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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

DB being an arse, don't want to be family scapegoat any more

25 replies

inthesark · 16/04/2014 14:14

I'm going to try and keep this from becoming epic, but may or may not succeed...

When my father died a few years ago, we had a big family fall out after the funeral, which was ostensibly over my getting angry with DB's partner (she was pregnant, I was grieving, neither of us was right and it was only about what time supper should be). DB and my step-DB then basically cut me off for many months. Which was probably much more to do with me being family scapegoat (long long story) than what time dinner should have been.

Since then DB and I have managed to get along for the sake of the cousins seeing each other (we don't have a huge family). His partner doesn't tend to come to many of these meetings and I've seen her probably three times since the bust up, and she's not exactly been enthusiastic to see me on any of these.

I'm actually fine with this; I've semi-detached from the family and this suits me. Although I do get anxiety attacks in the run up to any family visits.

DB has recently come to stay. And has sent an email, which basically says, it is important that you come to stay with us. But this isn't because he wants to see us, but because it would be good for DNephew, who apparently thinks family is very important (he's three). There is nothing about liking to see me at all - which given that one thing I did learn from the bust up is that neither DB nor DSB like me very much - is kind of crucial.

This has brought me out in insomnia and fury. It's not about me, or wanting to see us, but all about the good of his son. It brings back so many memories of me being told that I was wrong, and my feelings don't matter and I have to do the right thing by the family. And also, how rude is it to tell someone what to do like that? Rather than saying, oh we really enjoyed seeing you, please do come to us.

So I don't want to do it. I'm very happy meeting them for the day, or for them to stay with us (it's usually just DB and DN then).

I also don't want to spend a weekend in a flat with someone who doesn't like me, the potential for disaster is enormous.

But if I say anything at all against it, I will be accused of raking up old stuff. So I have no idea what to do. But this time, I am not just going to roll over and take it - I feel as though something has shifted inside, and I'm reacting very strongly to people who are trying to do the same emotional pressure thing in my normal day to day life.

Except, I've never stood up for myself in this way (plenty of other ways) before, and I have no idea how to do it without being the one causing the row. What do I do now?

I have sent him an email, which basically boils down to (said more politely) there is a can of worms here, we can either carry on as we are or we can open it, you choose.

And sorry if this doesn't make much sense, I think I've confused myself in writing it.

OP posts:
onetiredfromthesugarhighmummy · 16/04/2014 14:57

Have you read the Stately Homes thread OP? Its for survivors of dysfunctional families.

I have no real experience but others will be here soon & well done for making that fundamental shift in your stance & also in your head.

Bump & best wishes :)

Nomama · 16/04/2014 15:20

You can only do what is best for you... and that sounds like more of what you are currently doing.

I love your email. It is adult, non blaming and places the ball firmly in his court - leaving you with the final say too Smile

If it all gets shouty you won't be the cause. To be honest, who cares if you are? I don't and I doubt anyone else here does.

Stay calm, good luck.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 16/04/2014 15:25

This is a good time for a response which seems to be enthusiastic on the surface but is vague & non-committal enough that it kicks the can a bit further down the road. 'We must organise something soon' ... for example.

inthesark · 16/04/2014 15:25

Thank you both. Smile I am actually welling up very slightly at the support, it really does help because this [insert swear word of choice] email has brought me out in emotional hives all over again and it's a waste of energy and time, frankly. Especially on a sunny day.

Yes, I have seen the Stately Homes thread, thank you but my problems are quite slight in comparison really.

And Nomama, I did also write the ranty cross email, but just didn't send it...

OP posts:
balia · 16/04/2014 15:29

Can you just be honest? Email him and say that whilst you understand his feelings about family you don't feel the same and therefore will not be facilitating this. It can't cause a row if you chose not to engage in it. He is responsible for his reaction, not you. Have you thought about counselling?

inthesark · 16/04/2014 16:53

balia - yes, I think that's a very good turn of phrase if he persists, thank you.

I did two and a half years of therapy, sometime ago, which was life changing. I also went to counselling for a short time when all of this row blew up as I genuinely thought I was losing my mind (I was also having a missed miscarriage at the same time). A part of me does want to go back, another part of me just doesn't want to start at the beginning and tell the whole story. Because I think I am over most of it, it's just that I sometimes still get flummoxed by what to do in the here and now.

