Palvik Harness questions.....advice appreciated

[Beanigan]

Hi,
My 5 week DD had DDH in both hips and is being put into a Palvik harness next week (6 weeks old). I'm worried about a couple of things so hope someone can help me.

We've not had any advice at all on the harness and have been told that everything will be explained to us next week - however I need to know some things up front (practical questions really).

1. Will she still fit in the moses basket or do I need to set up her Cotbed asap?
2. Will she still fit in her car seat? I have a Maxi Cosi Cabrio (which my DS used) and am worried she won't fit in it and I won't be able to get her home from the hospital.
3. How do clothes work? particularly the bottoms? Will long socks and dresses work?
4. We're meant to be going away the day after she's put in her harness (booked for ages) - I've heard she may take a few days to get used to it - do you think we should cancel our trip? (especially as we'll all be sleeping in the same room with DS also)

Thanks in advance!

my DD was in a harness from 3 weeks and it was fine.
Maxicosi ok as was mosses basket
was summer so no bottoms required. she just wore tops and socks!!
I wouldn't cancel any trips cos of it.
everything will go fine.

DD1 was in a Pavliks for months. Moses basket and car seat were fine, as was pushchair as she got older.

In terms of clothes - it was the middle of winter. I found that babygros were fine. Dresses and bigger tights were useful as she got older, although have since discovered babylegs and I might have used them.

I wouldn't cancel a trip either. She will get used to it quickly.

Is there anything else we can help with? Are you breastfeeding? It takes a bit of adjustment to get comfy if I remember correctly.

If you ware worried about cold legs, look at buying some legwarmers here and here. they will also last a long time and great for toddlerhood when you do potty training.

I am buying the plain ones for dd1 now 5 to use instead of tights at school and nursery because she complains that tights makes her eczema itch.

I also recommend looking at wrap slings and mei tais to carry her around in as they position her body ergonomically when she is not in the Pavlik harness. An orthopaedic doctor saw me using one with my new born not so long ago in the waiting room at the hospital once and he commented as he walked by that that (wrap sling) was the best way to carry a small baby.

Oh, yeah - forgot about that. I second the sling suggestion - as DD got a bit older she sat beautifully on my hip in the sling.

Her consultant was also pleased that she was in cloth nappies. The extra bulk apparently contributes to hips being held in correct position.

this link has good info and pictures of how a wrap sling positions a baby properly throughout the day

this one has more good images and info about spinal development in the first year.

Dr. Evelin Kirkilionis did a lot of research in babywearing and hip and spine development so a google of that name may bring up more information.

Sorry for the delay!
Thank you so much for your messages - they are so helpful.
Yes I am breastfeeding so that's another concern of mine. The BF counsellor told me to express enough for a bottle for Friday just in case we're in the hospital and I'm struggling to feed her. But I did think well that doesn't help the rest of the day when I need to feed her so I though I'd just battle on and figured if she was hungry enough she'll find a position soon enough.

How did you feed out and about though as lots of hints mention lying down to feed? Also I have a Baby Bjorn carrier - is this ok to carry her? Great news about the car seat as we were worried about the additional expense of buying a new one.

I really had no problems breastfeeding although it must be said that DD1 was tiny (10lbs at 4months) so not sure whether that helped. I think I held her with lying on her back at first and she just turned her head to feed. I got so used to it that I found feeding DD2 a bit weird when she got bigger.

Out and about I just fed her as normal but we didn't seem to have any problems with "outside feeding"; she wasn't wriggly or easily distracted.

Not sure about the carrier, I had a wrap-type sling.

Just to warn you - DD screamed like billy-o when the harness was put on but then she's always been a bit forthright .

Are you prepared to be told that you won't be able to bath her? Depends on your consultant. We got to take her out of it twice a week for an hour so we could bath her but I do know of others who simply weren't allowed to do it.

Yes they told us to bath her before the appointment so aware of that. Such a shame as she loves her baths. I'm actually feeling ok about her hips overall as of all things that can go wrong this is small beans, it was caught early and is totally fixable. I just want to mAke sure we know what to expect. Thanks again for your help, I love the leg warmers idea!

A BabyBjorn type sling is a bad idea. Babies should not be put in slings facing outwards. It puts their spines in an unnatural position creating pressure points in the spine where they should not exist. see the link from the Storchenweige website.

