Consultant says I won't be 'allowed' an elcs(37 Posts)
I have had two dc- dc1 was born by ventouse after a long labour and was back to bak the whole time. I had an epidural but wasn't a pleasant experience. Dc2 was nearly 3lbs heavier and was also back to back but in a bad position ( think deep transverse arrest was the description used) and I ended up pushing for 90 minutes before having an emcs.
I'm now expecting dc3 and worrying like mad. I talked to my midwife, dh etc and felt that an elcs would be my preferred choice, if not for medical reasons then psychological as I'm truly petrified of the same thing happening again.
However, the consultant doesn't agree and was very dismissive and patronising, saying things like 'when c sections go wrong they really go wrong', ' if you persist with what you want we will listen but still send you on your way way as a reply', 'you gave birth naturally once so you can do it again' and ' if you were to turn up in labour your baby would be just there and a few pushes is all it would take'
The way we left the meeting was for me to go back at 36 weeks and if I am healthy, baby is not too big and in a good position then they will not allow a c section. Having given birth both ways, I am well aware of the risks and consequences of a caeserian section and feel it is the best option for me as it gives me a small sense of control, unlike my previous two births!
Any opinions or thoughts would be much appreciated. I cannot bear the thought of the unknown until my due date
I had the same experience and there were a few options. Appeal, yes it's hard, but you need to stick to your guns. Or switch hospitals if there is another near by. I have 3 that I can choose between but the one I wanted to go to we're strict on sections. I was told I would have no issues at the other hospitals. I was also told if you have had a section there isn't as much intervention they can do due to scar rupture. Also if you don't progress at a good rate they won't leave you hanging around for the same reason. I ended up agreeing that if I was overdue again I could have a section, no induction but if I went into labour naturally I would try but if I didn't progress at 1cm an hour then they would section me. Maybe it's worth getting some guideline built into your birth plan so you can feel more confident and in control
Sorry, forgt about this thread.
I am rather cross about it but mainly glad that I have got my preferred choice and that I didn't have to push for it. Interestingly, before my appt my midwife said that said consultant was very nice and approachable and likely to let me choose so maybe he was having a bad day when I saw him! I haven't the energy to take it any further for now ( I forgot how draining and painful late pregnancy can be!) but it'll be interesting if I see him in the hospital or even if he delivers dc...
Wow, this is my first time reading this thread. Delighted you got sorted and are happy with what's happening.
I still think you were treated appallingly and should make a complaint if you can find the time/energy!
I only had one bad birth experience and had a completely different experience of requesting an ELCS on the NHS. The consultant was so understanding that it was mental health concerns largely driving my request. It's so wrong that women are made to feel so powerless about this. This is your third baby and you knew what you wanted and should have been listened to!!
Good luck with the ELCS, what date are you having the section? I'm having mine on the 10th June :-)
Bloody hell! So they freaked you out and scared you so you would go do some reading up? That never works with my students. Are you awfully cross? I rather think I might be.
I realise this is a zombie thread but thought I'd revisit to say that following my appointment at 36 weeks the consultant readily agreed to a c section. Midwife strongly hinted that he may have tried to put me off at 20 weeks purely so that I would give consideration to all options so in that respect it worked as I did loads more research into vbac. Baby is measuring very big, particularly the head (which was the problem with dc2) so the decision was an easy one to make.
Apologies for the self indulgent update but thought it might help anyone in a similar position. And I'm hAving a baby in a couple of weeks
Thanks again for the replies- I have read them and been mulling them over. I have a long wait until 36 weeks so am going to sit on it for a while before deciding what to do... Dh and I have talked at length about it and I'm now more open to the idea of a natural birth so waiting to see size/position of baby is probably not a bad idea.
This means that consultants advice wasn't incorrect but his manner certainly was. Tbh, I haven't the energy or time to focus on him atm but I havejt forgotten it and may revisit it later in the pregnancy. For now I need to focus on myself and keeping us safe/healthy whilst dealing with lots of other issues going on in my life.
Thanks again for the support, which has been gratefully received
She also reassured me
Did she? You don't sound reassured.