OP posts:
magoria · 16/04/2014 17:39

Don't make me come and spank you!

No one's problems are slight. Your problems and the emotional damage it is having on you are just as important as anyone else's.

If these people don't really like you or treat you well just because they are 'family' is no reason to keep any contact with them.

Stick to a repeated response 'no I am not coming to stay for the weekend, that is not good for me. I am happy to meet on a Fri/Sat/what ever day you are free for lunch.'

You do not have to engage any further than this. Simply repeat over and over.

And do post on the stately homes thread. You can pour out as much or as little as you want there which can be theraputic if you don't want to rake the whole thing up.

yegodsandlittlefishes · 16/04/2014 17:49

Am partly marking my place so I reread the very good advice here (and to remind myself I am not alone in sibling shenanegans and associated anxiety - OP you are not alone either) and also to reiterate that setting boundaries of what is and isnt good for you is an excellent way forward. It feels horrible to have to do it at first, I know, but you are well on the way, keep it up.

inthesark · 16/04/2014 17:59

Thanks everyone. I feel much better now, you are all helping and writing down what I actually think has really cleared my head. And very well then magoria, I will come over to Stately Homes.

yegods - good to know that it's not just me then! I wish I could be cross rather than anxious, it would be a lot easier and I do hate losing the sleep,it makes everything worse. Do tell me what your siblings are up to if it helps.

OP posts:
yegodsandlittlefishes · 16/04/2014 19:35

Well, I've moved away and don't have much cause to meet up these days. It was all very difficult for a few weeks just recently but I haven't heard another peep since my sis gossiped abour my DD behind our backs and I told her she shouldn't have. I am happy for her to leave me be. Grin

inthesark · 18/04/2014 09:49

Yes, I think that's exactly where I had arrived at too, happy to be left be. Grin

It's just that my DB has decided to poke a great big stick into the situation...

OP posts:
inthesark · 25/04/2014 15:30

Argh, just had complete headfuck email back in which I don't know whether I am meant to explain myself or not.

And it's the anniversary of my dad's death. And I have to go and see my sodding stepmother tomorrow.

OP posts:
DPotter · 25/04/2014 15:49

Look I have no experience of this type of situation however a couple of things occur to me; re the recent email - my Dad used to say 'an unanswered letter, answers it's self' and even if you do want to answer you don't have to answer it immediately so leave it a while - a good while like a week - minimum. and second thing - why do you have to go and see the stepmum ? It's clear from just those few words that the relationship is poor. Could you call her and have a chat ? Sorry these comments may seem very naive and simplistic and I don't mean to patronise you or anything like that. I really do agree 100% with other comments that you should stick to what is good for you; scapegoats can do no right so you may as well please yourself, they'll be pissed off with you whatever you do. Take care

inthesark · 25/04/2014 17:18

Thank you. The answer is much appreciated, and your first point is good and true.

The catch with my stepmother is that she is - despite everything - a wonderful granny to my DD, and now that my father died is in fact the only reasonable engaged grandparent we have on offer. So we do have to go, but I might go for some long walks while we are there.

And I love your last line. I'll keep that thought.

OP posts:
yegodsandlittlefishes · 25/04/2014 17:42

I totally agree with DPotter, seems like very sound advice.
A week after the anniversary gives you time to respect the mwmory of your Dad and then move on to something else. By then the email may have answered itself, but until then you will not be in a frame of mind to discuss things.

Not sure about your stepmum and why you have to spend time with someone if it is stressful for you. Again, put her off for a while?

yegodsandlittlefishes · 25/04/2014 17:45

Xpost with you, op. See what you mean about stepmum, I have similar set up, lovely inlaws but can be very hard for me to rwlax with thwm as so different from what I was brought up with (which is a good thing, but I can't just be myself.)

PrincessBabyCat · 25/04/2014 20:34

His three year old thinks family is important so you should stay? Are you sure he's not just hiding behind his son because he wants to see you?

