recommend doing 4 'sums' each day to get the methods secure, one each of addition, subtraction, multiplication & division, e.g. 345+569, 3450-1234, 23x76, 182 divided by 4 etc... If it takes a child longer than about 6min to do these 4 then they need lots of extra practice to get the methods secure (and probably need to learn their tables!)

noblegiraffe Wed 02-Jan-13 19:52:18

I would ask her teacher (the one who has taught her up till now) what her weaknesses are and how best to address them. If her numeracy is letting her down (times tables recall especially) then regular practice at home can help - websites like mangahigh have numeracy games for mental arithmetic. If it's more general, then hiring a maths tutor for an hour a week can make a big difference - ask the maths teacher what topics will be studied this term and the tutor can reinforce these. If she's near the top of the group then say to the teacher that she will be aiming to move up a set by the end of the year and how to best go about this.

Iamnotminterested Wed 02-Jan-13 18:56:58

An update , she is in group three :-( but reading between the lines one of the brighter ones in that set. What shall we do to go forward now? A frank discussion with her maths teacher first?.a tutor? Get some books/ subscribe to websites to help?? Bum.

annh Thu 18-Oct-12 20:52:49

I also don't understand why you want to know this now. What difference does is make now to guess where she might be set in November? Do you think that in the remaining few weeks you can somehow boost her performance so she is in a higher set? I could understand wanting to know from your dd which set she has ended up in but I just don't know why guessing at it now will help. Surely she will end up in the set with most other children who are at approximately the same level as her and the work will be tailored to suit that level of ability.

It's also fairly impossible to say which set she would be in without having an idea of what the general intake is. For what it's worth as an example, DS2 who got all level 5s in his SATS is in group 3 of 8 for maths in Yr 7 which is probably just about right for him. I know he was around about the middle in his primary class so the more able at maths from his primary school could almost fill a set on their own. On the other hand, at another school near us a level of 4c would certainly get your daughter into the second set.

TunaPastaBake Thu 18-Oct-12 19:26:41

I have a DS in Yr 7 and they will also be set after half term - whereas the other secondary school in out area does it in Yr8.

As long as they review the settings every half term I wouldn't worry too much about it - it is out of your hands at the moment.

youarewinning Thu 18-Oct-12 19:01:55

Depends on number of children, cohort etc. The 'expected' level at end of year 6 is 4b. Therefore your DD is slightly under the expected level.

Where she is placed will depend on how the cohort scored in the tests. But that isn't important - as Woffling said - what matters is that she reaches her full potential,

She sounds like she is doing fine though.

If its any consolation my DS is a whole level difference in literacy and maths - sometimes children just find something more difficult.

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar Thu 18-Oct-12 18:59:35

Why you want to know is a perfectly valid question.

I want ds to be in the right set for him, so yes I'll be interested in which set that is come Y8 (they don't set in Y7 at ds's school) because if it's top I'll be astonished and worried and if it's bottom I'll be surprised and worried.

bamboostalks Thu 18-Oct-12 18:53:55

I would say the lowest group or second lowest depending on school standard. If it is the lower, that is good because they will focus a lot of support into getting her through her GCSE or whatever will be there then at a C which is what is demanded now.

WofflingOn Thu 18-Oct-12 18:50:08

I just get tired of parents with less able children comparing their child with the rest of the cohort.
If she struggles with maths, needs a lot of support and is unsure of some of the basics, you should already know that. You should have been having those conversations with her Y6 teacher and finding out what she lacks, and working on how to support her.
She's a 4c, which is below the national average for Y6. Depending on the cohort she is moving up with, unless the majority are below the NA, then she will be in group 3 or 4. Where she will get encouragement, the correct pace, targeted work, support, scaffolding of her learning and assessments to identify and fill in the gaps. If the school she's going to know their job.
What does she find difficult about maths?

LilyBolero Thu 18-Oct-12 13:26:29

(That is at state comp btw)

LilyBolero Thu 18-Oct-12 13:26:16

Impossible to tell, depends on cohort. 4c is slightly below average (I HATE NC levels, for this reason, because it's horrible 'defining' where a child is, but the 'expected' level for the end of Y6 is 4b), so I would guess set 3 out of 4.

Having said that though, at ds' school, he is 2nd set, and achieved 5a at Y6, only missing L6 by maybe 3 or 4 marks, it's just a v bright year!

crazymum53 Thu 18-Oct-12 12:50:38

Would be Set 3 out of 4 at dds school too. But Sets 1 to 3 still do Higher tier Maths at GCSE and many get grade B at this level.
The support set would be for dcs who did not obtain level 4 at KS2.
Hope this cheers you up!

Iamnotminterested Thu 18-Oct-12 12:43:39

WofflingOn Why wouldn't I want to know?

And thanks very much for your first post, that's really cheered me up and set my mind at rest.

mnistooaddictive Thu 18-Oct-12 11:44:24

Depends hugely on the school but I would guess set 3 out of 4.

Moominmammacat Thu 18-Oct-12 08:57:25

Depends entirely on school. Oldest DS left primary with Level 5, went into set 6 of 9, got a B, higher tier, GCSE. Youngest scraped level 4, also went into set 6 of 9, scraped a C, much rejoicing.

WofflingOn Thu 18-Oct-12 07:51:25

Why do you want to know? The whole point of setting is so that the children can get appropriate support to make good progress from wherever they are.

WofflingOn Thu 18-Oct-12 07:49:00

In secondary?
Put it this way, I have a Y6 class and all bar a few of them arrived in class in September with levels of 4c and above in maths. They are looking at being 4a and above when they get to secondary, and around half or more will be a level 5b.

trinity0097 Thu 18-Oct-12 07:42:25

At my last state school a 4c would have put you in set 3 of 3 (we had two parallel half year groups). In the school I worked at previously it would have been Set 2 of 3.

TheFallenMadonna Wed 17-Oct-12 22:12:42

She'd be in the middle of our year 7s. Depends entirely in the school.

noblegiraffe Wed 17-Oct-12 22:06:29

It really depends on the school and intake. I know at least one child last year in Y7 who got a level 4 at KS2 and ended up in the bottom set, but my school has a high achieving intake. Even at my school usually it would be the set 3.

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