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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Going dairy free

46 replies

JudysDreamHorse · 01/03/2011 21:16

Hello. Was wondering if anyone could offer advice on going dairy free and/or point me in the direction of any useful advice. I have a 5 month old (today!) DS who has silent reflux which is pretty much under control with infant gaviscon. He is EBF and also has eczema. He is a terrible sleeper though - always has been difficult to settle but at 15 weeks started waking more frequently and now wakes every 1-2 hours. Have been putting it down to sleep regression but in the past week 3 people have suggested trying to go dairy free.
The refux symptoms which have pretty much gone now were:

  • sometimes stopping feeding abruptly and started to scream
  • very disturbed night time sleep - could hear him vomiting in throat and swallowing accompanied with thrashing around
  • dry cough
  • always poo'ed while feeding (think this is one - now poos when taking his gaviscon)
He was quite a screamy baby up until a few weeks ago and he is normally quite manic and generally is kicking his legs around. He also has green poo a lot of the time (more than half I would say). His weight has always been fine and he feeds well - is a bit of a comfort sucker at times (this too has got better). Anyway, sorry if this is TMI but would be really interested in knowing if anyone thinks it is worth me going dairy free to see if it helps and if so how to do it. I asked the GP and she said to cut down on dairy and see if it helps but have also been told that you need to be completely dairy free for at least 2 weeks. I'm at my wits end with the sleep issues but when awake he seems like a happy contented baby during the day. Life is just quite difficult at the moment and I'm not convinced dairy is behind the sleep problems. I am willing to try anything but it to go completely dairy free seems quite daunting - am struggling to eat properly during the day so would really appreciate if someone could direct me to info on how to do it. Thanks and sorry for the essay!
OP posts:
iris66 · 01/03/2011 21:35

I had to go dairy free with my DS1 for a similar reason. He is 5 now and still very sensitive to cow (in all forms!) - but can now tolerate red meat, fruit, tomatoes and eggs - which he couldn't before) If your GP has advised it then it's worth a shot but it is quite hard at first if you normally eat a lot of dairy. I'm sure there are loads of others with advice but some alternatives you could consider are:

Manchego (spanish sheeps cheese - a bit like cheddar - often cheap in markets/expensive in supermarkets) hard goats cheese isn't too bad but can be a bit tangy. Buffallo mozzarella is ok too

Soya milk or goats milk (with calcium - you're bf/ you need it)...unsweetened soya milk tastes like cardboard though)

lamb mince instead of beef (I underestimated DS' sensitivity to cow, so until I removed all cow products from my diet there was no massive difference)

Normal biscuits/cakes are a nightmare, as are all sauces - there's milk/lactose in almost everything Sad Look for Freefrom products.

It's a case of reading labels everywhere and being really vigilant. It WILL pay off Smile good luck

JudysDreamHorse · 01/03/2011 21:44

Thanks for reply - really useful. I suggested it to gp and her response was more along the lines of if you really want to go ahead but don't bother going the whole hog IYSWIM. I thought this wasn't right though and potentially pointless. Hadn't even thought about beef. Guess it might help shift the baby weight if nothing else if I can't have cake but don't want to cut down too much because of bf.

OP posts:
SpeedyGonzalez · 01/03/2011 21:50

Definitely cut OUT dairy. Your GP doesn't know what she's talking about. You need tO get all the dairy out of your system.

I am also bf a baby with silent reflux/ milk allergy, and it's all going well with dietary stuff. Am tired and about to log off but feel free to pm me if you need advice. And make your local health food shop your friend! Grin

Good luck.

SpeedyGonzalez · 01/03/2011 21:52

Great website: cryingoverspiltmilk.nz

Grin
TimeWasting · 01/03/2011 21:52

I cut out most dairy when feeding DS and it did seem to make a difference to him. Wish I'd heard of silent reflux though, might have been able to get hims some more help.
I didn't actually cut everything out, just the obviouss and that was enough to chill him out and get him putting weight on etc.
Just getting rid of the obvious milk, yoghurts, cheese etc. is pretty simple and then you can get to grips with the hidden dairy in everything.
The Vegan Society produce a book called the Animal free shopper which might be of help as it lists many foods that contain no dairy (or any other animal produce).

japhrimel · 01/03/2011 21:54

If you try soya milk (I know some people say avoid soya too) try different brands/varieties as they vary a lot.

JudysDreamHorse · 02/03/2011 11:07

Thanks everyone. Seems like I should give it a try. We've both got rotten colds so will wait until that has cleared - will give me a chance to get some dairy free food in.
Thanks for the pm offer speedy might take you up on it if I get stuck.