My brother told me before I gave birth that he would think my baby would be weird and wrinkly but he'd pretend she was cute to be polite. Come the hospital visit he was holding her and making baby talk to her and smiling for the camera (which he never does). Good job "pretending". He just doesn't want to admit to liking babies for whatever reason (probably because he doesn't want to babysit?).

Anyway... Does your brother just have a hard time showing affection for you? Or maybe he's nervous about being the first one to extend the hand?

Have you told HIM you were happy to see him at your house?

Anyway, I don't know your family history, I just have a snap shot. If it feels wrong, it probably is. Can you just talk to your brother and ask him why he can't just say he wants to see you? Or even find out if he really does?

SquidgeOps · 26/04/2014 00:31

I'm going through sth very similar right now with my DB and it's kicked up a hornet's nest as usual with my parents too. It has only dawned on me as I read your OP that I am a scapegoat for my family and have always been and it really helps to think of it like that.

Unlike you OP I tend to get angry rather than anxious, and I try to suppress it but it doesn't often work out that way.

I've seen my DB once in 2 years. We moved away for a while but things didn't work out and it was all a nightmare so we moved back again. I saw him for 20 minutes shortly after we moved back. He didn't once ask how we were (and what we went through was seriously stressful) - as usual just talked about himself for the entire time.

Fast forward to today. It's his wife's birthday. I had a card, but I hadn't posted it until this morning. I wrote "sorry this is late". But mid afternoon he texted me saying "have you forgotten someone's birthday?????". No "hi sis, how are you?" or anything else. In fact I have had a very bad back for a few days and haven't ventured out much so haven't been able to post it. He has no idea what's going on in anyone else's life because he never asks and he never thinks about anyone else. He can't have it both ways. He can't not bother to have any contact etc (we have invited them over a couple of times but they've said they are too busy to come) but then moan that a birthday card doesn't arrive on the actual birthday.

It's blown up into a row and no doubt I'm the bad guy because I refuse to put up with their BS. (Have posted my own thread today regards this).

Hang in there and stick to your guns.

AcrossthePond55 · 26/04/2014 01:06

So, a 3 year old thinks 'family is very important' and has said he 'wants you to stay with them'. A 3 year old? Not likely.

If you don't want to go & I certainly wouldn't want to be trapped in a flat with people who didn't like me, just politely say "no, thank you". You don't have to explain or open a 'can of worms'. They'll pick at you if you refuse to go & will probably pick you to death if you do.

But I do agree with going to see the SGM. Grandparents are very important & it's worth putting up with some nonsense if she loves your DD.

DeckSwabber · 26/04/2014 08:53

I'm the family scapegoat so I totally get where you are coming from. The usual pattern is to be vile to me and then blame me for my attitude.

My brother is full of helpful suggestions about how I can improve my relationship with him, which comes down to forgetting or forgiving all his rubbish and extremely damaging behaviour and wagging my tail in delight if he pays any attention to me. The latest one is that I should go to therapy with him.

Bonsoir · 26/04/2014 09:04

If you do not like your brother or sister, it is fine not to see them and to refuse invitations.

inthesark · 26/04/2014 09:19

Thank you everyone - am about to dash off to the land of no wifi so can't answer properly until I am back. But shall we set up Scapegoats anonymous?

OP posts:
DeckSwabber · 26/04/2014 09:20

Bonsoir I agree.

I'm currently putting quite a bit of effort into my mum, who I also have a difficult relationship with, because she has dementia and she needs support. I know I can't mend things with her now so I don't go near the emotional side but I want her to be as comfortable as she can be at what must be a frightening time.

My brother thinks I should be making the same effort with him. Errr.... no.

Joysmum · 26/04/2014 09:31

I would agree with him and that you'd like a relationship with your nephew too. That's why I'd tell him you'd be happy to have a relationship with your nephew by Skype, phone, email and in person when possible when he's old enough to express a wish to do so.

Bitofkipper · 26/04/2014 09:35

You are allowed to not get on with family. The day my brother told me that he was never speaking to me again was a very happy day for me.

I have nothing to do with any of my family, if something isn't working , why waste energy on it? I don't dread the phone ringing any more.

It's lovely. It's peaceful, and has been for years now.

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