Oxford - Wolvercote and Phil & Jim's

[Relph]

Does anyone have experience of either of these two schools? We've got a place for September at Wolvercote, which I'm pleases with as it seems a nice school, but our original first choice was Phil & Jim's, so I need to decide whether to go on the waiting list there. (If we got a place, we'd automatically lose the Wolvercote place with no consultation, so I need to decide now.)

So, my question is, does Phil and Jim's deserve it's great reputation? Are there negatives to it? Or should we just be glad we got Wolvercote and stick with it?

[poppy70]

Phil and Jims is an extremely academic school. I know of children who have been asked to leave pre year 6 because 'they may be better.elsewhere.' Basically they will put pressure on you to leave of your child doesn't make the mark. Don't. Know anything about Wolvercote.

[Bubbles71]

I don't have personal experience of either school but do know that Wolvercote Primary is a feeder school to the Cherwell School (rated as one of the best state secondary schools in the country) so children from there get priority over other catchment area children. For September 2015 admissions there were over 100 children within the Cherwell School catchment area who applied and missed out on a place - so it's an advantage worth considering.

[notquitegrownup2]

Yup, we know people with children at both. Both are feeders for Cherwell., both are lovely but yes, Phil and Jim's has a reputation of being very academic.

[Bubbles71]

Does going to Phil & Jim's actually bump you up the admissions list notquitegrownup2? I was aware that Wolvercote and Cutteslowe schools did but hadn't realised about Phil & Jim's too. Those of us with kids at other primary schools are getting slowly pushed down the list....

[poppy70]

Cherwell isn't the only game in town. Spires is a lovely.school. Cherwell is just famous.

[Relph]

Thanks for the replies.

As far as I'm aware from reading the Cherwell admissions criteria, only Wolvercote and Cutteslowe attendance give you priority on admissions, with Cutteslowe a higher category than Wolvercote.

[roguedad]

Don't regard either as a guarantee for Cherwell. It's massively over-subbed - I seem to recall there were roughly 200 this year who wanted it but were disappointed.

[notquitegrownup2]

Yes, you are right, I think, Wolvercote has priority over Phil and Jims for entry to Cherwell. Friends say that there was something in the admissions criteria about Wolvercote having a special priority arrangement.

[teacherwith2kids]

Quick Google reveals that for 2015 / 16 (remember that there could be LOTS of changes before a child now going into reception is ready for secondary, so nothing is guaranteed):
cherwell.oxon.sch.uk/perch/resources/thecherwellschool.pdf

It appears somewhat bizarre, in sorting out who gets priority amongst those living in catchment area:

Within the catchment area priority, PUPILS at Cuttesloe and THOSE WHO LIVE IN THE CATCHMENT (DESIGNATED) AREA for Wolvercote get equal first priority, then siblings, then others by distance.

So if the OP lives in Wolvercote catchment area, but ends up going to Phil and Jim's, they get priority. However if they live OUTSIDE the Wolvercote catcghment, but go to Wolvercote, they get no priority. Whereas if they go to Cuttesloe they get priority, regardless of whether they are in the catchment of another school, provided always that they remain within the Cherwell catchment and are one of the closer ones....

I would say definitely not something to make your choice of primary on, it looks like the kind of admissions criteria document that might well change over time...

[teacherwith2kids]

Apologies for mis-spelling of Cutteslowe. It is also worth noting that only pupils who attend Cutteslowe and live in Cherwell catchment get priority, those who attend the school but live outside the Cherwell catchment do not.

[SunsetGirl]

I would be surprised if anything of what Poppy says is true. I used to work there several years ago and none of the lower ability children left before year 6.

Also she is talking bollocks about Spires. I hear terrible things about it.

According to a teacher friend (from Cheney) the main difference at Cherwell is the catchment/intake - a lot of students with educated/motivated parents, and a very small percentage from disadvantaged backgrounds.