OP posts:
iris66 · 02/03/2011 11:35

dairy is really mucous forming so if you started it now it will help your colds too! Smile

Pidgin · 02/03/2011 16:33

Judys sorry to hijack but that sounds really interesting - my DS has all those symptoms, although the cough is only occasional. I had not thought of silent reflux. Do you get infant gaviscon from gp? Any other tips re diagnosis/ treatment? Good luck with going dairy-free, hope it works for you.

JudysDreamHorse · 02/03/2011 17:10

Hello Pidgin. Yes I got infant gaviscon from the GP. I know some are meant to be sceptical about the whole concept of silent reflux but mine was really good. As you know from the sleep threads it hasn't helped much in that area though would say his sleep is more peaceful since he's been on it - he used to writhe around and moan a lot. I think he's a calmer baby all round as well.

OP posts:
blimey · 03/03/2011 20:56

going dairy free really helped my DS3, I had to give up goats and sheeps cheese as well - ALL dairy not just cows. I really like oat milk - and still use loads of it. I missed cheese most of all. As he got older I have been able to reintroduce dairy to my diet. I could see a dose response relationship at different points eg around 18 months one latte was ok but 2 was not!
if it works you really will see a difference after 2 weeks. I think it is deffo worth the effort - it is not forever!

trixymalixy · 03/03/2011 21:02

Judy, your DS sounds exactly like mine, in particulate the stopping feeding to scream. He did have a severe dairy allergy and also allergies to eggs , soya and legumes.

Cutting out dairy helped almost instantly for DS.

I would also avoid goat and sheep cheese.

Oatly is quite good as a milk substitute and pure and vitalite good butter substitutes.

If you do a search there have been plenty of other threads with diet suggestions b

trixymalixy · 03/03/2011 21:04

FWIW I was dairy free for over 3 years, and although daunting it does become second nature.

cardamomginger · 03/03/2011 23:22

I am lactose intolerant and whilst it is a hell of a faff at the beginning it is not that bad. As trixy said, after a while it becomes second nature. My baby is CMP allergic and I don't think that just cutting down would do any good - you need to be completely dairy-free. I was told it takes about 4 weeks for all milk to wash out of your system. I was also told to avoid soya milk, yoghurts, etc as this can also trigger a reaction is a CMP sensitive baby. Be aware of hidden dairy products in things like margarines, cakes, biscuits - all processed foods really. Even processed meats can have milk products in them. Make sure you keep your calcium up. Good luck!

BonfireBaby · 04/03/2011 04:11

Hi I'm very interested in all of this as my 4 mo twins were diagnosed with a lactose intolerance at start of the year but paediatrician told me not to cut out dairy from my diet (I am bf). However saw nutritionist at hospital yesterday and she said that I should actually have removed it but that there's no point now! I'm confused about what to do but reading this post, mine also have mild ecxma, have had a cough for a few weeks and do green poos ( didn't even know that was an issue). What do you all think and sorry to hijack?!

cardamomginger · 04/03/2011 08:55

Sounds a familiar picture bonfire. I am confused as to why the nutritionist said there's no point cutting dairy from your diet now. If your child is intolerant/allergic to cows' milk for as long as you are still BF if you have dairy (and probably soya) in your diet this will transmit to DC and will be a problem. Yes, it will take about 4 weeks to clear out of your system completely. So the only explanation I can see is if they assume that you will stop BF in around 4 weeks time. Have they given you any advice over dairy-free weaning? And if you are planning to stop BF soon have they given any advice about milk-free formula? My DD is cows' milk protein allergic and it was on the basis of this that I was told to cut dairy and soya from my diet. Maybe lactose intolerance in a baby is different and things don't transmit through breast milk in the same way? But that doesn't make sense, does it? Cos the nutritionist said you should have been cutting dairy out? Sorry - rambling. DD has been up since 5.... If I were you, I'd cut dairy and soya out from my diet, and press for advice re dairy-free weaning (and formula if you are planning to introduce this at any stage). Good luck!

JudysDreamHorse · 04/03/2011 08:59

Thanks for the messages again. Sorry - not checked this thread since I last posted.
I stopped taking dairy on Wednesday lunchtime ( was inspired by iris66 and the mucous comment to just go for it!). I'm using soya milk in tea but have bought some oat milk as well. I also made a batch of date and oat bars with some sort of vegetable baking fat stuff so I wouldn't be tempted to go for the chocolate biscuits (had DH home for a day so made the most of it).
DS has slept slightly better the first night but I put it down to coincidence as had only stopped for about 8 hours before he went to bed. He slept even better again last night - still not amazing but a real noticable difference. Could it have had an effect already? Thanks again for the advice - feel bad now I didn't do this sooner.

