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Ds not drinking due to ulcers. But ate a yoghurt? Ok? Gp?

(30 Posts)
PavlovtheCat Thu 31-Jan-13 18:31:02

has been poorly thread here to save repeating in detail. But, quickly, had flu type virus. Now has lots of ulcers in mouth, on gums, edges of teeth, inside of cheeks, throat, inside lips which are swollen, gum red raw. Gums bled today when he tried to drink milk through straw.

He is 3yo.

He has barely eaten, hardly being, pretty much nothing, rather than not much, since wed/thurs last week. But has been drinking fine. However since yesterday his drinking liquid has dropped, in the night I woe him to give him a drink as he was licking lips, vv dry. He tried to drink, but it hurt the ulcers on lips and since then he has refused all water, squash and juice.

This morning he had a little bit of runny ready brekky with milk, through a bowl with straw attached and little bit of milk through straw, two mouthfuls of yoghurt - more than for the last week in total!

Lunch - the insides of two munch bunch yoghurt (ie not the whole pot) and a teaspoon of chocolate mousse.

Nothing else. Refusing all liquid. Is this food/milk enough to sustain his liwuid levels? Spoke to gp on phone about it due to bleeding gums. She said she is not concerned about s weight plummeting, but needs to see him tomorrow if he is still not drinking liquids.

How do I know if he is dehydrated before tomorrow? He has pee'd once today, lunch time. Dh sorted it so don't know if very dark. Does he need to be seen before tomorrow?

PavlovtheCat Thu 31-Jan-13 19:05:19

He is extraordinarily irritable. But I would be too if I kept having trifle and chocolate milkshake and ice cream shoved on front of me but could eat it.

seeker Thu 31-Jan-13 19:12:57

Oh,poor boy!

Could you make some frozen milk lollies? Might he be able to lick them? What else could you make lollies out of that wouldn't sting his mouth?

Could you get him to lie down and drip some water into his mouth so it won't touch his lips? Or is he too little to understand that?

Sorry I'm not being helpful....sad

PavlovtheCat Thu 31-Jan-13 19:14:50

Oh that is helpful! I could try the dripping. I think part of the prob with drinking is we had been given him squish as he had thrown up and had high fever so losing liquid through sick and heat, but then last night the sweetness stung I think, so now he won't try again. He won't so lollies. Tried that. Bt maybe an ice cube? We have some of those.

RooneyMara Thu 31-Jan-13 19:15:53

I'd take him tomorrow, keep trying for tonight - if GP said tomorrow then that should be ok I think. If he is very listless and drowsy, then of course ring the OOH tonight but it sounds like he is getting at least a little bit of stuff down.

PavlovtheCat Thu 31-Jan-13 19:20:08

rooney I must sound like a right proper anxious parent eh? He is talking ok, but not walking anywhere. And only ok if he had thomas tank on! He has mastered his tiny pitiful voice to get more thomas though! He has been in the same spot all day, either on my lap or not, but nevertheless the same spot!

SweepTheHalls Thu 31-Jan-13 19:27:34

Try ice lollies, they have helped when mine can't keep fluid down

RooneyMara Thu 31-Jan-13 19:29:17

No more anxious than me, Pav grin I'd be exactly the same. Hope he is a bit better tomorrow x

flossyfloo Thu 31-Jan-13 19:35:17

If you or someone else are able to get to a shop, I would recommend buying some Difflam. It's a spray that numbs the mouth for a little while to allow eating/drinking without pain. It works wonders, starts working quite quickly and can be used fairly regularly making it easier to keep on top of the pain. I know I sound like I have shares in the stuff, but I really rate the stuff!

Chemists definitely sell it over the counter, it's possible large supermarkets do too.

PavlovtheCat Thu 31-Jan-13 19:42:30

flossy pharmacist would not sell it to me, only thing he said I can use is bonjela! Yeah, right! That works, not!

flossyfloo Thu 31-Jan-13 19:52:12

What reason did he give for not selling it to you?

BramblyHedge Thu 31-Jan-13 19:54:12

When I had this I lived on lucozade and complan but I was eleven. I guess he is too young. Apparently mine was blood poisoning and I had it again when I was 19.

dikkertjedap Thu 31-Jan-13 20:31:15

You can buy difflam spray online through ChemistDirect. How much you can use depends on your dc weight.

PavlovtheCat Thu 31-Jan-13 21:49:24

flossy he said he was too young. He said there were not sprays or gels suitable for him other than bonjela. I specifically asked about the spray, as I have used it myself as I am susceptible to huge ulcers on the back of my throat. He was very clear about it.

On the plus side - get this! After moping all day. He got up and played with DD because I told him it was bed time. He asked for something to eat, so I offered him wheatabix with milk, warmed up (loved that as a kid!).

He asked for two!! no way, he isn't going to eat that! but, I gave him two, lots of milk and good spoon of sugar, and mixed it to pulpy runny goo, in his plastic bowl with attached straw - he ate ALL of it!!! pretty much inhaled it with no breath at all, concentration was amazing! He only stopped from time to time so he could bang the table angrily and shout 'stupid bowl!' when a bit of wheatabix got stuck at the bottom of the straw!

