5 yr old girl "snatched" in Wales

(535 Posts)
mumblechum1 Tue 02-Oct-12 04:38:29

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-19795761

Let's all keep our eyes peeled sad

DuelingFanjo Wed 10-Oct-12 12:57:15

Ah right - I wasn't sure it had been clarified. Just pointing out that now he has appeared in court (via link) the charges are more clear so there is no confusion between the google and legal definitions.

scaevola Wed 10-Oct-12 12:49:42

According to the BBC, MB has now appeared in Crown Court by video link and has been remanded in custody. Next appearance is 11 January for plea and case management hearing.

Sadly, still no news in the search for April.

NanaNina Wed 10-Oct-12 12:18:21

This has been discussed and clarified up thread DF

DuelingFanjo Wed 10-Oct-12 12:07:41

The BBC are saying "Mr Bridger, from Machynlleth, is also charged with attempting to pervert the course of justice. The latter charge refers to the unlawful disposal and concealment of a body."

so this is not to do with him trying to blame another person or head the police off in the wrong direction? Just that theybelieve he has hidden the body.

Tryingtothinkofnewsnazzyname Wed 10-Oct-12 11:03:30

I like the password idea but as Greythorne says, it only really works above a certain age. My DS runs and tells someone anything we say is a 'secret' at the moment (it's quite sweet as he whispers to them that it's a secret, but still... ) There really is no easy way to deal with all this.

MrsSalvoMontalbano Wed 10-Oct-12 10:55:55

Agree about the family passowrd. We have one.

The main site is American but lots of UK martial arts clubs do it.

I've just looked on the Coventry one and they are still doing the things I said about.
I remember dd being told about going with people we know too.

BigWitchLegsInWailyTights Wed 10-Oct-12 10:29:13

That sounds good....there's a local one which is a family one...DH was thinking about going with the DDs as you can then all train together. Seemed like a good bonding thing. I will google Lil Dragons thanks!

If your thinking about martial arts try and find one with a lil dragons program as they do special badges where they do stranger danger, beat the bullies, fire safety, safety around water and how to call 999. Certainly they used to.

Thats a brilliant idea Bigwitch my girls would probably enjoy martial arts, good excercise and learning to protect themselves at the same time!

BigWitchLegsInWailyTights Wed 10-Oct-12 09:55:35

I think possibly, it may be good to use martial arts Fanjo if we can't iradicate the possibiity, we can at least help children to defend themselves. Martial arts are good for confidence too....I am looking into it for my two DDs I think.

DuelingFanjo Wed 10-Oct-12 09:47:08

I was watching Peppa Pig this morning and Peppa Pig went off with the postman to help deliver the mail. There was no password used.

How do people propose that we protect our children when popular children's tv programmes are making it look like it's ok to hop into mrs rabbit's train all the time? I am being flippant of course but clearly 'stranger danger' is pointless when most abuse happens with people that children already know.

Greythorne Wed 10-Oct-12 06:02:15

Do you know what? There really is no easy answer. I read that passwords can work, but not fir younger children who apparently have a tendancy to blurt out, 'But you haven't said the word 'banana' yet!' or ''my mummy says I can only cone with you if you say the word 'banana''.

The truth is, we can equip children in any foolproof way against manipulative, adult criminals who will use every trick in the book, all the way to brute force where necessary.

Luckily, I suppose, the criminal evil-doers are few and far between. Small comfort.

ThingsThatGoBumpInTheNight Wed 10-Oct-12 03:32:14

Family passwords are a great idea, changed after they actually have to be used, i use that system..

And well done you for being sensible as such a young child x

BoffinMum Tue 09-Oct-12 22:29:05

When I was at primary school a colleague of my dad's came to pick me up because there had been a family emergency. I completely refused to get in the car. I said something like, "Nope, I have heard about this sort of thing, and I am not getting in your car until I hear from my parents". The bloke burst out laughing, and had to radio my dad (they were both engineers). I then proceeded to interrogate my dad to make sure it really was him, and then he gave me permission to get in the car. Very reluctantly, I complied, and everything was OK. I was praised when I got home for being so cautious, but then my dad came up with the idea of having a family password so that we could tell if someone was coming with a real family message or not. Perhaps that's worth everyone considering?

MarthasHarbour Tue 09-Oct-12 22:15:31

I apologise too - i feel so strongly about this case that i want it to be resolved quickly. I got caught up in what it could be or couldnt be and ended up picking your post apart blush

I just cant bear to think what Aprils family are going through. I am telling DS when he is old enough to always check with me - even if it is a close family friend offering a lift.

I am hugging him so tightly at the moment it is heartbreaking.

