Mumsnet Talk

My ds2 (2 years) will not stay in his bed when he goes up in the evening.
He's been in a bed now for about 6 months (climbed out of cot!) but still does not settle on his own.
I'm finding it really frustrating as my dd and ds1 never did this, they were angels at sleeping.
I have tried many different things, the only one that works is sitting with him until he's asleep, but I hate that - don't have time for the others then.
We have now been trying the 'rapid return' tecnique for over 2 weeks, still with the same outcome, sometimes only 10 mins of returning, sometimes an hour!
Has anyone had any success with this or can recommend something else to try.
He also shares with ds1 so is making him late to bed or disturbing him going to sleep.
Please help, it's driving me mad!

Where did he sleep before? I'd be tempted to put a stair gate over the room and let him shout til he realises he'll be ignored.

Difficult if DS1 needs to go to the loo though.

He had a stair gate but just kicked it until it fell down. (Ds1 can open them for loo if need be).
So we just have a stair gate at the top of the stairs.
We used to leave him to it, but he'd cry at the gate for up to an hour, then fall asleep on the floor!

Hi Trinaj,

wow, you sound just as i did 6 months ago!! my second DD never slept well either. we tried everything from sleeping with, ignoring her etc but never got anywhere. following the birth of DS my DD2 got even worse. at the time my eldest and my baby slept all night but middle one was awful. i eventually seeked help from hv who lookily was sleep behavioural specialist. she told us that we were making bed time a 'big deal' drawing lots of attention to the behaviour DD2 was doing. therefore the harder DD2 was at bedtime the more attention created- eg me and DH talking or even shouting about it, other people asking how she slept because i had discussed how hard bedtime was. basically if you praise your little one for how good he is going to bed and how great he is for sleeping just like his siblings he will respond to that attention. any unwanted bedtime behaviour needs to draw no attention at all. hope this makes sense?!

can dh take over sitting with her till she falls asleep?
dd is 2.3 and I can choose a) sitting for 20min in a dim room with music playing or b) 2h of attempting to cook / watch tv / etc whilst constantly running up and downstairs to a howling banshee...

Mrs Badger - I share bedtime routines with dh, so either of us could sit with him, but i just don't want to get into the habit of that, I've never done it with the others, and when do you draw the line and stop doing it?
CZK- I agree it's very attention seeking and he's always worse if people are up and down stairs or talking upstairs.
But I think he's coming back for the attention now - despite the fact we don't talk to him, just put him back to bed - He's started stalling tactics - asking for the toilet when he's only been 5 mins before, asking for hugs, saying he wants a drink etc...
How long did it take to get your dd2 to stay in bed (most nights)? Wondering if time is my only saviour?

hi again,
to be honest, it was solved within a week with my DD2! we also had the getting out of bed, delaying tactics etc but if you make it all 'no big deal' and not really bat an eye lid if he asks for toilet, drink etc. He is doing these things to get a reaction from you! if you dont react and the only reaction you give bedtime is positive such as 'you are such a clever boy lying in your bed' or in the morning say ' how fantastic are you at sleeping- can you teach me how to sleep that well?!' etc he will rise to your expectation. at the moment he knows that everyone thinks he doesnt go to bed well and it causes a lot of attention to it so he will continue this. It may not help that he knows your other child cant go to bed unless he is asleep?
we set some rules between my DH and myself for DD2's bedtime so we would not need to discuss anything in front of her but so that we were working on same team! eg, if she asks for any food or drink after we have read story then we simply say no not till morning. at first she paddied but once she knew that was the rule she hasnt challenged again! if she wondered downstairs with some excuse like needing me or had tummy ache or something else i just used to say 'hello sweetheart are you ok?' then 'ok just sit still on the carpet for few mins then it will be better and you can go get back into your bed.' i would just carry on my evening with DH or jobs etc as if she were in bed. no attention for being downstairs. if she got up to play with toys i used to just say gently 'no no toys are for tomorrow now.' she soon got fed up of nothing to do and no attention! in fact she sleeps the best in our family now....asleep for 7 and most mornings i have to wake her at 8!
sorry this is little rushed but wanted to reply as will be out most of weekend
CZK

Perhaps you could put him to be last?
Put DS1 to bed in the usual manner, but with toddler in tow, then take the toddler to bed and stay with him.

Do you have an MP3 player? Listen to something good while you are waiting for him to drop off.

We still stay with our three-year-old until he's asleep. It's nice and snuggley.

I put DS2 (20 months) to bed already asleep.

Thank you CZK - that's exactly how I mean.
My only gripe is that we're now into the 4th week, and although the time is getting shorter, it still goes on.
We can now put ds1 to bed with him and ds2 seems to ignore him if he's awake still.
But everyone I've spoken to or ever seen do this has only ever taken about a week, then it's all ok.
Hopefully we'll get there in the end.

This is still driving me potty - into 5th week, thought it would have been sorted by now!
He still sleeps during the day for only 1hr. Problem is he sometimes is very late going to sleep during the day - because he won't go down earlier - which means he's not as tired at bedtime. And I wonder if this is the problem?
We've tried him not sleeping after lunch but then he falls asleep about 3 - 4pm, which is far too late.
I'm getting very frustrated about this now, and think I may have to speak to my health visitor.
Any other advice or support would be gratefully received.

Some children just suffer more with separation anxiety than others. I never had to sit with my Ds, because he didn't need me to.

I sit with my Dd, because, like Mrs Badger, it is worth the increasingly short ammount of time, sitting reading my book in her room, rather thatn the drawn out upset that is otherwise bedtime.

Also, I think you are right, 3-4pm nap time is too late, my dd is 2 and has trouble falling asleep if she's slept too late in the afternoon.