He then went quite hot, sleepy, and out like a light within 20 mins!

Thank Fuck for that <sighs with relief>

PavlovtheCat Thu 31-Jan-13 21:52:20

dikker i was tempted to buy the spray for 'me' and see what the directions were, adjust accordingly, even if only once so I could get him eating. But, he has made huge progress by eating more in one go this evening than he has in an entire week, and it was reasonably good for him too! (apart from the ton of sugar I put in it!).

His teeth are so going to need a good clean as soon as I can get a brush in his mouth! I have vaguely tried to gently run a cotton bud around, but there is no way on this earth he is letting me near his mouth to clean it with paste on right now! Should have seen the fuss he made with the bonjela. It sounded like I was harming him!

PavlovtheCat Thu 31-Jan-13 21:56:16

brambly is that right about food poisoning ? interesting because no-one else has had anything like it. We have all had a viral infection, I had couple of days off work with fever and sore throat, but no ulcers and I am prone to them when I get any kind of throat related bug, any time I have had flu (prob 4-5 times over the years) it ends up with a throat infection and this time not, so I thought it must be a different bug? DH has been walloped by a bug, but his was more like mine, but lingered for longer, and stopped in his sinus, DD has had snot and more snot and that's about it! DS copped it good and proper.

Tiggles Thu 31-Jan-13 22:33:20

Are you sure it isn't hand foot and mouth? DS had terrible ulcers with that. GP gave him something for it after out of hours doc gave him wrong medicine and made it worse

flossyfloo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:43:29

Glad he's doing much better this eve. Hopefully he's on the up now.

I can't believe the pharmacist said your DS was too young for Difflam as he most definitely is not. It's a bit scary when you hear of professionals who are meant to know things like this getting it so wrong!

BeaWheesht Thu 31-Jan-13 23:06:50

Pavlov - ds had exact same thing with ulcers after he had what we think was slapped cheek. They were very white with big red rings round them - the closest picture I could find online to describe them to people was when I googled canker sores. They wouldn't give ds anything either - he was 4 - give him calpol they said - think they were missing the bit about him refusing to open his mouth?!

The ulcers lasted a full week but were receding by day 3/4 I think.

BeaWheesht Thu 31-Jan-13 23:06:57

Pavlov - ds had exact same thing with ulcers after he had what we think was slapped cheek. They were very white with big red rings round them - the closest picture I could find online to describe them to people was when I googled canker sores. They wouldn't give ds anything either - he was 4 - give him calpol they said - think they were missing the bit about him refusing to open his mouth?!

The ulcers lasted a full week but were receding by day 3/4 I think.

BeaWheesht Thu 31-Jan-13 23:24:44

This might be of interest - lists possible treatments etc - milk of magnesia is one for example,

PavlovtheCat Fri 01-Feb-13 00:30:32

flossy oh I wish I had spoken to you earlier! poor little mite has been suffering badly! Although he is on the mend I am going to buy some (for me wink) as he still has so many ulcers, they won't disappear by tomorrow. thank you for letting me know.

His symptoms do look similar to hand/foot/mouth, but GP was pretty certain it wasn't on account of it not being anywhere else.

But I have had my doubts, as the symptoms match that of gingivostomatitis which is caused by either herpes simplex (the very first time a child comes into contact with the virus it can manifest in this way apparantly) or cocksackie virus, right down to the bleeding gums. And, although I do suffer from coldsores, I have not had one recently - and DS goes to nursery 3 times a week.

If it is hand, foot and mouth, is it too late for the medication? I am guessing it is anti-viral medication, so probably too late.

Poor thing, even worse to know he might have suffered unecessarily if he could have a) had meds and b) had difflam spray sad

PavlovtheCat Fri 01-Feb-13 00:35:07

oh just read up some more, herpegina is apparantly the cocksackie virus, but only in the mouth - so yes, it probably is HFM virus but just in the mouth. I cannot see what else it can be, and the symptoms are so the same - he had loss of apetite and spiking temp before the ulcers.

And if this is true, then yes, he could have had anti-viral to ease/help him recover more quickly, he was at the docs on Monday sad

It's always the same 'it's a virus, can't help, sorry' sad

PavlovtheCat Fri 01-Feb-13 00:41:25

but he has none on his tongue, most of them are on the gum/teeth line, so it looks like his teeth have receeded with lots of plaque! plus, lots of smaller red/white dots on the insides of his cheeks and back of throat.

I am so glad he has none on his tongue, or else I can't see him eating anything at all! the only reason he eats the yoghurt is because he is licking it off the spoon!

flossyfloo Fri 01-Feb-13 10:13:56

Oh, the poor boy hmm it sounds like he's had a really rough time.
I know it's hard but try not to think what could have been (ie having medication), just look at what you can do for him now. I would def go get some Difflam. It'll have the dosage on there for kids but it's 1 spray per 4kg weight up to max 4 sprays, iirc. Once that works and you can get some fluids and calpol into him, hopefully he'll begin to feel a bit better and get some more energy.

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