[Relph]

Thanks teacherwith2kids, I'd misread the criteria. We're not in Wolvercote catchment so wouldn't get priority for Cherwell. I wonder if it was set up that way as an incentive attract parents to apply for Cutteslowe. It was in special measures a while back so maybe has a low intake.

And thank you SunsetGirl, I agree, I find it hard to believe that children would be asked to leave like that, was taking with a pinch of salt!

[poppy70]

Spent a large amount of time at Spires and Cherwell. Spires was lovely. Cherwell was lovely too but you need to get into the top sets. Beyond 3 the kids were a little crazy. My friends sister went to Phil and Jims and also Cherwell. The children weren't asked to leave it was all subtle obviously but a few did go before Year 6. The school has very good results.

[mrz]

I don't know either school but dashboard data doesn't suggest there is any selection prior the national curriculum testing.

[poppy70]

And not all Cherwell intake are like that. They have a fair amount of behavioural issues they are just good at hiding it. In contrast I saw no behaviour issues whatsoever in Spires. No doubt they happen but not in the weeks I was there. You know Cheney is the only public secondary I have never set foot in and I hear bad things about that school. You know nothing until you actuallu spend time there. P and Js mau noy do it anymore and of course children arent askes to leave so bluntly. A lot of top performing schools have odd ways of ending up with their top performers.

[poppy70]

There is always movemen. A lot of schools have their cream cropped off at the end of Key Stage 2. I have no idea how successful they were/are with the suggesting. I only know what former students have told me. For whats its worth. I have never been there.

[poppy70]

Key stage 1

[TheBuskersDog]

I can't believe that any parent in Cherwell catchment would choose Spires over it. Obviously can't speak for all lessons but my son never had lessons disrupted by bad behaviour.

[poppy70]

Didn't say they did. No one in Oxford would choose any school (state) above Cherwell. Set 3 down and you will.

[SunsetGirl]

Axe to grind?

Anyways, yes, there was a lot of movement in and out of P&J. Lots of movement out to private schools (around yr4) but movement in from them too. Lots of children of academics who only came for a year or two.

[AmberTheCat]

I have friends with children at both Wolvercote and Phil & Jim's, but don't have direct experience of either. P&J's is bigger and seems more academic/pushy, Wolvercote is smaller and has more of a village school feel. Most kids do well at both.

The oddities in the Cherwell admissions are because a) it's quite tricky to get to any other sec schools from the Wolvercote area, hence prioritising children in that area at their most local school (Cherwell), and b) Cherwell and Cutteslowe are part of the same multi-academy trust, hence children at Cutteslowe school having priority over other local schools. Things are changing fast, though, and I suspect the school landscape will be very different by the time you're applying to sec school, so I wouldn't even attempt to second guess that when choosing a primary.

[dietcokeisgreat]

Wolvercote and phil and jims are both great primary schools. Latter probably has the academic edge but last ofsted was 'good' ( whatever that might mean!). I would be happy with either.

Baffled by spires v cherwell thoughts. Depends on your priority for the school i suppose, but this is a crude way of looking at it.
2014 spires 58% 5 a-c at gcse
Cherwell 72%
Oxford academy 28%
Cheney 58%
Very very different intakes in these places of course!

[teacherwith2kids]

Cherwell School (rated as one of the best state secondary schools in the country)
72% 5A to C seems rather low for the above claim? Local comp is 10%+ above that for 5A to C including English and Maths, 20%+ more if E+M are not included. And of course selective schools do better still?

[teacherwith2kids]

(No direct knowledge of Oxford secondaries, just interested in the 'perception' of a well-regarded local secondary vs its actual stats)

[poppy70]

Cherwell is hugh. 2, 000 pupils across two sites and they have a massively, or have had, diverse intake. It isn't all children of academics although there are a few. Spires and oxford academy tend to have very seprived intake. Cheney slightly better. Oxford is actually quite a deprived place and there are many private schools. Cherwell is a good school and the top sets do very well.