Greythorne Tue 09-Oct-12 20:46:07

I apologize if I got the wring end of the stick re 'perverting the course of justice'.

I have heard it used in the context - admittedly a million miles from this - about a married couple who lied about who was driving when they jumped a red light to avoid one of them getting so many points they would be disqualified. Obviously, the original misdemeanor is incredibly minor but lying to police and trying to get the wrong person convicted is absolutely major....even when it's a driving offense.

I assumed in this case it meant something similar.

Apologies.

BigWitchLegsInWailyTights Tue 09-Oct-12 20:40:43

I don't want to talk about why he did it...it's obvious and doesn't bear thinking about.

NanaNina & Boffinmum - I know what you mean, I also feel the same. It is inexplicable and I feel there must be an explanation - I need to understand how & why this has happened.

I am also uncomfortable with the things that are being said as we have no idea about what has happened or why - and until things become public knowledge I don't think we should be voicing those kinds of opinions about anyone in connection with this case.

I just know how sick I feel for April and her parents.

BigWitchLegsInWailyTights Tue 09-Oct-12 20:30:06

That's your DD...mine has arangements that can sometimes change at the last minute and I have noticed that her school will just let the DC out with another parent...say it's a parent who has taken them home before but by arrangement...then they will just allow a child to repeat this....not that this has happened with my DD but in theory it COULD....

I have collected her friends a few times as has my DH....not long ago, DH was asked last minute to pick the same girls up...he did...assuming the school were informed. He thought he'd better mention it to the teacher who said something like "Oh no it''s fine...we know she's been home with you before."

They had not been called by the girls parents. This is a small, rural school.

Portofino Tue 09-Oct-12 19:48:33

No - that's why you need to STRESS about always checking. No matter who it is. Dd knows that only dh or I will collect from school unless there is a prior arrangement that she KNOWS about and is written in her class book. I told her that in an emergency, someone would ring the school first. And she must always check - even if it a friend's parent who she knows.

BigWitchLegsInWailyTights Tue 09-Oct-12 19:37:13

The thing that's worrying, is that say someone they know very well asks them to get in their car. A person they are very familiar with...have a lot of contact with...and the child says no....and the person then says "Ah don't be daft...your Mum told me to pick you up."

Not many children would have the balls to continue to refuse. This is why I am considering a mobile phone for my DD aged 8.

Portofino Tue 09-Oct-12 19:34:29

My dd plays outside with her friends. We have had a LONG chat about this. It is not about strangers, it is about don.t go anywhere with anyone without checking first. My nextdoor neighbours often take all the kids out on a bike ride of a weekend. The same rules apply.

I think we need be very careful on here about discussing what MB may or may not have done. Due to strength of feeling they are likely to move any future trial somewhere else. Who knows who might get called up for Jury service...? And I would not wish such a thing on anyone...

Northernlurkerisbehindyouboo Tue 09-Oct-12 19:11:47

I wish they could find her. It could go on for years not having her back, always wondering where she was. I don't know how you keep on going with that on your heart.

On Saturday two little boys from down the street were playing out on their bikes. Their dad sat outside watching them whilst reading a paper. I have NEVER seen him do that before. The street is quiet, they were in sight of their home - but still he was doing something out of the ordinary for him and I can guess why. On Sunday dd3 was playing in the front garden of our friend's house. Big hedge, it's not really visible from the road and I could see her from inside the house. I stressed about 20 times that she was to stay there, not leave the garden no matter what etc, etc. I am a very laidback parent and I know how rare an event this was - but it's still freaked me out and changed my behaviour, at least for now.

NanaNina Tue 09-Oct-12 19:06:06

I have just googled "perverting the course of justice" and here is the result: "The course of justice including the police investigation of a possible crime. A false allegation which risks the arrest or wrongful arrest of an innocent person is enough. Pervert also means "alter" and any act that interfers with an investigation or causes it to head in the wrong direction may tend to pervert the course of justice. The Prosecution has to prove that there is a possibility that whatever the suspect has done might lead to a wrongful consequence, such as the arrest of an innocent party."

Martha I note from your post that the BBC website states that the perverting the course of justice relates to the unlawful and concealment of a body. If that is the case then so be it.

I was a member of a Jury when the charge against the defendent was "perverting the course of justice" and the allegation was that he had interfered with a witness in a criminal case. He was found not guilty.

The other time I have heard of this phrase is a woman I was involved with (through my work) whose daughter was driving a car when she purposely drove the car at an enemy and damaged the person. The mother told the police that it was someone else who was driving the car and not her daughter. She was found guilty.

These seem to fit with the google explanation. The trouble is with legal definitions is that they are complex and not always able to be understood by those of us who are not legal professionals.

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