OP posts:
JudysDreamHorse · 04/03/2011 09:03

One more question if you all don't mind. If I do find that going dairy free makes a difference what is the next step? Should I ask my GP for a referral? Thanks.

OP posts:
TruthSweet · 04/03/2011 09:26

bonfire - if your babies have lactose intolerance then how are you bfing them? BM has lactose in it. Could the paed. have said cow's milk protein allergy? Lactose intolerance is very rare in babies and is normally diagnosed with in days of birth.

Cows' milk protein allergy on the other hand is relatively common in atopic children (excema/asthma/hay fever/allegies).

iris66 · 04/03/2011 09:34

on the basis of advice from other threads I asked my GP for a referral to Dr George DuToit at Guys & St Thomas' in London (they have a fab allergy clinic - as does Bristol childrens' hospital) he was more than happy to pass us on as allergy isn't an exact science. HTH Smile

cardamomginger · 04/03/2011 09:36

George is fab! We see him too Grin.

BonfireBaby · 04/03/2011 09:49

The paed had originally said lactose intolerance but then yesterday nutritionist said cows milk allergy so I was confused as to which was the case. I met with her yesterday to discuss dairy free weaning and the babies are already on nutramigen for their evening formula top ups. Sorry I missed a few key points as was a bit tired! If anyone would like some info on dairy free weaning then let me know as I got some leaflets yesterday. I think I'm going to cut out dairy myself to see what happens, I just wish I had done so from the start! Good luck with your own diets. Oh lastly, do we need to take calcium supplements?

cardamomginger · 04/03/2011 09:55

watch the nutramigen - this is still cows' milk based and for a few kids it's still enough to trigger a reaction. a lot are fine on nutramigen, and hopefully yours will be too. so if after a while things still seem wrong, go back. there are other formulas, e.g. neocate that may help. yeah - cut out dairy! no idea about calcium for you - not going to do any harm. your dcs should get enough from your breast milk and any formula will be formulated to include whatever minerals etc they need. might not be a bad idea to press for a referral to a paed allergist as well. what with the eczema and the cmp allergy you never know what else might be lurking. hopefully everything will be fine but the waiting lists can be long, so better to get the ball rolling sooner rather than later.

SpeedyGonzalez · 04/03/2011 14:22

Haven't read rest of the thread but just wanted to present my views on soya.

I've used soya for years but when I'm pregnant or bfing I avoid it as much as possible - from certain sources. I've also discussed this with a dietitian, who agreed with me.

Soya contains high levels of phytoestrogens, which, in the body, mock human oestrogens and upset the hormonal balance. (This, btw, can be redressed by increasing your intake of lentils, mung beans and dark green leafy veg - all of which help your body to clear out the extra hormones)

Eastern soya products (tofu, miso, etc) are fine - they are fermented for months and so the phytoestrogens are removed by this long fermentation process. Western soya products (milk, cream, soya mince, etc) are only fermented for a short time and so the phytoestrogens remain in high volume.

Soya is present in a huge range of foods - it's estimated that up to 70% of what we consume contains soya - check the labels of cakes, biscuits, just about anything. 'Textured vegetable protein' is one of the terms used to describe it on ingredient lists. Soya flour is another form. It's cheap and good for bulking out food mixes. It's also present in much animal feed - so when we eat non-organic meat (and possibly organic meat?) we are eating yet more non-fermented soya.

My theory is that the rise of unexplained infertility in this country could be explained by the high levels of soya oestrogens we're unwittingly ingesting. This can then get passed to the baby through breastmilk/ in utero. And could, IMO, affect their fertility.

You can increase your calcium by eating foods such as tofu (well-fermented!), tinned sardines (with skin and bones intact), fortified oat milk, almonds/ almond milk, nuts and seeds, whole grains and fortified cereals. Do ask for a referral to a dietitian and they'll be able to help - calcium intake is essential for women, especially breastfeeding women, because of the risk of osteoporosis. As the bf mother of a dairy-free baby you may need special support.

iris66 · 04/03/2011 17:39

brilliant post speedygonzalez Smile it's a little known "risk" isn't it. Though since I'm hurtling towards menopause (and now not bf) I've upped my intake of soya Wink