Ask yourself the big question. Did she reassure me?
If she didn't you need more support than this and they HAVE failed you here.
I would be asking for a second opinion if you do feel that way.
I do think this has been badly handled. Even if they do agree to an ELCS it doesn't mean you are committed to it, and maybe simply having someone saying "yes I am listening to your concerns and its an option. We can check things at 36 weeks and if you want to change you mind and go for a VB at that point, thats ok too" might be better for you rather than leaving you depressed and simply dismissing your concerns.
It does just sound like they've patted you on the head and said "There, there, its all going to be fine" and sent you on your way rather than properly listening to you.
NeatFreak that's not much of a surprise that the ordinary midwife fobbed you off. I find her suggestion that you might be depressed
I once read on mumsnet that "before deciding you're depressed, first check you aren't surrounded by arseholes" ... Seems a relevant quote here
Please go back to the start of this thread and read my 4 step plan I posted on 16/02 - and use it to get the birth you want.
If you let them leave you till 36 weeks for a scan then be prepared to be fobbed off with consultants being unavailable etc - by that time they won't have long to wait for nature to take its course and for you to go into labour. And all that after months of stressing about it.
If you want an ELCS then you are going to have to (a) be determined and (b) make sure you talk to more senior staff.
Let us know how you get on. Good luck!
"She also reassured me that if baby looks like it might weigh over 9 pounds they will refer me.back to consultant and won't let me stay in labour for hours- she thinks if.I don't deliver after 30 mins of pushing they will do another emcs."
Oh how fucking wonderful.
They are going to put your health and your baby's health at risk knowing you are likely to end up with a section anyway.
No wonder you are depressed if this is how people responsible for your care are treating you.
An elective section is a world away from emergency surgery carried out in labour in terms of how you feel afterwards.
Get yourself another consultant.
I'm sorry but I really wouldn't be happy with what the midwife has said , ask for a referral to a different consultant and tell them you want a section . I think its a mistake to leave it and it needs dealing with now , you have rights please stand up for them .
Not much to add since meeting my.midwife... She was a little shocked by what consultant said but thinks he may be right.
She is going to take regular measurements and if baby looks big then will make sure I have a scan before seeing him at 36 weeks. She also reassured me that if baby looks like it might weigh over 9 pounds they will refer me.back to consultant and won't let me stay in labour for hours- she thinks if.I don't deliver after 30 mins of pushing they will do another emcs.
Am slightly disappointed in the outcome.but not sure what I really wanted from it. I am going to wait and see how big baby gets. To add to my misery my back/pelvis pain is getting much worse and midwife is concerned I 'may be depressed' so I think I have to just focus on one day at a time and worry about the birth closer to 36 weeks.
Sorry for the long post and thanks for all the advice
What blondieminx said. This is not acceptable.
Don't wait til 36 weeks - ask for an appt asap with the consultant mw, or supervisor of mws, and put your concerns in writing.
What an awful, dismissive and patronising way to treat a woman with your birth history (or any woman).
Not much to add Neat but to say elective sections are always safer than emergencies and have been proven in (massive, well organised trials) that they are the safest mode of delivery the baby.
There are slightly increased risks for mum but that is compared to natural straight forward baby falling out birth which none of us can guarantee.
When sections go wrong they were almost always emergencies.
Thanks again for all the responses. I am seeing my midwife on Wednesday so fingers crossed she has some suggestions..
Please request another consultant and complain about how the one you have currently made you feel. It really isn't acceptable. I had an EMCS with DS1 and had a horrible pg and lead up to labour where even with multiple attempts at induction, syntocin drip and a very chilled out me, I failed to progress past 7cms, with the MW telling me I wasn't dilating evenly.
When I fell pg with DS2 my consultant wasn't available so I saw someone working under his tutelage when I was 16 weeks pg. She repeatedly told me that 60% of women who had VBACs go on to give birth successfully and I would probably be one of those, even though I told her that I wanted an ELCS for a variety of reasons (mental health, pre-existing health problem, previous birth). My local MW told me I probably wouldn't get an ELCS. At about 30 weeks I saw another person working with my consultant, and she said I'd probably give birth successfully and I'd be fine, again, with me protesting especially as I was suffering with a fibromyalgia flare up at the time.