They also make their legs dangle, doing the opposite of what the Pavlik harness is trying to achieve. that is, keep the hips in a frog-like position which natural position for newborns. see the link to the didymos website.

I should say don't bother expressing milk for a feed. A breastfeeding counsellor with accreditation from one of the 4 recognised training organisations in the UK would not recommend this. what you can do is experiment from now with feeding her in a biological nurturing position. This is a more upright position which will allow your baby to stay in the harness while feeding. From the slide show, the position you will try to achieve is slide 8 (with clothes on) and slide 20 (the gorilla mum one ).

Sorry to come across all school marm-ish but is a bugbear one for me. a lot of people even in the health fields are called breast feeding 'counsellors' when in fact they have had very little training in breastfeeding itself, about 3 or 4 days worth.

Of course, as robino describes, lying down in bed is fantastic for feeding. Once you have had a practice at home you can adapt it to feeding in public (or at least at first in the hospital) too.

I was able to feed my 4month old in a wrap like this while standing up in a very busy park. It was in the UAE where women are expected to cover up. Many people walked by without noticing but eventually a woman standing nearby did notice and I could see she told her friends who all had a look and they all gave me knowing smiles of approval.

Hi Beanigan my DD was in a pavlik for 3 months when she was 12 weeks old. I have to say we were told to avoid car seats as much as possible although she would fit in, it squashed her legs together. But maybe different hospitals different policies. We weren't allowed to bath her ourselves but took her up to the hospital once a week for a bath which she loved. She was a bit upset when she was first put into it but settled down within about 24-48 hours and she was a bit older than your DD so had had more time to get used to being free beforehand. After that initial period it didn't bother her at all. It was summer so she just wore loose dresses and size too big babygros at night. She was never cold. And I breastfed using a "My Brest Friend" pillow (google it if you are interested). I had one already as I have back problems but it was brilliant for feeding in a harness as she could just lie flat on it and turn her head towards me. I would give a thumbs down to the baby bjorn though - I agree with the other poster that it wouldn't hold your DD in a good position. Good luck. You sound very calm about it and you are right - it has been caught early which is great and the harness itself will be absolutely fine. You'll get used to it very quickly. When my DD came out at 6 months she felt all strange and floppy!

thanks Dr Cosy, Robino & Foxytocin.... I must say I was a bit stunned the NHS BF counsellor recommended I express but she has also offered to come and see me at home the same day in case we're struggling but I'll play it by ear.
I love the pillow - I just have a standard BF pillow which would probably be no good now so I may invest in the new one.
At night I often feed as in the slideshow, I just need to really find a technique in a coffee shop, beach or elsewhere as I'm always out and about during the day. I'll definately look into the sling thanks!

Hi Beanigan. My dd was in a Pavlik for 10 weeks, from 8 weeks old onwards. She's been out of it for a couple of months now, all fixed and completely worth it!

Re: breastfeeding, I had absolutely no problems at all, you'll need to get used to how your LO feels in the harness - sort of a "wider unit"(!) so you'll have a leg going up by your armpits but its really no problem at all - in fact I stressed about a lot of things when she was put in the harness, but being able to BF wasn't one of them! Out and about was fine, just fed her in the same position as before the harness, except her legs were in a frogs leg position!

Re: equipment, I think you've already been told Maxi-cosi carseat and moses basket will be fine. DD couldn't fit into the cocoon of our pram (bugaboo bee) but I just used the footmuff instead.

Re: what you should and shouldn't do - have a list of questions ready to ask next week. We were advised the carseat was fine, as was the baby bjorn and that we should do everything "as normal" but you should check what your consultant/physio advises. We were told cloth nappies weren't so good as the rotation of the hip in the pavlik position assists its formation and fixing it with thick nappies (the old way of dealing with clicky hips) wasn't as effective. I expect it doesn't matter too much to be honest.

I found dressing dd the most difficult part as keeping her warm was difficult through the winter months but thankfully you won't have that problem. The harness forms a sort of triangle shape with the straps coming from shoulder to ankle and the thing to remember is that you shouldn't pull the straps in with clothing so anything with a waistband and bodysuit/vests with crotch poppers are out. I also don't think legwarmers/long socks/big tights work for this reason.

So what did she wear?!!! These worked really well for us:

*Babygro one size up but don't fasten the crotch or bottom couple of poppers on the front.

• Dresses that hang loose from the chest in an a-line shape and little socks to keep feet warm (you may get socks attached to the harness but I cut them out so I could clean her toes!)

• As it was winter I used to put the dress/pinafore over the babygro so the babygro looked a bit like tights. (In fact a funky patterned babygro under a plain pinafore looks great and I still sometimes dress dd like that (but without the open crotch now!)

• I covered her nappy with funky nappy covers you get for cloth nappies (so they looked part of her outfit!) Not sure if you can sew but I also bought some frilly knickers nappy covers from John Lewis and cut them down the sides and attached poppers so I could get them on - in fact I'd be happy to post my home-adapted ones to you, they're all age 3-6 months but on the small side. Let me know if you want them.

As you can tell I was a bit hung up about her clothes - it was just before Xmas and we hadn't shown her off to any family so I wanted her to look as normal as possible when she did her meet and greets. I know it's not really important but it was to me. It helped me deal with the whole thing that I couldn't see the harness all the time too.

Also bathing/cleaning. We weren't allowed to bathe or take her out of the Pavlik at all but you just get used to sponging them instead. I'd just advise to be scrupulous about cleaning creases, esp.folds round the groin and knees which are difficult to get to as they can get cheesy and gross and sore.

Like everyone else that's posted I'm more than happy to answer any more questions/share experiences.

Wow thanks herethereand everywhere! what brilliant advice, especially re the clothes.

Looks like I have little to worry about! My DD is getting christened whilst in the harness so I can understand your sentiments regarding looking harnessless for some occasions. Luckily the christening gown we have borrowed is large and has a biggish dress so I can imagine it will be fully covered for the photo's. I'd love the knickers if you're happy to post them. Are you able to contact me on email as yours is blocked? I'm happy to pay for them & postage so just let me know.

I haven't a clue how long she will be in the harness for - do you find out Friday or do they just assess as time goes by? 10 weeks though sounds great as we were initially told 6 months (!)

Yes, happy to email you, how do I get your address? (Is it a whizzy mumsnet thing I don't know about .) Don't worry about paying postage, I can't imagine it'll cost much for a few pairs of baby pants!

Re: how long, I'm sure 6 months is pretty much the maximum so perhaps they were just managing expectations?(unfortunately if it hasn't worked by then they look at other things, but that's v.unusual - Pavlik fixes 90-95% of cases). In our case they scanned after 6 weeks then would have scanned every 4 weeks thereafter. She was still quite dysplasic at the first scan but had a huge growth spurt between that and her next scan which I'm sure helped and after 4 more weeks was completely normal!

DD was in hers for 8 months but I know that that was unusual. Having said that, we had scans and the consultant said "it's working, just slowly we'll keep giving it a chance". DD grew VERY slowly so I think that might have made a difference. I also know that some consultants would have gone for the surgery option we were possibly facing a lot sooner with DD and I'm eternally grateful to our consultant for being patient.

Herethere - if you click on ' Contact poster' on the top of this message - that should work - otherwise I'll just type my email address here if not. cheers!

My nephew was in a Pavlik harness for about 3 months - completley successful.
Soft stretchy trouser bottoms seemed to work fine, and you wouldn't notice unless you looked closely or held him that he was in a harness.
It didn't upset him or disturb him at all when it went on, however there were some sleepless nights when it came off - unused to being able to wriggle he kept waking himself up every time he moved his legs!
The STEPS website is good and has a forum for parents whose children have hip conditions.
Good luck!

Beanigan, just tried that but I need to register and pay £5. Bit knackered for faffing with my credit card now so I'll do it tomorrow, hope that's okay!

herethere just email on [email protected]

Sorry I'm rubbish! Will email now.

Well my DD is now in her harness. Both hip sockets shallow but the right one is also slipping in and out of the socket. All went well, she is absolutely fine and smiled as it went on! And has generally done her usual and has been sleeping 90% of the time, no problem.

I went to a busy park with my DS in the afternoon so my first experience of breast feeding was in the park with me sitting cross legged on the grass and it was no problem - she just lay on her back and twisted her head.

My DD will be in the harness for 16 weeks, with weekly visits to the hospital for scans and readjustment. Thanks everyone for their advice - we're off on our trip today and can forsee no problems whatsoever. In fact she slept better last night than ever!