Cue meeting my consultant for the first time not five minutes later. He listened to my account of my last birth, my problems in this pg and said based on what I had said he saw no reason not to schedule a c-section. I was so relieved that someone had actually listened to me, rather than just quoting statistics or smiling and nodding and not actually listening to me whilst they spout out their opinion, that I burst into tears.
Please don't leave it as long as I did, it was horrible having it drag on. Others have given better advice - I've waffled on quite a bit actually....sorry! I just wanted to let you know my experience so you felt a bit more hopeful - some consultants get a bit blasé about everything, but you don't have to put up with it. Good luck!
How did your MW appt go, NeatFreak?
Just be clear with them!
"scans and estimates don't provide me with any reassurance because of my past experiences - dc2 was estimated to be a pound heavier than dc1 but it was closer to 3 pounds... And I had a scary labour which ended in an EMCS. My choice is to elect this time around, and having been through it once before (though not in the calm circumstances of an elective!) I am fully aware of what to expect. I would like to go ahead and get a date booked in now, please".
The consultant didn't have my previous notes and seemed to rely on what I told him ( to be fair I guess he might have read them before seeing me). I'm sure there is every chance I could deliver naturally but I can't cope with the uncertainty. Apart from anything else, they estimated dc2 to be 1lb heavier than number 1 when it was closer to 3lbs so I don't think extra scans or reassurance will make much impact on me (fussy and hard to please, me?!)
Just to add I would make it clear you want to see another consultant now - not at 36 wks.
Tell your midwife he has left you anxious and panicky about the birth.
I walked into my 28wk app prepared to be assertive, I told them point blank that my mental and emotional state relied on having an ELCS as there was no way I could go through another birth like DS1 - it was booked for me.
I had previously had various midwives and consultants tell me I would be fine despite never seeing my previous notes
Complain, OP, and insist on seeing another consultant for a second opinion. Also you could ask him to put the reasons for his decision in writing.
You poor thing and what a complete tosser. COMPLAIN! Also gather some evidence regarding VBAC's, as it will show you have made an informed decision (not that you haven't of course already, just adding to your ammunition).
I ended up having an emcs after a failed epidural and back to back / ventouse . forceps attempts with DS1. I said from the off I wanted a ELCS with DS2. Only once was I "gently persuaded" by a registrar on the ward during a false alarm that I was a great candidate for a VBAC. I said thanks, but no thanks, and they listened, thankfully.
Wishing you lots of luck
Well he might have been right in that your third is likely to just fall out when you sneeze (mine did), and if you plan well, avoid interventions and give birth at home it coukd be a piece of cake. But to increase your chances of this, your mind has to be at peace and confident. No chance whilst you feel out of control and bullied.
Thank you, I have been doubting myself and wondering if he was right but I am now sure my gut instinct was correct. I will speak to my midwife this week and get some advice.
This happened to me. I wanted a section for various medical reasons, and was told NO! In the end, I begged for an induction as I was in so much physical pain I literally feared for my own MH. I was induced three times, no results. Begged for a section again, still told NO. And that I would have to go through the induction process again. Again, I was in a total state, and wasn't coping at all with any of it. After a further 2 failed inductions, I was given a section. If only they had listened to me in the first place. I'm still not quite over it all, but have a wonderful Dd.
Please please, seek another consultant. NO women should be forced in to a delivery they don't want.
I was told there was no need for me to have an ELCS following a horrible 3rd degree tear by an arsey consultant at 36 weeks having been offered one by her registrar at my 12 week scan. I was so shocked at the last minute change of attitude that I said "if you tell me I cannot have a c section that is fine. But I will have you know that if I or my baby suffers any injury that could have been avoided by a c section I will. sue. And I am a personal injury solicitor."
She glared at me and reached for the booking diary.
Complain complain complain.
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